Measuring ketone levels and glucose levels in England

[Winnie53]

I am looking for recommendations for a ketone monitor/meter that is both dependable and inexpensive in England. I'm also interested in learning same for a glucose meter.

I'm going to assume that using a combination ketone/glucose monitor for type 2's starting the low carb/keto diet would be ridiculously expensive. So am not looking for information on the monitors that test both ketones and glucose.

Based on what's available on amazon.co.uk, it appears that blood ketone meters are not available in England? Is that right?

Diet Doctor did a review of four blood ketone monitors last year: CareTouch, Keto-Mojo, Nova Max Plus, and Precision Xtra. But I don't know if any of these meters are available in England. I personally use the Keto-Mojo, but I live in the US.

 

[bulkbiker]

I have the On Call GK Dual ketone meter

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ketone-Str...=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B07DJQG39L

25 strips cost £19.99

I got my meter free on a special offer but it looks like that may have finished.

I use the Tee2 for blood glucose as the strips work out cheaper.

Just checked offer still available..

https://www.valuemed.co.uk/collecti...n-you-buy-50-on-call-blood-ketone-strips-here

This was the cheapest blood ketone meter I could find.

 

[shelley262]

https://shop.spirit-health.co.uk/co...care-sens-dual-monitor?variant=19264021463097
This is what I use both to test my ketones and my glucose. I find it excellent and customer service good too. They sometimes throw in meter for free if you ring and order strips and say you want to try it - no guarantee but worth a try. Make sure too you declare diabetes for vat exemption.
Ps ketone strips work out at 1quid per strip but I now only use once a week to keep an eye on things after being keto for 2 and a half years.
Pps bg strips are 9.95 for 50 tee2 is cheaper.

 

[BrynGlas]

Hi, I bought my blood sugar from a Tesco pharmacy counter. It may not be as sooper dooper one isn't necessary because I am not diabetic, though I think I may be on the verge of type 2 all I need is a simple monitor.

Called GlucoZen.auto it comes as a kit with a touch button pen type of lancet, the monitor itself, a container of one use needles, another of test sticks and a black zipped storage case. It was well under £20 or I could not have been able to afford it.

I also use urine test sticks to measure ketones. I used to use the Ketostix brand but they work out a bit expensive. So I looked online and found :- URL-1K Reagent Strips for Urinalysis

I am having my blood tests tomorrow, so will know soon whether I am heading the T2 way or not, hopefully not.

 

[Diakat]

Are you coming to the UK @Winnie53 ?

 

[Member496333]

On Call GK Dual

I also have this meter but only use it for ketones. For glucose I have a Contour Next One.

The GK hardly gets used these days, as I know I'm in deep ketosis 24/7/365, but it's nice to have it if I feel the need to measure for fun. Usually roll ~3mmol/L anyway.

 

[Deleted member 308541]

I have just got a LifeSmart bgl / ketone testing meter, it's got bluetooth and a a great android app. I have not tried the ketone bit out, but the bgl readings are about the same as my trusty Abbot Freedom Lite meter.

The price of the strips are reasonable at $22.00 for 100 when you buy them over the counter for non NDSS members.

How ever I do not think it's available in the US as I could not finda link.

https://mylifesmart.net.au/products/blood-glucose-plus-ketone/

 

[Winnie53]

Thanks for the replies everyone. I'm interested in more feedback, so keep 'em coming.

@Diakat not coming to the UK, though things are so awful in the US right now with the ongoing impeachment process, that would be lovely. Hoping, hoping they'll allow Bolton to testify this week. I fear for the US. Trump is the worst president we've had in my life time.

To cope, I've been watching lots of older documentaries on your country's history. It's so interesting. I think they're showing up on my YouTube feed because I was briefly following Harry's and Megan's story. I wish them the very best as they create a new life for themselves and their son.

 

[Winnie53]

Am still searching around the internet for information on ketone meters and found this this review of 10 ketone meters by biohackerslab - (I enjoy their podcasts too)... https://www.biohackerslab.com/reviews/best-ketone-meter/#keto-mojo-ketone-testing-kit

Near the end of the article, I found this useful information. I regained the 10 pounds I lost last year due one stressful event after another over the last six months. Need to dig out my ketone meter to get into and stay in "optimal ketosis" to lose that 10 pounds again...

What Should Blood Ketone Levels Be for Weight Loss
Below are the different ketone ranges related to helping guide weight loss:

• Below 0.5 mmol/L – not ketosis, so little fat burning
• 0.5 – 1.5 mmol/L – is light nutritional ketosis for some weight loss
• 1.5 – 3.0 mmol/L – is optimal ketosis for maximum weight loss
• Over 3.0 mmol/L – is unnecessary & could be dangerous and especially for diabetics

Optimal ketosis is a good option for those who have plateaued in their weight loss efforts. It involves forcing your body to burn fat (or ketones) as an energy source rather than glucose, or carbs. To do this, you have to eat a low-carb high-fat (LCHF) diet to increase your ketone production and lower your insulin production. (ref)​

 

[bulkbiker]

• Below 0.5 mmol/L – not ketosis, so little fat burning

• 0.5 – 1.5 mmol/L – is light nutritional ketosis for some weight loss

• 1.5 – 3.0 mmol/L – is optimal ketosis for maximum weight loss

• Over 3.0 mmol/L – is unnecessary & could be dangerous and especially for diabetics

This is based on Phinney and Volek's famous graphic which in my view is well past its sell by date.

If you are producing ketones with reasonable blood sugar and aren't on any meds then you are in ketosis.

The absolute level doesn't matter one jot. I've been up to 6 and above with absolutely no problems.

 

[Member496333]

It involves forcing your body to burn fat (or ketones)

I've never liked this language. You're only 'forcing' your body to burn fat if it's been furiously storing it for the past thirty years and doesn't know any different. This whole "preferential glucose" lexicon makes fat-burning sound unnatural or something. As though burning stored energy is some kind of whacko biohack

That's possibly not the intention of the text, but it is how the majority would interpret it.

 

[Member496333]

This is based on Phinney and Volek's famous graphic which in my view is well past its sell by date.

If you are producing ketones with reasonable blood sugar and aren't on any meds then you are in ketosis.

The absolute level doesn't matter one jot. I've been up to 6 and above with absolutely no problems.

Agree. I've seen 1:1 glucose/BHB (beta hydroxy butyrate) ratio when fasting and have been absolutely fine. Even optimal. Higher BHB levels are associated with acidosis and it's important to be mindful of course, but with the exception of some pharmaceutical interactions, I think this is generally only a risk if glucose is also elevated.

 

[Winnie53]

This is based on Phinney and Volek's famous graphic which in my view is well past its sell by date.

If you are producing ketones with reasonable blood sugar and aren't on any meds then you are in ketosis.

The absolute level doesn't matter one jot. I've been up to 6 and above with absolutely no problems.

Volek's and Phinney's work has been primarily concerned with athletic performance which is a different context. Going from memory only - (it's been 4 years since I read their books and listened to their online lectures) - I don't recall them having a problem with ketone levels in the 3 to 10 range, but they were talking generally, not about type 1 diabetes. Virta Health, which Phinney is associated with, has made statements that their clients have successfully lost weight and stablized their blood glucose levels with ketone levels as low as .5.

The reason I found the "optimal range" interesting is because I've never had a ketone level above 1.2. That said, when I lost 26 pounds over a period of months five years ago, I didn't have a blood ketone meter so it's possible I was in the 1.5 or higher range prior to my weight loss plateau.

So is it your opinion that I won't more easily lose weight at a ketone level of 1.5 to 3?

Your statement, "The absolute level doesn't matter one jot. I've been up to 6 and above with absolutely no problems." is throwing me. I'm not concerned with ketoacidosis risk because I don't take diabetes medications or have LADA or type 1 diabetes. My focus is on weight loss at the moment.

Edited to add additional clarity.

 

[Goonergal]

@Winnie53 I’ve lost 9 pounds in the last month with my highest ketone reading being 1 (this morning). That was eating carnivore- my ketones are lower on carnivore than keto.

 

[Member496333]

Also keep in mind; that which is measured in the blood is only that which is currently not being used. Not dissimilar to glucose. I would think it's true that higher values indicate more fat being oxidised, but it's a little more nuanced than that, since professional fat burners can often see a dip in their numbers as they become ketone-burning ninjas and gobble up everything in sight. This is more true of waste measured in the urine, but I think it probably applies somewhat to the blood also. If you're rolling say, ~1.5 on the dice then there's no need to go chasing higher values.

 

[Member496333]

Thread got me curious so I just tested this morning's fasting ketones for the fun of it.

Glucose 4.8mmol/L
BHB 3.4mmol/L

 

[bulkbiker]

The reason I found the "optimal range" interesting is because I've never had a ketone level above 1.2. That said, when I lost 26 pounds over a period of months five years ago, I didn't have a blood ketone meter so it's possible I was in the 1.5 or higher range prior to my weight loss plateau.

So is it your opinion that I won't more easily lose weight at a ketone level of 1.5 to 3?

I think the "optimal" range thing is simply guesswork on their part. Ketone levels like blood sugar can be impacted by many things so to put people off if they don't get "optimal" ketones is a bit silly in my opinion.

As for the "over 3 is dangerous" I have no idea where that idea comes from except maybe for T1's if present with very high sugars too.

 

[LittleGreyCat]

As a reminder, this is (I think) the diagram in question.

Apologies for the small size (as the Bishop....)

However those with keen eyesight can probably see that the green zone (optimal) goes up to 3, starvation ketosis (such as when fasting) goes well past 5 and ketoacidosis starts around 10.

So for a T2 on diet, exercise and Metformin going pat 5 is not usually a big issue.
Readings above 10 are where you start to seriously worry.

However for a T1 (especially with high BG) the threshold is very much lower.

As an aside I have a Caresens Duo meter and my ketone test strips are well out of date.
I use a Freestyle Lite for BG testing.
I am wondering how inaccurate the Ketone test strips are now.
If I just want to check a range from 0.5 to 5 I assume they may still work?
No harm in trying I suppose.

 

[Member496333]

I fasted all day today and just hit the magic ~1:1 ratio.

4.3 glucose
4.4 BHB

Still alive

 

[Winnie53]

Thanks bulkbiker for the additional clarification.

And thanks LittleGreyCat for posting the graph and taking the time to describe what the graph is showing. The Volek and Phinney graph can also be viewed in this article... https://ketodietapp.com/Blog/lchf/Ketosis-Measuring-Ketones

Here's Phinney's take on ketone levels...

https://blog.virtahealth.com/ketosis-vs-ketoacidosis/

After doing a brief survey around the internet, I'm shocked by the amount of misinformation out there.

I think ketones are a none issue for most people diagnosed with type 2 diabetes who are not taking a sodium–glucose cotransporter-2 (SGLT2) inhibitors - canagliflozin (Invokana, Sulisent, Prominad, others), dapagliflozin (Forxiga, Farxiga, and others), and empagliflozin (Jardiance) - are not alcoholic, and do not have LADA, type 1 diabetes, or pancreatic cancer.

However, for those who are having symptoms of ketoacidosis, whether diagnosed with type 1 or not, medical care should be sought immediately, particularly in younger people, but this can happen to older people too for a variety of reasons: misdiagnosis of type of diabetes or pancreatic cancer.

All that said, because I haven't had all available lab tests available to rule out an autoimmune cause of my diabetes, and would have no way of knowing if I had pancreatic cancer, if I had a ketone level of 7 or above and was experiencing significantly high glucose levels and symptoms of ketoacidosis, I'd seek medical attention immediately.

This is a tricky conversation because I've had influenza twice in the last two years and my glucose levels ran ridiculously high. It didn't occur to me to monitor my ketone levels. Next time, I'll monitor ketones too.

Good conversation. Learned lots. It's exciting to see how the carnivore diet is helping people, particularly with weight loss and autoimmune conditions.

That diet is not for me though. I have one to three autoimmune conditions - (ulcerative colitis, subclinical hyperthyroid, and diabetes). All are stable or in remission. I recently learned that the third most common autoimmune condition associated with ulcerative colitis is type 1 diabetes. Ugh.

Additionally, with ulcerative colitis, some microbes are desirable while others are undersirable. So until more is known on how the carnivore diet effects the gut's microbiome, I'm going to stick with the low carb/keto diet that is very similar to the specific carbohydrate diet that has been used in treating children (and adults) with ulcerative colitis for more than 100 years.

Without eating soil, I don't know how to continue to increasing my microbiome's diversity without eating fresh, locally grown, organic vegetables. That said, I understand that for those who have worsening autoimmune conditions, the carnivore diet is the ultimate elimination diet and can be life saving. My health improved when I eliminated some grains, and limiting other grains beginning in 2011. I'm mostly grain free today.