1. Get the Diabetes Forum App for your phone - available on iOS and Android.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Guest, we'd love to know what you think about the forum! Take the Diabetes Forum Survey 2020 »
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Diabetes Forum should not be used in an emergency and does not replace your healthcare professional relationship. Posts can be seen by the public.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Guest, stay home, stay safe, save the NHS. Stay up to date with information about keeping yourself and people around you safe here and GOV.UK: Coronavirus (COVID-19). Think you have symptoms? NHS 111 service is available here.
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
Find support, ask questions and share your experiences. Join the community »

New eu rules for Diabetics

Discussion in 'Diabetes Discussions' started by kennethi, Aug 20, 2011.

  1. kennethi

    kennethi · Newbie

    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    21
    Million drivers face losing licence under EU diabetes.Up to one million people with diabetes could lose their driving licences because of harsh new European rules classifying them as unfit to drive.
    Experts claim the ‘unnecessarily strict’ changes will affect hundreds of thousands who have been driving for decades without problems.
    They say the rules amount to a blanket ban on diabetics taking insulin who occasionally have ‘hypos’ – episodes of hypoglycaemia, or low blood sugar, which may cause blackouts if not countered with a sugary snack.
    Victim of Brussels: There are fears that diabetics will be unfairly penalised by the new legislation
    Under a new definition of the rules to meet an EU directive, a diabetic who has two hypos in a year – even while in bed – will end up banned from driving.
    The charity Diabetes UK has protested to the Department for Transport about the changes, due to take effect in October.

    More...Pregnant women hit by return of rickets because they're not getting enough sun

    It has told officials that up to a million people with type 1 and type 2 diabetes who use insulin could be ‘negatively affected’ by the changes, but says there is no evidence that drivers with diabetes pose a greater risk than others.
    The charity fears the Driving and Vehicle Licensing Agency (DVLA) is applying the EU directive far more strictly than other countries.
    In fact some diabetics have found the DVLA is already using the new interpretation to ban them from the roads. Simon O’Neill, of Diabetes UK, said the new DVLA definitions of ‘severe’ and ‘recurrent’ hypoglycaemia threatened a blanket ban for many.
    Up until now, severe hypos were defined as episodes where another person was needed to administer carbohydrate or take other actions during waking hours to assist the diabetic.
    The new definition used by the DVLA also includes hypoglycaemia when the individual is asleep.
    Mr O’Neill said the EC Directive itself does not specify nocturnal hypoglycaemia, yet the DVLA has chosen to include it in assessing fitness to drive.
    He added: ‘We believe nocturnal hypoglycaemia has no medical basis of relevance to driving.’
    Professor Geoff Gill, professor of diabetes at Aintree University Hospital, Liverpool, said a tighter definition of hypoglycaemia was unnecessary as the current system required drivers to report when they had an episode they could not manage alone.
    He said: ‘We’re not looking for a softer option, we don’t want people driving who are a danger. This is about an interpretation of the rules that will unfairly impact on the lives of many diabetics.
    ‘It could mean that people with diabetes who have been driving safely for years will lose the right to drive under these changes.
    ‘They won’t only be people who use the car to drive to the shops or a football match, but those who depend on driving for their livelihoods.’
    A DVLA spokesman said: ‘We aim to strike the right balance – making sure that only those who are safe to drive are allowed on our roads, while at the same time avoiding placing unnecessary restrictions on people’s independence.
    ‘We must apply European medical standards but we consider every case individually and refuse licences only where absolutely necessary.’


    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2028152/Million-drivers-face-losing-licence-EU-diabetes-diktat.html#ixzz1VYCvBx7i

    The above as in todays Daily Mail. Posted by Ken
     
  2. bowell

    bowell · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    945
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Only Up side you can apply for a free bus pass if your driving license is removed on medical grounds

    I did :?
     
  3. Dragonflye

    Dragonflye Type 1 · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    235
    Likes Received:
    8
    Trophy Points:
    58
    Good to know about the bus pass!!! Wow can they actually do this??? I personally dont drive (have my license just dont like it) however due to change in circumstances with jobs and childcare it may be necessary for me to start driving in the next month or so but based on the rules i WILL loose my license!! The last hypo I had during the day which required assistance was when i was pregnant with my son, more than a year ago however i DO have hypo's when I'm asleep which require assistance from my hubby :( what do they think we are going to do? purposely fall asleep in our cars and somehow we will start driving and somehow miraculously not cause an incident and THEN have a hypo which requires assistance which ultimately results in us not being safe on the roads??
     
  4. Sussex Ted

    Sussex Ted · Newbie

    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    21
    For me this will be catastrophic! A bus pass will not help as we have no bus routes near by. I live in a rural situation, totally reliant on my car. Luckily, I cannot remember the last time I had a hypo but I am sure given a year or two, DVLA will blanket ban everyone on insulin regardless of hypos or not! If I lose my licence I will have to sell my home that I love and move to a town, which I will loathe. if people with severe disabilities with their 'human rights' can drive! Then diabetes should not even be in question! The effect on my life will be an horrendous upheaval. What can we do collectively to stop this happening? Write to our mp? We must object to this and get the medical world behind us. If we just lie down and let this happen, it will be horrendous for sufferers. Strangely enough, I never think of being a 'sufferer' but with this looming over me, I now feel victimised and I am sure I will not be the only one! LET'S ACT NOW
     
  5. ishjohno

    ishjohno · Active Member

    Messages:
    31
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    26
    EU Directive - appearing in the Daily Mail 21.08.2011

    Is this true?

    This article is about diabetics who have more than 2 hypos per year will lose their driving licences.......how come the media know, how long have Diabetes UK known about this?

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/artic ... iktat.html

    Sarah :(
     
  6. Sussex Ted

    Sussex Ted · Newbie

    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    21
    Re: EU Directive - appearing in the Daily Mail 21.08.2011

    Oh yes!!!!!
     
  7. bowell

    bowell · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    945
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Not always the case
    My driving license been removed because of My severe disability and the effect pain drugs

    Like me you may have to move closer to a bus route
    Unlike you I also had to find a bus route with buses fitted with ramps

    Bob
     
  8. Louwalker71

    Louwalker71 Type 1 · Active Member

    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Madness ...... It will also encourage diabetics to;

    1. Run higher sugar levels putting their long term possibilities for complications higher and therefore higher costs for the NHS. If you have tight control mild hypos are normally common.

    2. To lie on the DVLA form - if your husband gives you some glucogel or similar during a nighttime hypo and you recover quickly without any further intervention why would you mention it!

    I am fortunate that to date (diabetic for 15 years) I have never had any hypo where I have needed anyone to help me but this us still very worrying.
     
  9. Sussex Ted

    Sussex Ted · Newbie

    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    21
    I agree. It will make us run our blood sugars higher and risk other complications.
     
  10. kennethi

    kennethi · Newbie

    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    21
    Quite supprised Diabetic.co.uk, not come on here to respond to peoples queries on this subject.
    Proberbley the most serious issue to come out for diabetcics for some years.
     
  11. phoenix

    phoenix Type 1 · Expert

    Messages:
    5,671
    Likes Received:
    3,674
    Trophy Points:
    178
    I think that you are under the impression that this forum is part of DUK the charity, it isn't so it's unlikely they will reply on here.
    This is what DUK say about the proposed changes
    http://www.diabetes.org.uk/About_us/New ... -diabetes/

    Actually they've known about them for a while since there was a public consultation about them that finished in April this year.
    http://www.dft.gov.uk/dvla/consultation ... tions.aspx
    The proposals from the consultation document are those I posted on this thread.
    viewtopic.php?f=35&t=23508
    The regulations to be proposed in Oct may have been amended as a result of the consultation, we won't know until they are actually published.
     
  12. chocoholic

    chocoholic · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    827
    Likes Received:
    16
    Trophy Points:
    38
    I have written to my local M.P. about this. I do have hypos but always monitor my levels closely and have never been hospitalized through a hypo or fallen unconscious. I would never risk hurting myself or others on the road and with an elderly mother who lives in a village with no public transport between mine and hers AND a severely disabled brother who often has us joining him on a blue lights run to hospital,in the middle of the night, I so need to hang on to my licence.
    Surely idiots on their mobile phones or those tanked up with drink are more of a danger behind the wheel of a car than a well-controlled,closely monitored diabetic.
    I will not give up my licence without a fight.
     
  13. SarahW

    SarahW · Member

    Messages:
    20
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    21
    Is this rule for 2 hypos or 2 hypos which need assistance?? I am a dafne trained diabetic and am more than aware if my sugars are going low. We are taught to test before we drive. We are probably more aware of our medical state than anyone else!!!!!!!!! This rule is ridiculous, what about drunks, drug addicts, people with no liciences in the first place. This opens up a huge can of worms........what if you ever had a stroke, what if you ever fainted. Im all for keeping unsafe drivers off the roads but this is discrimination at its very best.......we need to fight all the way. This will ruin my life and I am sure alot of other peoples lives. They will say we cant be parents next
     
  14. noblehead

    noblehead Type 1 · Guru
    Retired Moderator

    Messages:
    23,618
    Likes Received:
    19,616
    Trophy Points:
    278
    I believe it's assisted hypo's but it all seems so unclear. Everyone, Dafne trained or not who use insulin should test their bg before and during driving, I've never had a hypo behind the wheel nor have I ever needed assistance with a hypo so will wait and see how this effect my ability to drive.

    Nigel
     
  15. phoenix

    phoenix Type 1 · Expert

    Messages:
    5,671
    Likes Received:
    3,674
    Trophy Points:
    178
    This misreporting of the Daily Mail has got everyone worked up.
    . The requirement to report one episode of severe hypo applies to group 2 drivers.. those who at present in the UK can't have a licence at all
    (notice the word waking hours in this statement)
    For group 1 drivers the EU directive
    (my quoted source was the parliamentary briefing paper, I've closed it so can't link)
    severe hypos are defined as those needing assistance from a third party
    recurrent means more than once in a 12 month period

    It is not just 2 hypos unless the UK changes things to be far stricter than the EU directive.

    The working group that recommended the regulations to the EU in the first place were perfectly aware that many people have 2 hypos or more a week.
    .

    So they weren't considering mild hypos. Notice the mention of sub 60mg/dl (3.3mmol) not 72mg/dl (4mmol)
    when they mention unawareness they say:
    http://ec.europa.eu/transport/road_safe ... l_1_en.pdf
    I won't quote but if you look at page 33 onwards you will see their recommendations (which seem to have been accepted by the EU in full) and the rationale behind each of them.
     
  16. littlemolly

    littlemolly Type 1 · Member

    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Please will everyone sign the e-petition! At the moment only 600 people have signed and we will need 100,000 to get it discussed in parliament!!! If you go on to the e-petition site and search for "eu directive to ban diabetics driving" it should come up. It was started on 21st July 2011. Send it to everyone you know!
     
  17. phoenix

    phoenix Type 1 · Expert

    Messages:
    5,671
    Likes Received:
    3,674
    Trophy Points:
    178
    If only the petition had confined itself to the matter of nightime hypos and clarity over the self reporting system and not included the untrue statement 'the EU directive which leads to drivers with diabetes being stripped of their licences if they suffer two hypos in a year'
    (no mention of severe, needing assistance)

    People may be interested in this detailed email response to a query from Diabetes UK:
    http://canidoit.org/diabetes-uk-reassur ... egulations
     
  18. chocoholic

    chocoholic · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    827
    Likes Received:
    16
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Thanks for that link, Phoenix. Perhaps things are not as bad as portrayed by the Mail then. Fingers crossed for all us sensible diabetic drivers.
     
  19. serena_jennings

    serena_jennings · Newbie

    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    21
    I AM APPAULED BY THIS LATEST NEWS FROM THE DVLA! I HAVE BEEN A TYPE 1 DIABETIC FOR THE PAST 24 YEARS AND I HAVE BEEN DRIVING SAFELY WITH A CLEAN LICENSE FOR THE PAST 15 YEARS. EVERY 3 YEARS WE ARE RIGEROUSLY QUESTIONED AND ASSESED BY THE DVLA TO ENSURE THAT WE ARE FIT TO DRIVE. IT IS MY RESPONSIBILITY TO ENSURE THAT I AM ABLE TO DRIVE BY TESTING MY GLUCOSE LEVELS EVERY TIME BEFORE I GET INTO THE CAR AND ACT ON THOSE RESULTS ACCORDINGLY. JUST THE SAME AS AVERYONE ELSE WHO SHOULD ENSURE THEY ARE SOBER AND NOT TOO TIRED TO DRIVE.I WOULD EXPECT TO BE PENOLISED ACCORDINGLY IF I SHOULD DELIBERATLY DRIVE WHILST UNFIT.
    WHAT ABOUT PATIENTS WITH A HISTORY OF HEART DISEASE, EPILEPSY OR ANAPHALAXIS WHO ARE ALSO AT RISK OF PASSING OUT AND EVEN DYING WITH LESS WARNING SIGNS THAN THE AVERAGE DIABETIC HYPO? DOES THIS MEAN PEOPLE WITH BEE STING ALLERGIES WILL ONLY BE ABLE TO DRIVE CARS WITH THE WINDOWS SHUT AND LOCKED :? LETS HOPE THAT THE POLITICIANS DON'T DEVELOP SUCH CONDITIONS, THEN AGAIN THEY HAVE CHOFFEURS TO GET THEM FROM A TO B.
    I AM ALSO A PRACTICE NURSE AND ENCOURAGE ALL MY DIABETIC PATIENTS TO OPENLY DISCUSS ANY HYPOS. I FEEL THESE NEW GUIDELINES WILL DETER PATIENTS FROM ADMITTING ANY SITUATIONS WHICH THEY MAY HAVE, WHICH MAY POTENTIALLY NOT BRING ISSUES TO LIGHT FOR DIABETICS WHO ARE NOT FIT TO DRIVE AND WILL THERFORE BE ISSUED WITH ANOTHER 3 YEALRY LICENCE AS THEIR GP WILL NOT BE ABLE TO SUBMIT ACCURATE INFORMATION.
     
  • Meet the Community

    Find support, connect with others, ask questions and share your experiences with people with diabetes, their carers and family.

    Did you know: 7 out of 10 people improve their understanding of diabetes within 6 months of being a Diabetes Forum member. Get the Diabetes Forum App and stay connected on iOS and Android

    Grab the app!
  • Tweet with us

  • Like us on Facebook