Unmedicated vs a little metformin

[Avocado Sevenfold]

normal is near enough to fasting under 5.5, 1hr is under 8 and 2hr is under 6.5, I think the diabetic recommended numbers are on the upper limit and aren't the numbers I'm chasing as a T2.
3 weeks is early on the path, I'm an old hand at a wopping 13 weeks j/k

Sorry, is this the T2 target or is this Jack's own stats?

I have no chance of sub 5.5 fasting On one metformin a day and am due a review. Maybe I need more? Managing to stay under 8 the rest of the time, but struggling with my fasting readings. Ho hum.

 

[jack412]

Sorry, is this the T2 target or is this Jack's own stats?

I have no chance of sub 5.5 fasting On one metformin a day and am due a review. Maybe I need more? Managing to stay under 8 the rest of the time, but struggling with my fasting readings. Ho hum.

Here are what doctors currently believe to be non-diabetic readings. I happen to fall in the normal range with metformin and LCHF, if it was me I'd aim for these targets as a T2 without taking any hypo drugs
http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/14045524.php
Fasting blood sugarunder 100 mg/dl (5.5 mmol/L)
One hour after meals under 140 mg/dl (7.8 mmol/L)
Two hours after meals under 120 mg/dl (6.6 mmol/L)

 

[Avocado Sevenfold]

Here are what doctors currently believe to be non-diabetic readings. I happen to fall in the normal range with metformin and LCHF, if it was me I'd aim for these targets as a T2 without taking any hypo drugs
http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/14045524.php
Fasting blood sugarunder 100 mg/dl (5.5 mmol/L)
One hour after meals under 140 mg/dl (7.8 mmol/L)
Two hours after meals under 120 mg/dl (6.6 mmol/L)

Cheers Jack.

I will talk to my nurse soon. The forthcoming hba1c will not tell the whole story, but how do I explain about my high fasting readings to a woman who thinks I should not be testing at all?

For what it's worth, back on topic, I don't think taking metformin is such a bad thing as it has many benefits.

 

[AndBreathe]

Most of my big weight loss was when I was on Metformin. My Doctor refuses to prescribe it now.

I'd love to be back on it, I've often thought of going on a carb fest before my next HbA1c so that I could pretend that I'd fallen off the waggon, and need some metformin help.

As a matter of interest, why would you like to be back on Metformin?

 

[borofergie]

As a matter of interest, why would you like to be back on Metformin?

I'm running a Marathon in September, which requires me to (1) lose a lot of weight (2) be in deep ketosis between now and then. Metformin would help me with both.

(I am sure that I'll lose a lot of weight with keto + marathon training, but since every pound counts over 26.2 miles I want all of the help I can get).

 

[jack412]

Cheers Jack.

I will talk to my nurse soon. The forthcoming hba1c will not tell the whole story, but how do I explain about my high fasting readings to a woman who thinks I should not be testing at all?

For what it's worth, back on topic, I don't think taking metformin is such a bad thing as it has many benefits.

mate it's your health, I'd tell her you are testing and why you think it might be of benefit to up your metformin because you still have high BG, when they do the A1c, they should do morning fasting BG and a complete scan, kidney liver lipids etc.

 

[Avocado Sevenfold]

mate it's your health, I'd tell her you are testing and why you think it might be of benefit to up your metformin because you still have high BG, when they do the A1c, they should do morning fasting BG and a complete scan, kidney liver lipids etc.

Appointment made for 30th April. Will see how it goes. Thanks, Jack.

When I phoned up to make the appointment with the nurse, I was told there was a note for me to see the dietitian again. Told them that was not necessary...I am...erm...washing my hair that day

 

[jack412]

I'd see the dietitian and tell her/him what diet you want to do, it's their job to help you achieve your desired outcome, even if they disagree. they all want you to eat 60% carb 20% protein and 20% fat from the 70's

 

[mrs gimli]

Hi since taking metformin I have felt so much better that and lower carbs

 

[runner2009]

If you eat too few calories your body goes into starvation mode, things kick in and you stop losing weight. Hence, if you increase your calories for a while, then reduce them but not quite as far as to put you in starvation mode again, you should start to lose again. If you stick to a sensible amount of calories, an amount which is less than your body needs but not drastic, you should lose steadily without any plateaux. I discovered on some website or other than I need 1600 calories (age/weight/exercise based) to maintain health and weight, with more if I increase exercise. An ideal weight loss amount for me is 1200 calories, more if I increase exercise. I've followed this and have lost 20lbs so far with no plateaux. So far!!!!!

I've found for me that too lose weight I have to food journal and count calories.

If I plateau, I just start cutting small amounts until I lose again. Some times it amazes me that 100 less calories and I start losing again.

For both diet and BG control, I believe exercise with the focus of increasing your heart rate and transforming or building more lean muscle is paramount - this at first is not fun.

Also, I agree that not too worry about meds at first but focus on controlling your BG level to as normal as you can with the focus on reducing post meal spikes and normal A1c

I would read Dr. Bernstein's book 'Diabetic Solution' @ http://www.diabetes-book.com



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[runner2009]

I'm running a Marathon in September, which requires me to (1) lose a lot of weight (2) be in deep ketosis between now and then. Metformin would help me with both.

(I am sure that I'll lose a lot of weight with keto + marathon training, but since every pound counts over 26.2 miles I want all of the help I can get).

Hey borofergie

What is your training method? How many miles per week? Are you running with a group? More importantly are u enjoying the training?

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[runner2009]

Sorry, is this the T2 target or is this Jack's own stats?

I have no chance of sub 5.5 fasting On one metformin a day and am due a review. Maybe I need more? Managing to stay under 8 the rest of the time, but struggling with my fasting readings. Ho hum.

This is why I like the shots (75/25 humolog mix 3 units in am and 0 to 4units in evening depending on Bg , exercise and dinner carbs )

I can get good control - docs want me off I've refused unless I get a c-peptide test they won't authorize

But I think everyone's disease can be different depending on ones insulin resistance and how many beta cells are dead, worn out or dying

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[borofergie]

Hey borofergie
What is your training method? How many miles per week? Are you running with a group? More importantly are u enjoying the training?

The Marathon isn't until the end of September, so I'm starting the Hal Higdon Novice2 at the end of May.

I've been running for 3 years, but was injured for the first 10 weeks of this year, so I'm just trying to build a base in April and May. I'll run 80 miles a month, at the moment all at aerobic pace.

I'm not a fast runner, looking at about a 5 hour marathon (I hope).

And yes. I love running.

 

[Brunneria]

Cheers Jack.

I will talk to my nurse soon. The forthcoming hba1c will not tell the whole story, but how do I explain about my high fasting readings to a woman who thinks I should not be testing at all?

For what it's worth, back on topic, I don't think taking metformin is such a bad thing as it has many benefits.

Your comment made me laugh (hollowly).

I went to the DN recently, for a fasting blood test. We had the following conversation:

Me: I wouldn't be surprised if I show as diabetic this time. I test my glucose with a meter, and I think my reaction to carbs is that of a diabetic.
Her: Oh, we don't encourage that. Only type 1 diabetics should test, and you have only got raised fasting levels.
Me: I find it helps me to keep my readings down, and I eat low carb because that helps.
Her: Why? What readings do you get?
Me: Well, my fasting is usually...
Her: Oh no, that amount of testing is really not necessary. Have you ever been in double figures?
Me: Yes, occasionally after my main meal.
Her: At 2 or 4 hours?
Me: At 2.
Her: Well you don't need to test. But I will do you an extra blood test (the HbA1c), and you will contact us if your fasting level increases, won't you?

Clearly, my testing gave her useful info and informed her decisions.

So why, exactly, am I not supposed to be testing? Especially since I wasn't asking the NHS to pay for the meter, the strips, or the information

 

[NotSoSweet2]

I am really interested in this thread as I also want to try other means rather then take metformin and statins. I was prescribed metformin a month ago and I still haven't taken it as of yet and will only do so as a last resort. There are some excellent results i.e. weight loss etc from people here to give this a try. Well done to everyone who managed to keep focused, disciplined and determined to do it the drug free way. I am only stating my own personal preferences here. I would advice all people to get expert advice and continue with any meds.

 

[CollieBoy]

So why, exactly, am I not supposed to be testing? Especially since I wasn't asking the NHS to pay for the meter, the strips, or the information

Cos she's a thick as pigsh*t unthinking zombie IMHO.

 

[millicent2014]

I have my first DN session on Wednesday, and as you can see from my signature I've been making progress already just from the information and support on here.

I now have a bit of a dilemma. My heart says I want to do this without medication, and I believe I can. I don't like medication of any kind if I can possibly avoid it, and I'm certainly not accepting statins for my cholesterol. My wife (who is very supportive and has joined me in LCHF so we can still eat the same) is suggesting that I accept a small dosage of metformin, if proposed, just in order to take some of the burden of control off me and give my pancreas a hand in the short term. My head is now uncertain of the stance I should take.

In my situation, what would you do? I'm still leaning towards the non-medication route if I can swing it, at least as a further trial period, but am I throwing away low-risk assistance in the process?

I am with you on this one. I hate pills.
After my Glucose tolerance test was sky high GP recommended Metaformin statins and tablets to reduce 140/80 Bp.
I said no thanks I will try the natural way first.
Hba1c was 7.7 back in August, 7.1 in October and 6.6 last week. Bp 120/60. HDL ratio GP said should below 4 is now 3.7
I have been more active and lost about a stone and a half.
The gym is a No No so I do about 1/2 hour of exercise with the Wii games and dance games.
It has been surprisingly easy as the dietician was satisfied with my diet which is very simple so no changes there.
Try the natural way first
You can always take tablets later if you need to.

 

[sanguine]

Thanks Millicent, you can see how I got on with the DN yesterday at http://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/first-meeting-with-dn.56372/

As for exercise, at the moment I do brisk walking but I will probably get a rowing machine as well, especially for when it's dark or raining outside! The GP suggested cycling (no bike), swimming (don't like swimming) or running, might try that when I've lost more weight, but unless I can run rather than jog - which to me is a hazard to the skeleton - I'll stick with the walking, rowing machine and maybe I'll dig out the 'step' from the garage. At least the whole family can use them!