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DVLA Revoked My Driving Licence

H

Hadders1979

Newbie
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1
Warning!
I am a "well controlled", "very stable" diabetic, with a "good understanding of the condition" to directly quote my GP (in writing!). I have had diabetes for 27 years (since I was 6), and been driving for 16 years (since I was 17) without an accident or incident related to my diabetes. A clean sheet so to speak.
Five weeks ago, the DVLA took my licence off me. I am a victim of a new EU law passed in June (2012). I honestly answered the questionnaire sent through as normal regarding diabetes completely unaware of any changes. The question have I had 'more than one episode of severe hypoglycemia requiring the assistance of another person in the last 12 months'.
Unfortunately, as a result of a house sale falling through, over the Christmas period last year (so estate agents closed!), and notice having being served on my rented property, I think it's safe to say I was under extreme stress. I had 2 nocturnal hypos (you know - in my sleep, therefore not anywhere near a car - nor wanting to drive one!), and my fiance got me some gel in the morning to help bring me round.
By answering 'yes' to this questions, with that in mind the DVLA promptly revoked my licence. I was devastated. I never even dreamed this was a possibility.
On opening the letter I phoned the DVLA immediately and was told the "case was closed" by a very rude woman, who said it was "automatic" having "ticked the box". Devastated does not even begin to explain how I felt. I was in shock.
A trip to the GP and a very supportive letter later, as she was shocked herself and quite definite as my doctor and a medical professorial that I was no threat and quiet safe to drive (see quotes above), the DVLA have "upheld" there decision as this new EU law states nocturnal hypos are treated as any other.
The law is ridiculous and I am at a loss.
If I had been done for drink driving I would have kept my licence until a court date where a case would have been heard and a judgement made after all facts had been presented and considered. By ticking a box in a questionnaire, I have not been allowed any of this courtesy, and I haven't broken the law, nor put anyone else at risk! Crazy!!!
The DVLA and EU are deeming themselves as better judges of my physical well being than my GP.
I have been onto my local MP and MEP's with a plea for help, but just wanted to warn others.
Despite a statement from the DVLA on August 20th 2011, stating "we consider every case individually and refuse licences only where absolutely necessary" I would suggest this is rubbish, as again the woman on the phone said to today the decision has been made following a box being ticked, regardless of circumstances or medical evidence that suggests the decision is wrong.
Distraught does not begin to capture my emotions as I am at a loss as to how this can be allowed to stand.
Ironically if I lived on my own I would have managed it myself, not have ticked the box and still be driving. I'm being penalized for my fiance helping me! Or for being honest... Think on...
It is a mess.
 
I feel for you. I have just heard about this and also think its wrong. Like you said you had the hyo at night, whilst asleep in bed, not sat in a car with keys in the ignition etc. You had no intention of driving ( bit like where people who are over the limit can actually sleep in their cars as long as they show no signs of driving... keys out of ignition - and this is deemed ok???) but having the help of a friend during the night is deemed not ok?? At least you had the courtesy to check your bg. like im sure we all do, we all check bg before we step foot in a car and we all carry out appropriate meds to counter this. we have glucose tabs in the car. i dont know what else we can do apart from watch people still over the drink drive limit the next morn and not check their alcohol level...and get away with it.
 
Ironically if I lived on my own I would have managed it myself, not have ticked the box and still be driving. I'm being penalized for my fiance helping me! Or for being honest... Think on...
It is a mess.Hadders1979
Click to expand...

This bit caught my eye.
When you say your fiance helped you do you mean she passed you hypo treatment?
If that's the case you have ticked the box in error. (So your fault, many have done it including Drs)
The assisted hypo is paramedics glucogon etc.
So you need to send a letter by recorded delivery with a letter from your GP stating you ticked the box in error if this is the case.
 
That's awful, I'd be lost without my driving license. How long until you can re-apply?
 
Hey Hadders!

That's awful! I really hate the way the DVLA treat us - it is just legalised discrimination in my book. I don't think any other group is treated as badly with regard to driving. Still, none of that helps you. I think Carbsrok is right. You need to send a letter detailing exactly what happened. Make it clear that you did not pass out and did not need medical assistance to recover from your hypo. Is there any chance you could see a solicitor? I feel the most effective way of getting that decision overturned is to have someone on your side that knows the law and its application properly.

Good luck

Smidge
 
That's absolutely ridiculous! I'm sorry to hear about this.

What is it coming too that we're now not even allowed to drive if we have a hypo outside of a car. I hate it when the forms come through my door because you just never know what boxes to tick any more. I mean what are we meant to declare anymore, it's like they want us to all be perfectly controlled with not a single hypo/hyper ever (and then they allow people who shouldn't be driving, drive) Madness!
 
Hadders get in touch with diabetes Uk's care team. the advocacy department may be able to help.
Hana
 
Hadders I really do feel sorry for you mate, but I can understand their reasons to an extent, just because you had Hypos overnight does not mean that you can't have them during the day, and they are looking at the very worst situation that could arise, that you suddenly go into a Hypo. This doesn't mean to say I agree with them at all. I have type 2 and have not had a Hypo for many many months then all of a sudden a few weeks back I suddenly had one come on without any warning at all, I normally get indicators that one is coming on, I get cold, shivery, sleepy but this time it didn't happen at all, nothing indicated I was hypo'ing at all.

I know exactly how you feel in a sense, I had to give up my licence because of slow reaction times caused by all the meds I have to take. I was devastated, driving was my life, I loved it and now nothing.......

I also feel that DVLA have not publicised this enough at all, and I certainly have not known about it until a few months back. Another of these B**DY EU laws they "have to impose on us". You can take it to court and fight it but be warned they could well uphold in DVLA's favour because you had the Hypos and you would have to pay their costs as well as your own costs and that would not be cheap.Under this new law they don' t care whether it was day or night, you had them, and that was enough for them to withdraw your licence.

In future I would suggest that if your other half completes forms for you for anything, then YOU check them before they are sent, and don't please blame her, she was only doing what she thought was right for you. It was a little short sighted of you to not check it, but it is too late, it has happened. Also when you make a call to DVLA they call up your records and put a note on that you rang and roughly what it was about, so saying you made a mistake will ring alarm bells, and ALL their calls are recorded.

I wish you the very best mate I hope you can sort something out but be very careful if you do decide to appeal it, if you take it to court and tell a little white lie it is classed as Purgery and you can be convicted of it.
 
I lost my licence a few years ago, although my circumstances were different as I was actually behind the wheel at the time, and I really needed to sort myself out and felt at the time that I deserved what had happened to me. However, that experience taught me a few things about the DVLA which might be useful. Firstly, don't try and take them on. You could take them to court, but if you do, I suspect you'll lose as no magistrate is going to take your word over theirs. Also, DVLA will always be represented and you will end up with an award of costs, as well as no licence. They aren't really negotiable either. They just don't have that facility. Like all bureacratic organisations, there is a process to be followed. Try and find somebody in the medical division who is at least sympathetic and ask them what you need to do to get the situation resolved. Explain that your GP supports you, but try and get the hospital consultant involved as well. Again, like all government departments, they will respond better the higher up your supporters appear to be. What they need to be absolutely convinced of is that you are safe to drive. However unfair the situation may appear to be, it is that premise that you need to understand. Explain to everybody who might listen that you keep sugar in the car, that you always test before you drive, that you never drive on less that 6. The maddening thing about all of this of course is that it encourages people to be less than honest with the forms, which is entirely counter productive. However, that is the situation you find yourself in. One thing I would say though, is that all this takes time. Hard as it sounds, I'd prepare for being without a licence for a year if I were you.
 

Hadders1979 - sorry to hear about this but did you read the form? It says;

"Have you had more than one episode of severe hypoglycaemia (requiring the assistance of another person) in the last 12 months? (Please only count episodes where you needed help. Do Not count episodes where you were given help but could have treated yourself.) "

My bold/underlining on the question. That's what you are saying happened isn't it? "If I lived on my own I would have managed it myself".

Ask them what to do if you misread the question..! Then do what they say.

You can talk about fairness and EU regulations all you want but if you mess up the information you give them whose fault is that? You're not being penalised for your fiancée helping you, you are being penalised for not reading the bloody question; just to be super clear DO NOT COUNT EPISODES where you were given help but could have treated yourself. So you should have ticked 'no'.

Dillinger
 
I think a valid point has been raised here, which was in the details of the letter. That being did you need help? the answer would appear to be no. Yet you ticked yes.
IIf the DVLA was out of order, then yes that should be highlighted,petitions signed, maybe a static demo or two outside the house of the chief executive of the DVLA, just to show that people know what his organisation is up to, bring along some press and do an interview outside the house.
But as far as this looks, you've ticked the wrong box, and that's not the DVLA's fault, that would be your fault.
I'm not big fan of the EU, Personally I think we should be well out of it, we give far more that we get from it, and what we get from it, isn't all that great anyway. Just more red tape to bind us with.
I'd suggest getting politically active, voting to get out of the EU and petitioning government for changes you want.
Free dental care for diabetics for example, we get medical exemption certificates, which covers our insulin, but poor cerculation can have an awful effect on our gums then teeth, so why not free dental as well?

I can see me starting a thread on this, so will stop ranting now. Not long had my insulin and still need to eat, so please do pardon the rant, i get ranty when the sugars are low.

You ticked the wrong box, so state as much and request a new form. If they give you stick about something else, then highlight that, and we'll cross that bridge then.
 
Being a Diabetic ,does cause havoc ,with the DVLA ,and they must hate it when ALL diabetics cause them problems ,i myself have had this dreadfull illness for 45 years ,been a driver for most of that time , 18 monthes ago ,the dvla had there routine tests ,even though i have been stabalized for a number of years now ,i failed there eastman visual field test ,all becos of one laser burn which now is inside the central area ,i have had no laser treatment for 25 years ,because i not needed any ?but dvla are holding this against me now ,all because of the new eu regulations ,i am devastated ,they said i can appeal ,but have heard ,the courts take dvla medical board side ,so is there any hope in trying i wrote a letter to them ,shown below


how can somebody ,who has only one eye ,obtain a license ?yet I have only a pinhole,
causing me this problem ,yet I have been deigned a license ,what's this ,SPECIAL CIRCUMSTANCES ,
I ASKED FOR ?I only wish to be able to drive a car ,nothing else ?just for pottering about locally ,
being a diabetic for 45 years ,I now suffer from cardiac vascular disease of the legs ,
which causes sever pain in both my legs ,I am still of working age ,I have been provided with a bus pass ,
which does not entitle me to use until 9.30 am , but I start work at 7 am ,
so I have no choice but to walk to work ,so this pass is useless ,if this is deigned ,
it will end my working career ,these so called specialists ?don't care what damage in the long term they do ,
some people rely on a car to get about ?.
----- Original Message -----

To: dvla

Dear Mrs. Evans ,I don't think your departments at the DVLA
treat people fairly ,why do you publicize so much
,that we try to help people back on the road , to me I get the impression ,
if you had any kind of surgery ,you haven,to got a chance ,of ever driving again ?.
who ever writes your guidelines ,on driving , doesn't know what they are talking about ,
I have a pinhead size in my vision ,a pinhead ,and because of laser treatment 35 years ago ,
somebody down there is holding this against me ,because of guide lines ,I have been driving
since I was 17 years old with no accidents , I am now 55 , you had reports from my eye surgeon ,
I past your vision test at the local driving test centre ,you had my GP results ,
but yet you still hold this against me , if your Diabetic ,like me and looked after yourself ,
obrversally as far as the DVLA are concerned ,it doesn't matter , just remember nobody is a 100% perfect ,
but you still handout licensees to anyone ,as long as they can read that number plate ,
whether there dangerous on the road or not ,drunken drivers ,don't get as much grief over there licenses ,
as much as a diabetic ,and they sometimes KILL people ,
how often do you hear a diabetic has killed somebody ,not very often ?if a tall .But drunken drivers all the time .
or young lads ,showing off to there mates ,does reading a number plate at 20 mtrs stop them ,
no, it should be the same rule then for everybody ,not just people with diabetes .


,
 
Does DVLA consult GP or Diabetic nurses before renewing individual persons driving licence?
 
I've only just read your post on this thread. I too lost my licence due to failing the Esterman test but did, eventually manage to get it back.

Firstly, if you haven't already done so, you can submit another test which you should be able to get done at your opticians.

I told the DVLA that I had difficulty in concentrating on the Esterman test and asked for another type of visual fields test - the Goldman test. They initially ignored this, just saying their decision must stand. I suspect this wasn't actually passed on to the medical team.. I then read, on the DVLA website that there had been some changes to the rules and people with stabilised retinopathy would now be able to be considered under the "Exceptional Cases" rules, which didn't apply to us before.

I wrote to them for more information on the subject and this prompted them to review my case and they decided that they would, "in the first instance", send me for the Goldman test. I passed that test and got my licence back. It took some time but I'm glad I persevered.

You can read the full version of my story on this thread: http://www.diabetes.co.uk/diabetes%2Dforum/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=19473

Contact me if you think I can help you further.

John
 
I lost my licence in July which came as a huge shock. But yes, the rules have changed and the DVLA does clearly record them somewhere (they just don't publicise the change). For months I was angry that I lost my licence wrongly, but it was all against the books. Luckily my Dr made me surrender my licence rather than have it revoked at the next screening. He has said I can re-apply every six months until the DVLA accept me. Again, I used the wrong wording with my Dr and told him partner helped me when I know all but one case I could have and would have managed myself. I have now learnt to read up everything on the DVLA website regularly and very carefully phrase what I tell Dr so it isn't mis-interpreted.
 
Sorry to hear that, Hope you get it overturned soon, Just tell them you made a mistake.

Well I as many more like me have not informed the DVLA of my condition, because if I lose my license, I lose my job and everything else.
I have never had a hypo that requires assistance, I know when I drop below 4.5 and treat it immediately. I always have a bag with me with Lucozade glucose tablets, insulin, needles etc wherever I am and I know I pose no threat to the public. I dont have daytime hypos, normally late at night when I get them as Is the case with most diabetics. I'm fit and healthy, best ever results on my last check so I see no reason to tell them so they can make a balls up and ruin my life.
 

If you are on insulin you may find that you are officially driving without a valid licence as you have not notified DVLA of your condition. If you have an accident (even if it is not your fault) and DVLA find out you haven't notified them you will be in trouble (work should know for the insurance if you drive their vehicles too).
https://www.gov.uk/diabetes-driving
HTH
Angie
 

Not only is your driving licence invalid, but your insurance is also invalid...

Sorry but you are a Threat to the public, because you are insulin dependant full stop.... Good control doesn't prevent you from being one!

A career change is far better than living a life knowing that your total selfish behaviour cost an innocent person their life, destroyed and completely ruined their family lives...

I had to change jobs due to the driving aspect... Wasn't easy more so because it meant that I took a 50% cut in income, made more difficult because I was the main earner. But we adjusted to living on a much smaller income but no regrets about my decision...
 
I feel so sorry for you.Yet again its another organisation putting another nail in our coffins.I do hope you get your driving licence back. Note to everyone don't tell the DVLA the truth in future. I am the same as you and only have the odd hypo at night. When my driving licence comes up for renewal I am now going to tell a lie in future.
 
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