Concerned about my son

hya sarah,
i personally would go to a&e as 17 even after food and sweets is quite probably diabetes and if he has ketones he could turn seriously ill, if u dont want to do the hospital first route plz ring nhs24 ,
it is something u really cant afford to wait for :?
plz let us know how u get on

Hi Sarah,
I would go to A&E straight away, your son is showing all the signs, we can't diagnose on this web site, but i can say from personnal experience, having an 11 yr old son, diagnosed almost 4yrs ago, that your sons symptons do sound like diabetes. Let us know how you get on, i do hope its something else, but if not, please return to the forum for big hugs and support.
Take care,
Suzi x

Hi I agree with the others I would go to a&e much better to get him sorted asap, hospital is the best place for help and advice.


take care

your welcome,
just be careful asd ketoacidosis can come on so quickly, i ended up in a really bad way extremely fast :?

Hi Sarah,
As I understand it, the beta cells (that produce insulin) in the pancreas usually die off gradually over a long period of time (months or even longer). During this time I imagine that insulin production can be erratic which is why your son's blood glucose is sometimes high and sometimes not. I would say, though, that I don't think a reading of 17 is likely in someone with a fully functioning pancreas.

My younger daughter (now 8) was diagnosed at two and a half. Her symptoms were as you have described for your son, plus really bad constipation, caused by the dehydration effects of high BG's.

What you need to be very careful about is ketoacidosis. In very young children it can be very dangerous. They can go from being well to critically ill in a matter of hours. I would suggest you get some ketostix if your hubby doesn't already have some and test little one's wee regularly. If he shows more than a trace and especially if his BG is up, get medical help immediately.

I hope this helps. What treatment has the hospital advised?
Best wishes
Sue

Hi, I have to agree with Sue. This happened to my son just before he was diagnosed. He had all the classic signs, wetting bed, drinking and eating lots and getting thinner. My husband also has type 1 so we knew the signs. We did a urine test which showed sugar, so my husband immediately took him to A&E. He phoned me a few hours later saying they'd done a blood test and it was fine. They reckoned he had a cold and just sent him home! Needless to say, a week later we were back in A&E when they did diagnose diabetes and he was put on insulin.

Like Sue says, they go through a period called the honeymoon phase. This is when the pancreas is still producing some insulin, so the blood sugar will evenutally come down after several hours of eating, but the blood sugar levels are still rising too high. I'm suprised that the hosptial didn't give you more information. My son had only very small doses of insulin at the start as his pancreas was still producing insulin. Getting readings as high as 17mmol even if it does come down after several hours is not good and it has been affecting him if he has been drinking and weeing as much as you say. His little body as been trying to get rid of the excess sugar in his blood. It may be worth getting a second opinion. As I said earlier, we had two trips to A&E before my son was diagnosed. On our second visit the hospital said we should of been offered a follow up check the first time. Work on your intuition, as a Mother we know when something isn't right. I know a diagnosis of diabetes can be daunting, but it is controllable with the right medication. Leggott.

Hi Sarah,
Wow, how confusing for you. And worrying.

Okay, I have 2 diabetic (Type 1) daughters, and what I say now is based on years of experience with them, but I must stress that I am not a medical professional.

1. Ketones: anyone, child or adult can have ketones, especially when they are on a diet, are low carbing, or haven't eaten for hours eg overnight. It is very common for children (esp young ones) to have a trace of ketones first thing in the morning. This does not usually indicate Type 1.

The problem arises when there is more than a trace of ketones, combined with a relative lack of insulin, which is normally reflected in high blood glucose levels. This leads to the blood turning acidic (diabetic ketoacidosis or DKA). According to what I've been told this usually happens when a person's insulin production falls to 20% or below of what their body needs to function. IF your son is developing Type 1, he may not yet have reached that critical 20% level, so he seems relatively well. However, if his beta cells are failing, at some point he will drop below this level and develop DKA. This is an extremely dangerous situation for anyone, but especially a young child. My daughters' consultant told us that they could go from being well to fighting for their lives in intensive care in as little as 6 hours from the onset of DKA. I do not mean to frighten you, but you really cannot afford to ignore this possibilty.

2. Blood glucose: Our consultant has also told us that in people whose pancreases are working fully, BG is tightly controlled between 6 & 8. It may very briefly rise above this after a carb heavy meal, but should quickly come down again to below 8, certainly by 2 hrs after eating. The problem with developing Type 1 is that insulin production surges and falls so that sometimes you may get a good reading eg 4.9 and feel reassured, when in reality all may not be well.


Please keep testing his wee and his BG. As for violating his human rights - what rubbish. Doesn't he have a human right not to be left to become very ill when that could be avoided. I am so glad you did not allow that comment to go unchallenged.

Let us know how you get on.
Best wishes
Sue

My ketosticks might test differently to yours but I would think that having anything but trace amounts would mean a need for more doctors visits and continued monitoring. My sticks test both for glucose and ketones. If he was showing ketones I would be very concerned. Other than when Khaleb is sick his blood ketone level would be 0 or 0.2. I doubt this would register as anything on a wee stick. I wouldn't stress yourself by getting up and checking him in the night. It would be after food and sugary drinks that his bsl's would be high if he were developing diabetes. Glucose and ketones can turn up in urine for other reasons than diabetes and can be signs of general illness like colds/flus etc..

If your instincts are telling you something is wrong you should trust them. I'm sure there are blood tests available and if he would cope with a glucose tolerence test that would give a good picture of how he copes with a sugar load.

Hi Sarah,
I think my ketostix may be different from yours. They show 'Negative' which is a pale beige colour, 'trace' which is a very pale pink, and then + , ++, +++ which get darker and darker till the +++ is deep purple. Like Jen said I too would be concerned with anything more than 'trace', particularly if the BG was up. The listlessness, lethargy, grumpiness, thirst and weeing are all symptoms both my girls showed prior to diagnosis.

Readings consistently outside the normal range would worry me. It's a good idea to write them down. As Jen said, trust your instincts - you know about ketoacidosis and what to look out for, just bear in mind how fast it can happen. Personally if I was worried that something might be brewing at bedtime, I would get up in the night to check, but it's a personal decision really.

Being especially hungry might be a sign - when the glucose is 'trapped' in the bloodstream, the body thinks it is starving and hence the hunger. Many Type 1's lose weight before diagnosis, although they may in fact be eating more.
Best wishes,
Sue

Sarah
I'm an "elderly" T2, so not walking in your shoes. I have been reading this thread and picked up one point. the Oral Glucose Tolerance Test is the ONLY correct diagnostic for diabetes. If your doctor says it's not, something isn't right. They don't always do one nowadays, but it is the Diagnostic test for diabetes.
Keep at them It's your baby's health in the balance.
Sounds like they don't know what they are doing

Just before I go off to bed, another thought. In my experience, very few GP's are 'up with the play' when it comes to Type 1, esp in children. They tend to 'think Type 2' which is at best not very helpful and at worst dangerous. Likewise staff in A+E/casualty dept's might not be very familiar with it. A while ago I had a Dr in A+E tell me not to test my daughter more than once a day and to reduce her insulin if she was unwell and not eating - that is dangerous advice as usually they need more insulin when unwell, not less!! You need to get a paediatrician with a special interest in diabetes, who runs the paediatric diabetes clinic to advise you, or if you could get a name from somewhere (maybe your hubby's adult clinic would know), of one of the specialist paediatric diabetes nurses.
BW
Sue

Hi I have been reading this thread but dont like to give advice as im still learning, however I agree with everyone and the advice Sue says about contacting your husbands DN is excellent. Also is there any way you can get your hands on keytone kit that tests bloods instead of the urine sticks? blood tests are much more accurate and easy to read. In my experience gps dont know about diabetes I went back and forth for 2 weeks with my son who showed all the symptoms of diabetes, we ended up with a doctor at the door at 11pm after bloods were taken that day and Son woken and into hospital with bs 26. hope all goes well for you, sounds liek you know what to look for but so far havent had any help from docs xx