1. Get the Diabetes Forum App for your phone - available on iOS and Android.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Guest, we'd love to know what you think about the forum! Take the Diabetes Forum Survey 2021 »
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Diabetes Forum should not be used in an emergency and does not replace your healthcare professional relationship. Posts can be seen by the public.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Guest, stay home, stay safe, save the NHS. Stay up to date with information about keeping yourself and people around you safe here and GOV.UK: Coronavirus (COVID-19). Think you have symptoms? NHS 111 service is available here.
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
Find support, ask questions and share your experiences. Join the community »

Is it really over?

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by Lamont D, Aug 25, 2021.

  1. Lamont D

    Lamont D Reactive hypoglycemia · Master

    Messages:
    12,944
    Likes Received:
    15,874
    Trophy Points:
    298
    What is happening?
    What is the latest about covid?
    Where have the reports that dominated the headlines gone?
    Even asking ministers on television, not one of them mentioned covid.

    Has Boris declared in a bill that we are not to talk about infection rates or deaths?
    Where is the next slide?
    Where are the scientists to tell us we are all doomed.

    Does it mean that if it's not in the media, unless it's someone from Love Island, we ignore it and carry on as we should do?
    What is going to happen to all those that will lose jobs when furlough finishes?
    What will happen to all the businesses that have relied on government handouts to survive?
    What happens when the tenth wave occurs again in November to February?

    Is it all over?
    Where is all the government propaganda describing how great they were to be (not in my words) the best in the world at dealing with the pandemic?
    Is the pandemic over?
    Has it been downgraded to green, so we can go on holiday? Just like Dominic Raab?
    Oh, hang on, his department, head of holidays so to speak recommending staycation instead of going abroad?
    Is it again do as I say, not what I do?
    Is it one rule for the elite and one for us subjects?
    General question!
    How much more is this government, a group of space cadets, (not on this planet) going to get away with the absurd dogma of libertine policies? and have had to u-turn, because it is not what our country wants or needs after nearly two years of covid and over a decade of austerity.
    It's going to be cut, cut, cut all over again. That will be a disaster on a scale we haven't witnessed for over a century.
    There are so many areas of our population and how we live that is not getting the millions out of poverty, or teenagers jobs, an actual living wage so we can close all the thousands of food banks. Minimum wage, zero hour contracts, part time, rights for every one, a fairer tax system and so on. Justice and democracy and wages that will improve life in this country. Housing, social care, NHS, local government, social services, a safety net for those unfortunate enough, such as the disabled, OAPs, mental issues, and of course the jobless.
    There will be a lot of school leavers in the past two years and in the next two years who will never be in employment. This happened before under the Tories.
    The damning thing after all this, is, our government is able to throw money around and rightly so during the pandemic because we were again wanting logistics to ensure we didn't have people dying in crowded hospitals.
    So many reasons why, we did not heed the warning and according to Boris in March '20, that we are open for business and he will shake everybody's hand!
    This money has been loaned at a very, very low rate of interest. It has been borrowed by the bank of England, which has printed the cash to dole out to whoever gets the grace and favour of ministers.
    Accordingly, this money , which was on this golden tree at the behest of ministers. Will have to be paid back to those who did the loaning. But the one bank that is owned by the government of the UK or is beholden to government whims, is the bank of England.
    It may be not wise to do so, but in the past, countries have had their debts cleared by the loans due to the bank of England. When it is over our national debt is gonna be higher than our gross national income. Which is not the recommended role of government. We will never pay that back, because the debt amount is growing, we have to get it below but tory dogma has caused this, the bankers and mortgage operators over the pond and on this side that was going to explode one day and it did. We have to find a way to get rid of this debt.
    We have to find a way to live better and the greed of the elite has to stop.
    Is the pandemic over? Are the ramifications of the human cost in lives and long covid going to be opened in a public enquiry? They have announced one in Scotland.
    A friend of mine has told me, unless things change there are major public issues that will be happening across the country and that the government is for once preparing for the worst public outcry since the poll tax riots!

    In simple terms, why is it that the majority of the population cannot afford to live comfortably?

    Will it ever be over?

    Probably not!!!!!
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  2. Fairygodmother

    Fairygodmother Type 1 · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,872
    Likes Received:
    5,396
    Trophy Points:
    198
    I feel angry too. There’s been so much unnecessary suffering, so much unnecessary pain. And corruption. It’s compounded by the way that current inactions seem to me to be prolonging it. Add to that the way that Climate Warming isn’t being addressed and I find myself in danger of creating a blood sugar-pressure storm.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  3. Languagelearner

    Languagelearner Type 2 · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    143
    Likes Received:
    39
    Trophy Points:
    68
    Thousands of people die of the flu every year. Whatever Covid was, it was not virulent enough, didn't have a high enough death rate, to be classed as a pandemic. The whole thing has been an absurd over-reaction by the political class, one that has saddled us with huge debts. Add on to that the climate hysteria, and the decision to embark on anti-fossil fuel policies that will cost trillions, and you have a country that is heading for permanent decline.
     
  4. zand

    zand Type 2 · Master

    Messages:
    10,286
    Likes Received:
    16,227
    Trophy Points:
    298
    I guess you've never had a bad dose of Covid then?
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  5. Languagelearner

    Languagelearner Type 2 · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    143
    Likes Received:
    39
    Trophy Points:
    68
    No, I haven't had Covid and I have had two doses of the vaccine, and have also had the flu vaccine. But that doesn't change the fact that this was not like the Black Death, with people keeling over in the street. This was not a genuine pandemic. The real pandemic is one of hysteria in the government.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  6. BrianDoc

    BrianDoc · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    176
    Likes Received:
    346
    Trophy Points:
    83
    I had Covid, 2 weeks in intensive care, one in high dependence ward, saw folk in adjacent rooms and beds die, approaching 200,000 dead in this country, millions dead worldwide, goodness knows what the numbers would have been had it not been for the vaccine ...
    How many would have had to have died before you considered it a pandemic ?
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  7. zand

    zand Type 2 · Master

    Messages:
    10,286
    Likes Received:
    16,227
    Trophy Points:
    298
    Well I had Covid in the early days. It was terrifying. No help from the NHS, having to sleep on the sofa in an upright position because I couldn't breathe, coughing for 5 weeks, and that was just a mild dose of Covid. I still have long covid. I am still not back to normal 18 months on.
    I have had flu 3 times, bed rest required for a few days and that was it.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  8. Lamont D

    Lamont D Reactive hypoglycemia · Master

    Messages:
    12,944
    Likes Received:
    15,874
    Trophy Points:
    298
    We are in permanent decline because of the political class.
    The decision to become a market led country and introduce right wing policies that give lower and middle class no chance of having protection in work or in civil rights and justice.
    We are still getting 30,000 new infections a day and at least 200 a week deaths due to the fact that the government have no idea of what is required even with flu.
    The total failure of being prepared and have the capacity before covid.
    If covid didn't happen, the NHS, would never have coped in 2020.
    This government delivers very little except exemptions for the very rich.
    Business leaders had no travel restrictions. Ministers could do anything they wanted. Whilst we were clapping, they were organising the death knell of British owned manufacturing. Since 1980, the percentage of goods made in this country has been sold and given away and stolen by the multi national companies by 80%.
    Russian oligarchs and U.S. capitalists have more influence than royalty in the decision makers brains.

    Today, there was a press release, condemning this government response to covid.
    This was drawn up by a committee of MPs led by two former cabinet ministers.The science was wrong, the decisions made were by the PMs bequest, he hated the idea of lockdown, masks and probably most things that would have lowered the death rates. My daughter works in a school, my daughter in law works in a care home. They lock down in early February because they found out that this virus was lethal and because of not moving people between the hospital and the care home, they have had no covid deaths. I have a son and friends who work in the NHS hospital near us.
    They are exhausted and being treated by each other to battle through these last two years. There are so many vacancies. There is still not enough quality protective gowns and masks. Because of staff, there is no capacity to deal with covid and flu, this winter.
    From the start of the PANDEMIC, this virus has been associated with over Five million or more deaths and it isn't finished yet!
    The tragedy of it all is most of the new infections are youngsters including pregnant women. Majority have had no jabs.
    ColIeagues I used to work with, were going to Wuhan, through 2019 until November, when the officials wanted all foreigners to go home and stopped the majority of flights into the state. These colleagues were warned that there had been a breakout of a virus. And the Chinese local health officials, didn't want to cause infections in overseas people working there.
    I knew that there was a deadly virus, in December of that year. We raised the situation in meetings and because of the dithering and open borders and a lack of preparedness, (don't forget we were open for business until two days before the first lockdown). By then it was too little, too slow and fatal for many elderly people like myself. The blame lies at the PMs door and he has done everything to deflect how badly and deadly he got it wrong. He has U-turned so many times, because it was popular and wrong. Mrs T wouldn't believe it!
    This government is implicit in condemning so many to needless fatalities. Even some dictators would be proud of the total. In the second wave which lasted nearly six months, there was more casualties than the six months of the battle of the Somme, in the first world war. And that doesn't include the total number of deaths. We had something like an extra 50% more deaths than the average of the past few years at the peak. Most of the cabinet ministers are in place because they backed brexit and the leadership vote of the Tory party. Mr Sunak, who is chancellor. Is very rich and he is married to a woman who is in one of the top five richest women in their own right.
    I wonder if he knows what being without, really means.

    This country is systematically causing the suicidal decline of the country I knew pre 80s. Brexit was basically a tiff between the hierarchy of the conservative party, the pressure of the establishment on government to stop becoming a part of a bloc of European states becoming more integrated and a power grab, to get rid of the laws and create their idea of a democratic country, which is neither democratic or a country that deserves to be so thought of.

    The biggest problem I have with your post is similar to Boris Johnson's idea of being negligent or uncaring of what is actually happening in this country. The huge difference between have and have nots. I have even noticed on the tv news programmes that the current situation of how this government is trying to pay for social care in a couple of years is taxing the working person and taking away from working families, some benefits, that they desperately need and can ill afford. If we have a bad winter, the result could be devastating.

    The debt!!!!!!

    We can never pay the country's debt back. We are bankrupt. We owe more in payments than the taxes we take in and it can only grow.
    Most of the money has just been printed, or electronically deposited in some body's account.....! And the amount of cash flowing out of the treasury is totally unacceptable. The best interview I have seen was from STV, asking the PM, what he would spend £20 on or just put it with his wad of fiftys.
    If you gave a rich man £20, he would put it in his wallet.
    This would never help the economy. This really would cause harm to the economy, personal finance is very different to business finance.
    If you gave a poor man £20, he would definitely spend it, therefore buying something that he couldn't afford. The knock on effect of this purchasing power enhances the shop, business and development to create more and stimulate growth in the economy
    And more jobs!
    And the debt is mostly from the bank of England, which is owned by the government.
    It could wipe off this debt because it's electronic not actually cash. We have before wrote off debts from other countries in the past, this is why the world bank was created. And the government has just been handed a big chunk of change from them.
    If the resources of this country, could be diverted to actually improve all the populations lives, if the technology we have in business could be used in domestic money saving ideas. To build and improve the infrastructure of the whole U.K., not just the South east. To invest in the future, to give real democratic rights and justice and a country that has a constitution to be proud of.
    We have quite a few tax havens even within our territorial waters.
    Tax avoidance needs sorting.
    The country is politically imploding because of the lies and propaganda.
    It really needs a logical solution to how we move forward. Not backward, we are very close to reverting to Victorian era, the cannon fodder at home and abroad as subjects of the monarchy.
    It is so illogical how this country is governed.
    The ten years of Tory hypocrisy and dogma, the act of depriving thousands of fellow countrymen and their children begging for food, having to go to a food bank even though they are working, shows the minimum wage is nowhere near enough to a living wage or a breadwinners comfortable life. There were very few food banks before 2010, and they were for the homeless.
    We have the lowest corporation tax in the western world.

    Talking of the world and climate, ever since we discovered what the jet stream and the gulf stream impacts on European weather, what has started happening in the States because of changes in the Pacific (el nino).
    The temperature of seas is rising, the glaciers and poles melting, more wet and windy weather. The world is changing.
    The jet stream is faster, this means that the weather changes quicker, and more often, gone are the weeks of continuous sunshine and the the harsher winters, it can be warmer on Christmas day than some days in August.
    The gulf stream which brings the warm weather, can be pushed aside from the weather on the east coast of America and Canada, from the gulf. We have had some storms from the gulf region, I have never heard of this ten years ago.
    All our bad weather or really hot weather didn't come from the Atlantic, it came from the east. I have only seen a couple of days were an eastern front has brought weather, the likely direction of low depressions have been from the north or north west.
    I have noticed that the wind direction for most of this year, has not been from the south, south west. But rips through from the north.

    The quick introduction of electric power cars and what is happening to the market about oil and gas is proportional to the change from steam but so much quicker.
    Electric railways, electric planes coming soon, boats, buses and trams, I rode in an electric hackney cab the other day, this is really expensive and out of the purview of the majority of the population.
    As a country we cannot afford all this. The weather has changed, as the planet's plates move, it must have a domino effect on the whole of the planet and its weather.
    My last point about this is, when the first lockdown happened, and the amount of traffic and journeys were curtailed within a couple of weeks the air quality improved dramatically and it tasted great. End of lockdown, lots of travel and the air quality went up again and it smells. The number of patients suffering from asthma has risen to record levels this summer. I wonder why?
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. Jaylee

    Jaylee Type 1 · Moderator
    Staff Member

    Messages:
    15,704
    Likes Received:
    11,640
    Trophy Points:
    298
    Hi everybody.

    If you wish to make statements regarding your views on this topic & any relevant side staments regarding your reply.
    Please find a source of your statement with a link from a reliable domain.?

    I also remind members that even in genreal chat. The forum ethos rules still apply.

    Much love,

    Jaylee. (On behalf of the moderator team..)
     
  10. JTL

    JTL Type 2 · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,201
    Likes Received:
    7,871
    Trophy Points:
    178
    If everyone in the world caught covid 98% would survive with 1% being hospitalised.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. JTL

    JTL Type 2 · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,201
    Likes Received:
    7,871
    Trophy Points:
    178
    There is no climate emergency.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  12. Languagelearner

    Languagelearner Type 2 · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    143
    Likes Received:
    39
    Trophy Points:
    68
    Quite simply it would need to be an actual pandemic. In a pandemic tens of millions die. The figure for deaths in the UK is 137,000, not 200,000. The Hong Kong flu of 1969-70 killed 80,000 in the UK, without destroying the whole economy. Jaylee asked for a source, so here it is: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...68-flu-epidemic-shutdown-avoided-second-wave/
     
  13. BrianDoc

    BrianDoc · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    176
    Likes Received:
    346
    Trophy Points:
    83
    137,000 died within 28 days of testing positive having taken a specific test, they knocked thousands off the number because they tested positive with a different test, and tens of thousands because they died after the 28 days or weren’t tested before they died.
    Sorry that the millions that have died don’t seem to mean that much to some .... you wonder if they think it isn’t all that why they took the vaccine.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. Languagelearner

    Languagelearner Type 2 · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    143
    Likes Received:
    39
    Trophy Points:
    68
    10,000-12,000 a week die in the UK. It's a little known fact, but people do die. The lockdowns did nothing to change that - in Sweden there was no lockdown, and they have a lower case rate and a lower death rate from the virus.
     
  15. BrianDoc

    BrianDoc · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    176
    Likes Received:
    346
    Trophy Points:
    83
    I had realised that people die, but thanks for reminding me of that little known fact.

    Thankfully a better known fact is that science and medicine has moved on since the days of the Spanish flu, I dread to think how many would have died from Covid, officially or otherwise without the vaccines and our health professionals.

    Not quite sure that comparing Sweden with England makes sense, but those looking for a statistic to back up their thoughts no doubt will.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  16. zand

    zand Type 2 · Master

    Messages:
    10,286
    Likes Received:
    16,227
    Trophy Points:
    298
    @Languagelearner I remember the flu outbreak in l969. I was 12, my parents were 52. My mother caught it and was bedridden with it. My father and I were fine.

    If there had been masks and lockdowns back then I would think the death rate would have been lower.
    Similarly if the World had let Covid spread with no attempt to stop it then it would have reached pandemic proportions. So we should have let even more people die and then you would be happy to call it a pandemic?

    I find your logic disturbing to say the least.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    #16 zand, Oct 13, 2021 at 3:32 PM
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2021
  17. Lamont D

    Lamont D Reactive hypoglycemia · Master

    Messages:
    12,944
    Likes Received:
    15,874
    Trophy Points:
    298
    I remember the flu in 69, I was off school for a couple of weeks.
    I had obviously flu symptoms, also pluerisy, a temperature of nearly 99. And dripping wet, due to fever.
    At the time I shared bedroom with two brothers and was told without pity to go and suffer in hospital.
    I digress.

    The population has grown since the fifties, and more children are born than people are dying. This exacerbates your reasoning @Languagelearner because as someone has already said that medical care has improved so much in the last hundred years.
    The number of over sixties has despite covid has boomed, don't forget we should have been preparing for this since the nineties. And similar contingency plans for housing, social care, NHS, Infrastructure and transport. Instead, with your logic, we should have culled any OAP that needs medical treatment or needs an operation.
    And now because of the political dilemma we seem to be in a different crisis every day. Those without will be struggling even more through this winter.
    The leaders of this mess in our country are guilty of neglect, fraud, thieving and lining their own pockets. Lying through their teeth and being deceptive in everything they do or say.
    Typically a policy from Boris when he was mayor London.
    One of the first reports when we came out of lockdown earlier this year, was the job market in London estimate 180,000 vacancies to work in low paid jobs or the gig economy.
    The policy was to assist new people into the capitol, as long as they could afford it. Then when this started happening, rents soared. Those in low paid jobs, couldn't afford to live there and moved out. How many millionaires would work in McDonald's?
    Totally illogic!
    Making certain that those that have can have more than three properties, when those without, struggle to pay for a run down flat or old house owned by unregulated landlords.
    The country is and always will be a patronage of the few, and paid for by the many.
    Wether it be in cash, card or blood.

    The desire for a true representation of democratic values and representation for its people.
     
  18. JTL

    JTL Type 2 · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,201
    Likes Received:
    7,871
    Trophy Points:
    178
    FB remove posts that argue against the official story of Covid.
    YouTube have declared they will now be removing posts that aren't in line with the official UN line on climate change even if backed by science.
    There's something seriously wrong here.
    Even worse that the majority of people now seem to back you not being able to have an opinion of your own and be able to present it.
    Who beside George Orwell would have foreseen such a thing as being normal?
    Desirable even because it's for your own good?
    Your opinion is no longer allowed.
     
  19. Riva_Roxaban

    Riva_Roxaban Type 2 · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,381
    Likes Received:
    2,476
    Trophy Points:
    158
    I read once, "that opinions are like rectums, everyone has got one". ;)
     
    • Funny Funny x 2
  20. Lamont D

    Lamont D Reactive hypoglycemia · Master

    Messages:
    12,944
    Likes Received:
    15,874
    Trophy Points:
    298
    Who beside George Orwell would have foreseen such a thing as being normal?
    Desirable even because it's for your own good?
    Your opinion is no longer allowed.[/QUOTE]

    H.G. Wells, and the guy who wrote apocalypse!

    Don't do FB, Twitter and so on and so forth.

    There is nothing normal!
    Getting back to normal, was a slogan often used by this government.
    Normal was millions of people who are having to go to food banks, even when they are working. And there is so much more that should never go back to normal!
    Because normal is discrimination of the population of most of the people that try to get by in this time of social neglect.
     
  • Meet the Community

    Find support, connect with others, ask questions and share your experiences with people with diabetes, their carers and family.

    Did you know: 7 out of 10 people improve their understanding of diabetes within 6 months of being a Diabetes Forum member. Get the Diabetes Forum App and stay connected on iOS and Android

    Grab the app!
  • Tweet with us

  • Like us on Facebook