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Insulin to carbs or carbs to insulin

Discussion in 'Type 1 Diabetes' started by JAT1, Jan 20, 2019.

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  1. Japes

    Japes LADA · Well-Known Member

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    I have been experimenting with different levels of carbs for a couple of months or so and will be interested to see what this week's Hba1c comes out as.

    When I was in the mis-diagnosed Type 2 days, I was very low carb and enjoyed it. Until it was no longer working because, well, it couldn't.

    I mostly tend to more carbs on more active days, fewer carbs on less active days, with potatoes and more fruit being the "Welcome back to my life, I've really missed you" carbs. Grains and rice continue to be experimental but I don't avoid them totally. Some toast is also very welcome...
     
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  2. JAT1

    JAT1 Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for your advice Scott. I will pay more attention to what type is posting.
     
  3. kitedoc

    kitedoc Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Exactly my point. Thank you.
     
  4. JAT1

    JAT1 Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    I'm T1 (not sure why it doesn't say that on my avatar). I use 4 units Basaglar once a day and 4 units Novorapid before lunch and 4 units Novorapid before dinner. I was originally prescribed 6 units each, nothing before breakfast because on waking my readings were too low. I have occasionally done correction doses but I'm afraid of stacking which happened to me once and never again. So I eat 40 grams carbs at lunch and 40 at dinner so I use the insulin.
     
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  5. DCUKMod

    DCUKMod I reversed my Type 2 · Master
    Staff Member Administrator

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    JAT1 - For your avatar to dislay your type of diabetes, you eed to add it to your profile. You can do that from your account settings, by clicking on your user name at the top right of your screen. This has to be done on yourr browser, not the app.

    If you're not sure about it, I can change it for me, if you tag me in a post and let me know.
     
  6. JAT1

    JAT1 Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    At first, even though I was following the doctor's prescription, my BS was skyrocketing and by metering before the meal and 2 hours after I realized who all the culprits were. Dr Bernstein has been a huge influence on me, so I have wanted to stay with low doses of insulin. At times I have been as low as 3 units but my BS resulted too high. I don't count carbs first and then decide how much to take because that's not how the endo prescribed (I'm suspicious of her but still uncertain to just totally go my own way) so I take my dose and then eat the amount of carbs I need (I noticed that my insulin to carb ration is 1:10) In between meals I only eat cheese. I don't meter often any more because it's too expensive for my budget. I eat fruit before exercise and before bed and during the night because I will wake up feeling awful and I don't have the energy to meter. After a bit of fruit I always feel so much better.
     
  7. Antje77

    Antje77 LADA · Moderator
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    What country are you in?
     
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  8. JAT1

    JAT1 Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    I'm enjoy my diet and don't miss starch one bit. It's that I'm suspicious of the long term effects of insulin (I know it's a life saver but I still have that feeling.) I hate meds of all types even pain killers as I am convinced that in the long run they cause more damage than good. Your comment about bread hits home because that used to be one of my hobbies - making homemade bread, but now I'm afraid of it. The side effects of high sugars freak me right out, especially blindness.
     
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  9. JAT1

    JAT1 Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Alberta, Canada
     
  10. Antje77

    Antje77 LADA · Moderator
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    Don't you get test strips in Canada as a T1? Stupid.
    Non diabetics have insulin, it's just that their own body produces it. Very different from most other medicins in my opinion.
     
  11. RickyCantrell

    RickyCantrell · Member

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    With my meals I carb count whatever is in my meal, I use an app on my android called carbs and cals it's a cheap app where you can look up different meals and choose the portion of food you are having. And also you can customize your own meals to make life a little easier in the future. However, when I went on my diabetes course at the beginning I was told to do 1 unit of insulin per 10g of carbs but then everyone is different. Then test write it down in a little diary then inject my needed insulin does.
     
  12. kitedoc

    kitedoc Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Hi @RickyCantrell, Just to know that some of us find that the ratio differs depending on the time of day.
    Breakfast often seems to requires more insulin per gram ( = i unit for less g), compared to say lunch or evening.
     
  13. RickyCantrell

    RickyCantrell · Member

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    Yeah I'm the same in a morning
     
  14. Diakat

    Diakat Type 1 · Expert
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    @JAT1 there are lots of lower carb recipes to try for bread. Experimenting with these may help you keep your bread making hobby and meet a dietary need? Good luck.
     
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  15. becca59

    becca59 Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    @JAT1 obviously you are on a routine for insulin devised between yourself and your health professional and that is for you to decide. However, you are fearful of taking too much insulin and want to have lower carbs. By taking a fixed amount at each meal you are then having to eat that amount of carbs. Which to me seems the wrong way round. If I’m not hungry later in the day I take no insulin and eat no carbs. Other days I eat a lot more and therefore take more insulin. It results in a more relaxed life. Maybe discuss carb counting with your health professional.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
    #35 becca59, Jan 22, 2019 at 7:51 AM
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2019
  16. kitedoc

    kitedoc Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    But also @JAT1 you profess a concern about the insulin you inject. So you are concerned about too many carbs and resultant high BSLs but also trying to not have more insulin than you need to because you are concerned about its long term effects.
    The amount of insulin I need for my carbs in the morning is a different ratio than what works best for me in the evening.
    Most people find they need more insulin per gram of carb in the morning than later on.
    Purely as an example: ratio say of 1 unit of short acting insulin to say 6 g or 7 g carbs (rather than to 10 g carbs) before breakfast and say one unit of same insulin to say 8 g carbs at night. Note that 1: 6 ratio is greater than 1:10 ratio.
    If your endo looks after T1Ds on insulin pumps she will know this. It does not make sense then to leave you on a fixed ratio but that is just my query and you would need to query her on why you should be on a fixed ratio but not somebody on a insulin pump when the principles is very similar.
    So staying with an invariable insulin to carb ratio throughout 24 hours is inflexible and likely to lead to mismatches.
    If you wish to do low carb and keep insulin doses low why not explore Dr Bernstein's book and ask you endo to read it.
    Then you and she can discuss what your aims are, make allowances for perhaps being on some different insulins.
    A word of caution: I am not sure how dietitians in Canada feel about low carb diets and whether any resultant antipathy has spilled over into the endo and GP ranks. Let her know that the ADA is giving more credence to low carb diets than in the past and that the NHS has embraced them for T2Ds .
    You have been pointed towards and given low carb recipes to make low carb diets easier to do.
    Grasp the nettle for the future !! And Best Wishes.
    This aeroplane is based on a rotor kite. The wings rotate with the breeze and create lift.
    I am not sure if the rotations are exactly the same speed but if they are not, maybe their insulin to carb ratios are different too!!
    P4040218 (1).jpg
     
  17. jillsymes66

    jillsymes66 Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    I match my insulin to the carbs I eat and since eating keto since Jan 2018 maybe just 2 or 3 units and sometimes none. I eat less than 19g carbs a day, have about 71g protein and up to 120g healthy fat. This ratio seems to suit me.
    I did alot of research before I went so low carb and took magnesium and multivitamin supplements plus a cocktail of salts to combat keto flu and that worked for me. I have lost 50lb my hbA1c is 5.8 and I feel fantastic. The biggest woohoo moment for me was going back to the gym after 18mths and going on the bodytrax machine and finding my metabolic age had gone from 62 to 40! I'm 52!! So that was fab. I have recently been set up with a Libre Freestyle sensor by my diabetic team and find my readings consistantly in the 5-6 range so I'm happy with that.
     
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  18. michita

    michita Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    That's amazing. :) Can I ask if you have to bolus for protein ? Do you count protein as well as carbs ?
     
  19. jillsymes66

    jillsymes66 Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    No I don't bolus for protein as a rule. If I notice my readings creeping up after a no carb meal I will have a unit or two but I don't preempt this. I also use mysugr to log my readings and this gives me the amount of insulin to take but it did take a while to get the insulin/carb ratio perfect for me.
     
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  20. michita

    michita Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Thank you ! I also low carb and also don't count protein (or carbs). I inject anything between 1 to 2.5 units for a meal depending on pre-meal bs level and what I eat and how much. I feel my normal 2 units are a bit high but maybe its covering the rise from protein but I'll never know.
     
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