Desparately need answers

[sammy123]

Hello everyone
I was diagonsed with polycystic ovariam syndrome in sept last year. My ac1 level was 6.2 and I was told I was pre-diabetic.

Some of the things I was experiencing
- excessive hunger ( i would eat and then 45-60 min later id be starving-)
- rapid weight gain
- fat accumulation around belly and hips
-acne

I was put on metformin 500 mg once a day and saw very little changes to my weight.

I did a ac1 test again and got 6.1. I explained to the doctor that metformin isnt helping me. The doctor said stop taking it and see how I go. Will take another test next month to see ac1 level. I woke up one random morning and took a fasting blood sugar test the one where you pinch your finger. I got 6.8 reading.

Im working out 5-6 times a week involving 30 min cardio and 2 classes of strength training. Im trying to do low gi and low carb but im just ALWAYS hungry and to top it up ive put on 4 kg in the last 2 weeks and wake up looking 3 months pregnant!

Im not sure what to do im simply depressed I use to be so skinny

 

[Daibell]

Hi and welcome. I can't comment on the effect of POS. It's important when low-carbing to have enough proteins and fats to keep you feeling full. Reducing carbs a lot and increasing the other foods avoids the carb-high after a meal which leads to hunger shortly after. If you're feeling hungry between main meals then go for nuts, berries or cheese. Note that althoug low-GI carbs are always better than high-GI they are still carbs which will turn to glucose and then fat in the body so do focus on low carbs.

 

[AndBreathe]

Hello everyone
I was diagonsed with polycystic ovariam syndrome in sept last year. My ac1 level was 6.2 and I was told I was pre-diabetic.

Some of the things I was experiencing
- excessive hunger ( i would eat and then 45-60 min later id be starving-)
- rapid weight gain
- fat accumulation around belly and hips
-acne

I was put on metformin 500 mg once a day and saw very little changes to my weight.

I did a ac1 test again and got 6.1. I explained to the doctor that metformin isnt helping me. The doctor said stop taking it and see how I go. Will take another test next month to see ac1 level. I woke up one random morning and took a fasting blood sugar test the one where you pinch your finger. I got 6.8 reading.

Im working out 5-6 times a week involving 30 min cardio and 2 classes of strength training. Im trying to do low gi and low carb but im just ALWAYS hungry and to top it up ive put on 4 kg in the last 2 weeks and wake up looking 3 months pregnant!

Im not sure what to do im simply depressed I use to be so skinny

Hello Sammy.

I'm sorry you're having these issues. You point out several things you're unhappy about but it could be helpful for us to understand what your first concern is, then a second perhaps? That way those of us responding can ensure we address your main concern, rather than make general guesses?

 

[DavidGrahamJones]

Hello everyone
I was diagonsed with polycystic ovariam syndrome in sept last year. My ac1 level was 6.2 and I was told I was pre-diabetic.

Some of the things I was experiencing
- excessive hunger ( i would eat and then 45-60 min later id be starving-)
- rapid weight gain
- fat accumulation around belly and hips
-acne

I was put on metformin 500 mg once a day and saw very little changes to my weight.

I did a ac1 test again and got 6.1. I explained to the doctor that metformin isnt helping me. The doctor said stop taking it and see how I go. Will take another test next month to see ac1 level. I woke up one random morning and took a fasting blood sugar test the one where you pinch your finger. I got 6.8 reading.

Im working out 5-6 times a week involving 30 min cardio and 2 classes of strength training. Im trying to do low gi and low carb but im just ALWAYS hungry and to top it up ive put on 4 kg in the last 2 weeks and wake up looking 3 months pregnant!

Im not sure what to do im simply depressed I use to be so skinny

Hi Sammy, welcome to the forum. I know very little about PCOS but a bit more about diabetes.

Metformin is prescribed to ladies with PCOS and also to diabetics to help with insulin resistance. From some of the comments that I've read here and on other diabetes forums, Metformin dose might have to be increased before anything is noticed, 500mg a day doesn't seem like a lot, but I'm not the medic. I have been taking it since1997 and I have never noticed any weight loss although the diarrhea that it caused would make you think I was losing loads.

I've been reading https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polycystic_ovary_syndrome to make myself a little more aware of what the condition is and you must already know that acne is one of the symptoms. Rapid weight gain is always frustrating if you're not eating more, but the bottom line is the metabolism and some part of the Krebs cycle controls whether you store or use the energy that you eat, and it changes. As has been suggested, lowering carbs will help lowering BG and there might be room to increase protein and fat to help overcome hunger. As a long term dieter, I know all about hunger, drinking water is used by many dieters to help overcome the hunger feelings. As for where fat is stored, we don't seem to have much control over that, mine is around the middle, which may or may not be better than on the derriere.

It might be worth looking into nutrition rather than just diet, I've consulted a Nutritional Therapist for a few years and found her advice to be extremely useful. You need to find a qualified practitioner, a member of BANT. Just another avenue to explore, in fact I'm sure she would have recommendations for the PCOS that would help.

Do have a look at http://www.diabetes.co.uk/diabetes_care/blood-sugar-level-ranges.html, it will give you an idea of what your BG levels should be.

I'd like to suggest weighing daily, I started when I first couldn't explain weight gain because I was eating much less than my BMR (using Harris Benedict formula). It showed that I had gained 2.5 kgs overnight on one occasion so obviously water. Although it doesn't explain all weight gain, you might be surprised.

Good luck, you know where we are.

 

[Finsky]

Hi there...we have some ladies here with PCOS and diabetes....myself included. As already mentioned...Metformin is something that will help regulate things, but won't help you with weight loss.
As for your hunger bangs...something I used to suffer myself too. My trigger for excessive hunger was carbonated drinks and alcohol. Not that I used lot of alcohol anyway but just couple of glasses of wine and I was SOOOO HUNGRY.
So without saying...no more of those liquids...or very rarely Carbs will fuel hunger feeling too , no matter how 'good' they might be. I also ditched looong ago any margarines (man made fats) and turned using butter....and now when I have taken on LCHF diet....increasing fats in my diet means that I rarely feel 'head' hunger at all....only real 'tummy is empty/no energy left' hunger. Fat intake will help your with your hormone 'works' too, carbs don't.
The good news is...that both conditions can be eased if not bought totally under control by diet changes. Although PCOS is hormonal thing...and you might need some sort of hormone treatment to bring it under control, what you eat and how your blood sugars are kept under control will have big effect....both conditions often go hand in hand.
Have you had blood tests done to check your hormone balances?

 

[Brunneria]

Hi and welcome!
I second everything @Finsky says.

I am all too familiar with The PCOS Hunger, and the only thing that has ever got rid of it has been the switch to very low carb, and introducing fat to kill the cravings.

Basically, if the cravings have got you to the extent you describe (and it is a truly miserable experience), then you have to keep dropping carbs until they go away - at which point you have found your own personal carb tolerance level. It may sound like deprivation, but it really isn't. The point at which you realise the relief of being craving free is really liberating.

But i only got to that point by increasing the fat and protein while reducing the carbs. They are the things that kill the cravings.
Meals like steak and salad, with mayo. Or roast chicken with masses of low carb veg slathered in butter. No craving can compete with a big meal like that. Cheese, nuts and cold meat as snacks. Low carb hot chocolate made with cream. Make sure you reach for them instead of your usual carby snacks.

Keep it up for several days (never go hungry) and the cravings WILL fade. And if they come back, you know you have exceeded your personal carb tolerance - and just kill them again.

 

[ickihun]

As a long term infertile PCOS sufferer i used metformin long term resulted in me having 2 wonderful children. Not before a professor a st.thomas' s hospital london refusing me metformin whilst progressing through to IVF.
I was on the trials in london for pcos. My periods were every 8-9 months apart. No ovulation no babies. I was 3 stone lighter than now. Metformin took some time to really solve my hairy face and missing periods. I had no diagnosis of diabetes then either. In fact I was training every day too. Eating like a mouse with salad galore.
Is it the weight gain which is bothering you the most? Some lose on lchf diet and once it's settled into a diet for you it can be very successful. My problem is the underactive thyroid gaining my weight too. I'm not on metformin anymore because of bad side affects from very very long term use. I'd like to try it again in the future thou. A brilliant tablet. My periods returned immediately starting use.
In the past before a laparoscopy to diagnose damaged ovary from ruptured appendix and the pcos I used good quality ginseng which made me feel less ill.

 

[sammy123]

Thankyou all for your responses!
My main concern is excessive hunger- excessive eating - inability to lose weight. These are all so linked and I just dont know how to go about it. Ive upped my dose from 500 mg to 1000mg and it somewhat has suppressed my appetite but partly because I feel sick coz of the medication like at dinner i cant seem to eat anything i just have water and fruit and yoghurt.

The 500 mg metformin was making me more hunhry so I have speculated a bit and thought one of the two possibilities have arisen -
1) my sugar levels are normal and im not insulin resistant so metformin is lowering my blood sugar causing hunger
2) my sugar levels are out of whack and 500mg is just not enough so i should up my dose and see how i feel.

Without monitoring my blood sugar its hard to say anything although ive ordered a machine and that will come next week

In the meantime ill try keep a food log and stick to 5 meals per day. Something that relieves my hunger is metamucil not sure what its called in uk but very popular here in Australia. Its a powered fibre supplement you mix in water and drink it and after a bit it becomes jelly and fills your stomach up its working well i can sleep at ease at night otherwisw id have to wake up most night at 3-4 am and binge whatever was in the fridge and i couldn't help myself because stomach was so restless and I just couldnt sleep!

Lastly what are some vegetarian friendly low carb foods i can start to eat??

 

[Mep]

I got diagnosed with PCOS at the age of 25 and I had most of the symptoms. I think the biggest problem is PCOS causes insulin resistance which makes it hard to lose weight as we generally have excess insulin floating around than what is needed. My weight has been up and down over the years. I'm currently overweight again. But what I can say is I was obsessed for quite a few years after diagnosis with exercise and watching everything I ate. I used to start my mornings with half hour of weights, then half hour of cardio... then I'd come home from work and do another hour of cardio. I did that 7 days a week for a long while. I even got ridiculous with doing 2.5 hours of cardio some days. What was driving me though is that my sugar levels and weight weren't really significantly improving despite me busting my butt and being so disciplined. I tried the low carb diet for a year and saw no results either and wound up with high cholesterol so had to come off that (I'm one of the few that gets high cholesterol eating like that). I've tried quite a few things over the years. I was put on an optifast shake diet at one point to see if that would help kick start the 15 kgs I needed to lose at the time. I only lost half the weight that most people would lose in the same timeframe. Any time I attempt weight loss it is slow and painful. My family and friends thought I was nuts for a while and told me I was overdoing things. But with PCOS I think that is just the nature of it... it is a hormonal condition. I didn't see much improvement either on metformin. I didn't tolerate metformin too well mind you, but stayed on it for 5 years. I think the only advice I can give is just to keep at it and do the best you can. I have since been diagnosed with a lot of other stuff making it very hard to move pretty much without trouble. Plus I'm on quite a few meds that have weight gain as a side effect which also includes the pill to treat my PCOS. But I just view that I can only do what I can do at the moment. In fact nothing I eat at the moment is good for me which is depressing. With me it's a case of eating the lesser of two evils most of the time. There's a few of us on this forum with PCOS though... feel free to post and I'm sure one or more of us will respond. I wish you the best. (sorry I'm probably rambling as getting groggy from some strong meds I took earlier).

 

[Brunneria]

@sammy123

You say that you are not insulin resistant, but you have PCOS.
I am not an expert, but I thought that a diagnosis of PCOS automatically meant that you had insulin resistance - that it simply came with the territory. I am happy to be wrong on that, if anyone has better information?

Has anyone actually tested your insulin levels? It can be measured, but is not a standard test here in the UK. And we can have significant insulin resistance for years if not decades before we become pre or diabetic, and our blood glucose begins to rise.

 

[drakman]

I am insulin dependant and have been for 8 months now, what amazed me was going to Slimming World, I changed my eating habits and how much I eat using it, I now eat more vegetables and a LOT more fruit, I have to eat some carbs to stay healthy and actually get a bit low with my sugars at times, the answer is simple eat something, but the right things, I do not often get hungry now between meals and my sugars are far better controlled, it is not down to the drugs as much as the change in how and what I eat, I have lost a bit of weight but this was not my primary concern, it was learning a new way to eat and a new way to judge how much is right to avoid snacking, if I need a snack it is always fruit now and that is enough
I am heathier and feel much better in myself so it was worth joining and using it to work out how I need to eat now, maybe it can help you, focus on health though and not weight loss and a way of eating better

 

[kelvin45]

Hi, i know nothing about pos other thatn what i have just read here in the forum. There is one thing you mention, you do a cardio workout 5 to 6 times a week, what a lot of people don't realise is that when you excercise you do lose fat but you also develope muscle which is usually denser than the fat so you can actually put on weight whilst working out. Ive been taking Metformin for over 15 years and my weight has stayed fairly satble all that time.

 

[sukara]

hi
I was diagnosed with PCOS in my mid 30's, im now mid 50's.
PCOS and insulin resistance do go together unfortunately. I was told a very long time ago I was insulin resistant but took no notice of the warning.
I was diagnosed T2 in 2012, and my weight partly due to PCOS and over eating had spiralled to nearly 17 stone, I am now 91/2 stone. sorry but the only way to do it and take control of my T2 and PCOS was to loose the weight with changes to life style, LCHF and exercise. I do believe Metformin has helped but I was on 2x1000 a day for a year, im now down to 1x1000 a day. I still have the body hair and other problems caused by PCOS but at least I don't feel to crabby all the time.

 

[Finsky]

Thankyou all for your responses!
My main concern is excessive hunger- excessive eating - inability to lose weight. These are all so linked and I just dont know how to go about it. Ive upped my dose from 500 mg to 1000mg and it somewhat has suppressed my appetite but partly because I feel sick coz of the medication like at dinner i cant seem to eat anything i just have water and fruit and yoghurt.

The 500 mg metformin was making me more hunhry so I have speculated a bit and thought one of the two possibilities have arisen -
1) my sugar levels are normal and im not insulin resistant so metformin is lowering my blood sugar causing hunger
2) my sugar levels are out of whack and 500mg is just not enough so i should up my dose and see how i feel.

Without monitoring my blood sugar its hard to say anything although ive ordered a machine and that will come next week

In the meantime ill try keep a food log and stick to 5 meals per day. Something that relieves my hunger is metamucil not sure what its called in uk but very popular here in Australia. Its a powered fibre supplement you mix in water and drink it and after a bit it becomes jelly and fills your stomach up its working well i can sleep at ease at night otherwisw id have to wake up most night at 3-4 am and binge whatever was in the fridge and i couldn't help myself because stomach was so restless and I just couldnt sleep!

Lastly what are some vegetarian friendly low carb foods i can start to eat??

Reading through your list of symptoms....I can go and tick off each and every one to say 'yep, been there...'
BUT...you can ease those symptoms..you really can! They are not quickly fixable symptoms...but over time things do get bit better/easier.
Usually we PSOS ladies have so much insulin going around our systems = insulin resistance...and it is the elevated insulin levels that make us HUNGRY! Insulin sends GIVE ME FOOD messages....so only way to go is lowering insulin levels in our body...and that also happen to help to deal with our diabetes. And what raises insulin levels? = carbs
For me particularly fruit are lethal...as much as enjoy eating them, and not only that, I happen to grow LOTS it too..
Try not to snack with fruit ..even it is said being healthy, aim to reduce your carbohydrate intake (all sources)..start slowly and see how your body reacts for it. Many of us do low(er) carb, high(er) fat diet...fat will help with your hunger bangs.
I started getting rid of my 'bangs' by boiling pan of eggs and using an egg as snack through out the day..and real butter to melt over steamed veg. I ditched low fat products long time ago.
You just have to trial different food items and how you respond to them...write what seems to work for you and you eventually end up with your own 'no-hunger' recipe..

 

[sammy123]

Why am I still hungry despite low carbing and taking metformin 1000mg? Could there be something else wrong with me thats not diabetes related?

 

[Brunneria]

could be that you aren't low carbing enough - we each have an indivicual carb tolerance, and it varies a lot. How many g carbs do you eat a day?

Plus there are certain food items that can trigger cravings for some people. Of course that varies too! (for me it is wheat, bread, rice, pasta - all the grains) Sometimes it is fruit. Sometimes root veg. Sometimes none.

could also be that you are thinking calories, and cutting back on fat still. It is the fat that makes you feel full.

not everyone finds that metformin cuts the appetite.

Think of it like a seesaw. fat on one side, making you feel full. carbs on the other, making you feel hungry. You need to increase one, and decrease the other, until you find your personal balance where you don't gain weight, don't get the cravings, and feel comfortable (not stuffed). Unfortunately you will only find that with practice.

 

[Henwoman]

I can identify with hunger and food craving and it is awful. I have reversed T2 and no longer crave food at all. My carb intake is still very low, all low fat/fat free stuff is banned and I exercise like mad. I eat bread perhaps twice a week, in small quantities and only home made sourdough made with spelt or rye flours. Neither type of bread spiked my BG. No pasta, rice (even brown rice used to spike my BG immensely) and I cut out lots of fruit only eating berries. I am sure you will be amazed what does affect your BG when your meter arrives. Make sure you have plenty of testing strips and test before and after meals making a note of what you have eaten. Only have one carb per meal to start with then you can identify the culprits.

 

[Kyi]

I think one of the hardest messages to get your head around is to eat more fat to feel less hungry. We are constantly being told not to eat fat or reduce the fat. Olives, avocados, nuts as well as some meat are the way to feel less hungry. They do not alter your blood sugars so eventually if you cut out the low fat foods, go for butter instead of marg, drink full fat milk and full fat yoghurts, You will probably feel a lot better and less hungry. When you are eating carbohydrates you are turning on a swing in blood sugars. You get a sudden rapid rise when you eat and a sudden drop when they have been digested. The drop triggers the Im hungry. With the fats it takes a lot longer for them to be digested so your body feels full and the blood sugars do not get the rapid rise and sudden drop. You will find you need less food when you are eating fats and proteins than when you are eating carbohydrates. If you are worried about cholesterol levels, we are finding ours drop when we are eating more full fats so long as the carbohydrates are also low. Get your Dr to check out your vitamin D and B ranges to make sure you are not low. Hope you feel better soon.

 

[kokhongw]

Generally I like the simplicity of this diagram taken from Ditch the carbs.

But other than ditching the carbs, initially I find it helpful to fuel up with some fats to ease the hunger...but hunger in itself is not terribly harmful if you are on the heavy side...because intermittent fasting is another useful option to lower our circulating insulin level. Gradually we can overcome the hunger allowing our body to move towards the ketogenic/nutritional ketosis state.

 

[Finsky]

I think one of the hardest messages to get your head around is to eat more fat to feel less hungry. We are constantly being told not to eat fat or reduce the fat. Olives, avocados, nuts as well as some meat are the way to feel less hungry. They do not alter your blood sugars so eventually if you cut out the low fat foods, go for butter instead of marg, drink full fat milk and full fat yoghurts, You will probably feel a lot better and less hungry. When you are eating carbohydrates you are turning on a swing in blood sugars. You get a sudden rapid rise when you eat and a sudden drop when they have been digested. The drop triggers the Im hungry. With the fats it takes a lot longer for them to be digested so your body feels full and the blood sugars do not get the rapid rise and sudden drop. You will find you need less food when you are eating fats and proteins than when you are eating carbohydrates. If you are worried about cholesterol levels, we are finding ours drop when we are eating more full fats so long as the carbohydrates are also low. Get your Dr to check out your vitamin D and B ranges to make sure you are not low. Hope you feel better soon.

Yes...learning to eat and not feel guilty when eating fats is hard...'we' are deeply brainwashed to the old 'low fat mantra'. Boy the food is so much enjoyable now when it tastes good and makes you feel good too! Now I'm first to pick the crispiest chicken skin pieces when I never used to touch the stuff! All good stuff!