An all-in attempt at remission/reversal!

Beating-My-Betes

Well-Known Member
Messages
662
Disclaimer: I am neither a medical doctor, nor a nutritional scientist. Nothing that I do or say in this thread should be taken as medical advice, nor is it to taken as a suggestion that anyone follow suit. This is nothing more than an n=1 experiment, and not intended to replace anyone's current treatment protocol.

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This will be my last post for a while.

Started today with another reference test. Why Coke? An idea given to me by another member. I had actually planned, like I usually do, to start everything off with an OGTT. I do this to as a way of demonstrating just how bad things are, before endeavouring to imrove it all. but this time 'round I just couldn't bring myself to do it. It's just plain disgusting (So much for sugar addiction, eh!), and made even worse by having to be chugged down first thing in the morning. I also thought the Coke would be terrible, but it was preferable. Also comes in at half the energy and carbs.

I will still test OGTT in future, and reference against the other occasions that are documented in this thread, but i'm in no hurry.

Anyway...still a very mucn non-rollercoaster like experience. Not too dissimilar a trajectory than other test results posted in this thread.

Weight-loss still chugging along at an enjoyable pace, though at this stage its still mostly going to be water-weight (Dropping salt from 6-8g per-day, to about 1g will do that).

Coca-Cola Test - 19:09:2023 (Day 6).png


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Beating-My-Betes

Well-Known Member
Messages
662
Disclaimer: I am neither a medical doctor, nor a nutritional scientist. Nothing that I do or say in this thread should be taken as medical advice, nor is it to taken as a suggestion that anyone follow suit. This is nothing more than an n=1 experiment, and not intended to replace anyone's current treatment protocol.

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Day 0006 - 19:09:2023.png
 

caffree

Member
Messages
12
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
Seems that personal blogs have gone the way of the Dodo. So, hopefully I can use this space to hold myself accountable, towards success.

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DISCLAIMER: Nothing that I communicate within this introduction, or within the ongoing thread, is to be taken as medical or dietary advice. This is something that I am doing as an experiment, albeit based on success I’ve seen elsewhere, over many years.

While I won’t be strictly adhering to the Mastering Diabetes plan, I’ll be moving towards it. For those interested in other treatment options an ever-increasing roll-call of success (Both for T1D and T2D) on a high-carb, low-fat plan, can be found at the following links:

https://www.masteringdiabetes.org/case-studies/

https://www.masteringdiabetes.org/success/

This experiment is not intended to dissuade anyone away from their current plan. If what you’re doing is working for you, then it’s working.

If anyone else is persuaded to give it a try, this is between them and their family, doctor etc. Like I said, it’s not a recommendation I’m giving. Certainly, any switch from a low-carb diet to one such as this comes with certain considerations.

Lastly: Everything I eat is vegan. To save me the redundancy of writing “Vegan” before everything, just know that it is.

———————————————————————-


Regarding logging:

For the moment, I’ll try to log in greater detail (Though I deliberately avoid bothering to measure vegetables). But, at various moments, I’ll likely step back from such tracking and just document food photos, FBG and daily steps.

Will test various meals, along with a home-made OGTT to get an idea of baseline readings and ongoing trends. Will also occasionally use the ‘MySugr’ app to get a weekly HbA1C estimate

Regarding product substitutes: Cronometer’s product options are increasing all the time, but there are obviously still many things missing. Where I find something missing, I’ll just find a similar enough substitute. I’m not going to spend any time checking options to see which substitute is closest in macronutrient content to the one I have. Within the context or a 300-400-carb-grams-per-day diet, it’s neither here nor there whether Morrisons Strawberry Jam contains 3g more/less of carbs than the one I’m using.

Lastly, if I repeat a meal I will use the same photo repeatedly. And if there’re two pictures alongside each other, with the same food but in different quantities, it means I went back for another serving.

———————————————————————-


The Plan:


Very simple.

Nothing is forbidden except for animal-products.

Falls somewhere between ‘Eatwell’ and ‘THE’ guidelines, albeit with lower consumption of fats than those plans would allow for.

While I have no problems designing an RDA-busting version of a plant-based diet, I intend to let all that go…at least for a while. I’ll be eating more ‘intuitively’, to the extent that I’ll just eat what I want and when I want. If I want to eat nothing but ‘white’ spaghetti and mushrooms for a week, then so be it.

Also, the first couple of months will be tight, financially-speaking. Food will be basic, and I will be eating heavily on. Multi-vitamin supplement, to hopefully fill in some of the cracks

Another reason for simplicity is that an unfortunate and seemingly un-resolvable issue in a shared kitchen has ended with me now cooking all my meals in my bedroom, using a multi-cooker (Non-pressure). While I’m no stranger to bulk-cooking, it certainly makes weighing portions a lot more difficult (Easy to weight ingredients going in, but not of portions going out). Anyway, one-pot spaghetti being so easy to make is likely to have a huge bearing on my diet, for the foreseeable future.

Other than that, meals will generally be comprised of rice, and/or pasta, and/or potatoes and/or bread (The 4 main food groups), with some variant of cooked and raw veggies (Budget allowing). Fruit, as and when I can (Again, budget allowing).


Why not the ‘Mastering Diabetes’ plan ?

While I understand the reasoning behind their recommendations, the imposition of arbitrary restrictions is not something I’m currently interested in.

Veganism is restrictive enough.

Moreover, I don’t believe the foods that they warn against, within ‘appropriate’ limits, would have any negative implications for the success of the low-fat paradigm and its treatment of diabetes etc. Essentially, I believe success will be determined by keeping fat low enough to not cause issues with the higher-carb intake, and maintaining a caloric/energy deficit.

Who knows…I might naturally end up eating much closer to this plan, in the end. But if I do it will have to come naturally, and not via others’ rulebook.


Why low protein?

This is a short-term arrangement, and part of the experiment. My interest is in maximising carbs intake.


Why reduced levels of activity?

For many years, I’ve read too many people claim the only reason people can maintain a high-carb diet is due to commensurate levels of activity.

I don’t buy it…

Exercise will be limited to short walks (Longer walks on days where I’m shopping further afield) and small amounts of very calm Hatha Yoga.


What do I mean by remission/reversal?

Ability to reach and maintain a drug-free non-diabetic HbA1C, to reach and maintain in-range fasting BG readings and the ability to pass an OGTT.


And if I ‘fail’?

Well, I could fail in the sense of not making it past day 3…like always. Or maybe I find out that I've already pushed myself too far for too long, and I can't reach remission


What ‘ills’ do I hope to leave behind? (This list may be update, as I remember things).


Insulin-resistance.

High BP/Hypertension.

Blurry vision.

The occasional pins ’n’ needles and shooting pains in feet

As many excess pounds as possible.

Trigger-fingers in both hands. Had both my wrists operated on for carpal-tunnel, about 20 years ago. And though I suspect that the TF is lifestyle-related, it’d be nice to rule out the possibility of nerve-damage having been done during those operations.

Inflammation (Most obvious in hands) that prevents me being able to close my hands properly, and causing the little-finger on my right-hand to start to kink.

Awful Acid Reflux

Bad, restless sleep, brought on by frequent toilet-breaks, night-sweats, apnea and the aforementioned Reflux

Dehydration.

Food hangovers.

Post-meal energy crashes (Usually only happens after lunch, but can be more often depending on other lifestyle factors)

Headaches

A growing dependency on alcohol. I used to be a get-tipsy-once-every-few-months kind of guy. But this year, due mainly to the depression, that’s accelerated to the point of being almost-drunk a few times a week.

General listlessness

I’d like to reduce anxiety and depression, to the extent that lifestyle factors are to blame. Situational (Both personal and that which pertains to the current state of the world, humanity etc. are likely to remain out-of-reach).

(Added 18/01/23) Almost-constant wheeze on out-breath.


I’ve saved these three for last, as they are much rarer in occurrence and harder to track and attribute:

Retinal/Ocular migraines - Supposedly accompanied by migraine headaches, but I’ve never experienced the two together.

Vertigo - This is something that I experience very rarely, and only within the last couple of years. Attacks can be pretty severe and last a couple of days. While these would be harder to track as having been ‘cured’ by lifestyle improvements, I’m pretty sure that the last two episodes coincided with me having cut huge swathes of my sodium intake, too quickly.

Heart palpitations - Similar to above, in that they only seem to occur when I try to make drastic changes to my sodium intake, water-intake and sweat output, without the commensurate changes in other electrolytes or proper consideration for a slower adaptation/down-cycling process.
I think, 'Beater', we're all getting depressed about the state of the world and the terrible things going on in Gaza and Ukraine. No wonder we need a drink. Interesting about the causes of palpitations; I get these but thought it was psychosomatic. Must check it out. Best of luck with the Plan anyway.
 
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Beating-My-Betes

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662
I think, 'Beater', we're all getting depressed about the state of the world and the terrible things going on in Gaza and Ukraine. No wonder we need a drink. Interesting about the causes of palpitations; I get these but thought it was psychosomatic. Must check it out. Best of luck with the Plan anyway.
Well, there can be various causes of palpitations, likely including psychosomatic from stress etc. Electrolyte imbalance will certainly do it, though. During my recent illness I had palpitations and dizziness on a few days ( couldn’t stand without starting to collapse). These events were most likely triggered by the extreme dehydration I was experiencing and only really appeared after nights of extreme sweating. Not only that, but because fruit was the only food I could stomach my body was throwing out tons of the sodium I’d been holding onto for so long. It was a bit messy
 

Beating-My-Betes

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Messages
662
Been ill for over a month now, and didn't think I'd get back to this until I was fully recovered. But if I keep going how I've been going I'll gain back all the kilos lost recently. Went from 119kg down to about 105kg, in about 3 weeks. My intake was pretty muh fruit only, as it was all I could bring myself to eat (Smoothies, juice, grapes and lots of clementines. Tracking was difficult and so I just abandoned it. However, it seems from the last tracking I did that I was eating about 180 carbs in about 700-ish calories. Not surprising that when I got my appetite back things went a little hay-wire.

Not sure how to track this current endeavour, either. I no longer have access to kitchen scales, and won't for a few more weeks. Today i used cups as measurements. But my heart fell when I went to try and track it all. I can barely be bothered. At this point I don't need to track for myself. I've one it enough to know what portion sizes equate to which outcomes, and really I'm only going to the extent I have been to provide some proof for the doubters. The reality, however, is that it's unlikely people will accept or believe, even if the documented proof is there. So I am thinking to ease up on the tracking. Will keep tabs on certain days, but on others I will just upload photos.

Seems I managed to catch my weight at just under 110kg, so I can still put that 9kg in the bank. But over the last few weeks my BP had really improved. Those gains have now been lost, also.

Anyway, for better or for worse, here's Day 1: Fruit smoothies, and a couple of plates of rice, sweet-potatoes and soup (Contains veggies and more sweet-potatoes).


Day 0001 - 28:01:24.png
 

HSSS

Expert
Messages
7,476
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Can I check you are under medical care - especially for your blood pressure as it’s dangerously high. The high fbg which likely climbs higher still during the day on your diet is also really needing some action to reduce it as it will be doing harm like this. I’m worried for you.
 

AndBreathe

Master
Retired Moderator
Messages
11,345
Type of diabetes
I reversed my Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Been ill for over a month now, and didn't think I'd get back to this until I was fully recovered. But if I keep going how I've been going I'll gain back all the kilos lost recently. Went from 119kg down to about 105kg, in about 3 weeks. My intake was pretty muh fruit only, as it was all I could bring myself to eat (Smoothies, juice, grapes and lots of clementines. Tracking was difficult and so I just abandoned it. However, it seems from the last tracking I did that I was eating about 180 carbs in about 700-ish calories. Not surprising that when I got my appetite back things went a little hay-wire.

Not sure how to track this current endeavour, either. I no longer have access to kitchen scales, and won't for a few more weeks. Today i used cups as measurements. But my heart fell when I went to try and track it all. I can barely be bothered. At this point I don't need to track for myself. I've one it enough to know what portion sizes equate to which outcomes, and really I'm only going to the extent I have been to provide some proof for the doubters. The reality, however, is that it's unlikely people will accept or believe, even if the documented proof is there. So I am thinking to ease up on the tracking. Will keep tabs on certain days, but on others I will just upload photos.

Seems I managed to catch my weight at just under 110kg, so I can still put that 9kg in the bank. But over the last few weeks my BP had really improved. Those gains have now been lost, also.

Anyway, for better or for worse, here's Day 1: Fruit smoothies, and a couple of plates of rice, sweet-potatoes and soup (Contains veggies and more sweet-potatoes).


View attachment 65856
I’ve rather lost track of what you are trying to achieve to be honest, and Due to your profile settings I can’t easily go back to your initial postings.

What ailed you in recent weeks?
 

Beating-My-Betes

Well-Known Member
Messages
662
I’ve rather lost track of what you are trying to achieve to be honest, and Due to your profile settings I can’t easily go back to your initial postings.

What ailed you in recent weeks?
Really not sure. Seems to be too long and drawn-out for the flu (almost 6 weeks on and still coughing up a bit of phlegm) and I tested negative for the rona. Definitely on the tail-end though.

Not sure what you mean about my settings, however. What info are you looking for that you’re being prevented from finding?
 

HSSS

Expert
Messages
7,476
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Really not sure. Seems to be too long and drawn-out for the flu (almost 6 weeks on and still coughing up a bit of phlegm) and I tested negative for the rona. Definitely on the tail-end though.

Not sure what you mean about my settings, however. What info are you looking for that you’re being prevented from finding?
The cough after covid can last weeks/months for some.

And as for testing many report the lateral flows are not being very effective anymore. I had it over new year. The first 4 tests after symptoms started were negative. Only the 5th test on day 4 was positive (and onwards waiting for the all clear).

How many people even test once now let alone that many times? How many get a single negative test and write it off as something else? It’s a story I hear regularly amongst people that do diligently and repeatedly test (mostly the most vulnerable or people that mix with them).

Official surveys of levels for how widespread it is now are based on lateral flows now, not PCR’s, so based on the lack of sensitivity now it is likely they are even higher than identified (despite infections being the highest they’ve ever been a month ago - thankfully not hospitalisations though)
 
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Beating-My-Betes

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Messages
662
Bit of an off-piste day toay.

I've noticed since my appetite returned that I've quickly succumbed to eating a lot of sodium and that's something I'm really determined to reduce (While amping-up potassium). It's harder to go back to prioritising fruit, despite it having been such a life-saver over the last month. But I'm determined to pull it back. Today was an opportunity to try and get rid of these denser cravings. I also indulged in more bread than I have of late, as I want to do without it for a while. it's not that I have any particularly bad reactions to it, nor is it uniquely fattening (No food or macro is). But it's about nutritional opportunity-cost. Essentially, the opportunity-cost of eating bread is the amount of calories that could be better spent on foods with more nutritional power. This becomes more important the less calories I eat, the amount of which I am planning to lower incrementally.

Anyway, here's today:

Day 0003- 30:01:24.png
 

Beating-My-Betes

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Messages
662
Having a terrible time with fats at the moment. Generally, since getting my appetite back I've found that I feel nauseous after eating. I feel a bit sick and get body-aches. But when I eat fat those feelings are heightened. I definitely feel like it’s something to do with me still being somewhat ill.

Somewhat bittersweet, really. Bitter ‘cause I've really been enjoying eating peanuts and cashews. Sweet 'cause it's so easy for me to over-eat on fats.

Back to tracking tomorrow, albeit somewhat loosely. Might have to buy a new scale, though. On one hand it’s a heap of unnecessary added stress. On the other hand, the extra accountability is somehow more motivating.
 

Beating-My-Betes

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Messages
662
Sigh...

This is extremely frustrating.

It shouldn't have come as any surprise to me that losing 15kg in 3 weeks would result in a very large physical and mental pressure to regain. This wasn’t an intentional crash-diet, but the results were definitely the same. What's most frustrating is that because I'm still somewhat ill, food is just not enjoyable to me. I feel nauseous after pretty much everything I eat, with overt-fats giving me the most nausea, and fruit next to none. Everything in between leaves me feeling close to vomiting and with body aches/chills. And yet, every moment I'm being comepelled to eat.

My original intent for this plan was to not impose any limits on type of foods, but to concentrate on amount consumed. But with this huge push to regain, accompanied by the ill effects I think I'm going to have to impose some stricter rules.

As mentioned, fruit seems to be the most benign. Veggies (raw and cooked) also seem to not be too bad. Potatoes and sweet-potatoes are next in line in terms of nausea. Pasta isn't too bad, either. But I tend to eat that in larger amounts, which triggers the nausea. Same with protein. After weeks of low-calories and fruit, protein is much harder to digest. Given time that would change. But it's not something I'm interested in tackling while this nausea continues.

So, this coming week I will be mostly eating fruit (incl. dried), veg and potatoes/sweet-potatoes. Once the nausea stops, I'll add things back in.

Tomorrow will be the last time i reset the counter.
 
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Beating-My-Betes

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Messages
662
Haha! Just realised this thread has had 20k views. That’s quite a sizeable audience watching me fail consistently and spectacularly :D

Let’s see if we can’t turn this around and give the assembled throng a proper show

 

Antje77

Oracle
Retired Moderator
Messages
19,486
Type of diabetes
LADA
Treatment type
Insulin
Haha! Just realised this thread has had 20k views. That’s quite a sizeable audience watching me fail consistently and spectacularly :D

Let’s see if we can’t turn this around and give the assembled throng a proper show

I'm sorry if this is a disappointment, but if you look at 'members online' you'll see that the forum is constantly viewed by hundreds of robots...
 
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zand

Master
Messages
10,790
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Sigh...

This is extremely frustrating.

It shouldn't have come as any surprise to me that losing 15kg in 3 weeks would result in a very large physical and mental pressure to regain. This wasn’t an intentional crash-diet, but the results were definitely the same. What's most frustrating is that because I'm still somewhat ill, food is just not enjoyable to me. I feel nauseous after pretty much everything I eat, with overt-fats giving me the most nausea, and fruit next to none. Everything in between leaves me feeling close to vomiting and with body aches/chills. And yet, every moment I'm being comepelled to eat.

My original intent for this plan was to not impose any limits on type of foods, but to concentrate on amount consumed. But with this huge push to regain, accompanied by the ill effects I think I'm going to have to impose some stricter rules.

As mentioned, fruit seems to be the most benign. Veggies (raw and cooked) also seem to not be too bad. Potatoes and sweet-potatoes are next in line in terms of nausea. Pasta isn't too bad, either. But I tend to eat that in larger amounts, which triggers the nausea. Same with protein. After weeks of low-calories and fruit, protein is much harder to digest. Given time that would change. But it's not something I'm interested in tackling while this nausea continues.

So, this coming week I will be mostly eating fruit (incl. dried), veg and potatoes/sweet-potatoes. Once the nausea stops, I'll add things back in.

Tomorrow will be the last time i reset the counter.
When I had Covid 1st time round, almost 4 years ago, I was very ill with it. Like you I ate mostly fruit and dried fruit. It was a long time before I could stomach any protein and the first proteins I had were from legumes. As you know, I prefer to low carb, but I was ill and had to eat what I could keep down. So what I'm saying is...be gentle on yourself. This is not a failure, this is needs must and that's not failing at all.
 

Beating-My-Betes

Well-Known Member
Messages
662
Not much fruit today, although the bars are raw fruit bars. It's pretty normal for the first couple of days on lower-calories for me to need denser stuff anyway. But it will hopefully settle down. Nausea was bad after lunch, but not so bad after dinner. Will prepare a smoothie tomight, ready for the morning. Can't make that much noise in the morning, and I don't want to be buying expensive smoothies and bars every day.

Was quite surprised to weigh-in at 110 given the week I've had. But I'll take it. If I do manage to stop the rise, then 110kg is still 9 kilos lighter than I was in Decmber. And that's not a drop to be sniffed at.
Day 0001 - 05:02:24.png
 
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