Keep getting mid morning spikes

[EmilyMay11]

Recently been giving a blood sugar monitor to check how certain foods spike my blood sugars. First evening I had 28g carbs and ending the meal 2 hours later at 8.3MMOL(149MG/DL ). Yesterday I had 50g carbs and ending the meal with a reading of 8.4MMOL(151MG/DL) . Before both these meals my blood sugar was 6.1 mmol (108mg/dl). These after dinner readings were also bedtime readings due to my late meal times.

Both mornings i've woken up (around 6am) with blood sugars of around 8 (148mg/dl) but then when checking mid morning (I don't eat breakfast, first meal is around 1:30pm) by blood sugars have spiked to 10.1 (181mg/dl) and 9.1 (163mg/dl). When checking before my first meal (lunch) it's back to normal levels around 6.6mmol (117mg/dl)

Is there anything that could of caused this morning spike? I haven't eaten anything during this time, so surely it should lower not higher?
Could it be not going down at night and then carb spiking 14 hours later?

I'm guessing the answer will be that I need to track more and eat different things for a more accurate data but just wondered if anyone had an early insights.

Thanks!

 

[TheSecretCarbAddict]

There have been a couple of similar posts on this forum today with some helpful answers. Google or search this forum for dawn phenomenon or 'foot on the floor'. Glucose levels going up overnight from about 3 am, and potentially having a more pronounced jump as soon as you get up is quite normal and can be more pronounced in diabetics. Generally, this is the last thing to return to normal levels in a well managed diabetes. Some things I find useful is to have my evening meal early - 3 to 4h before bed, having a long walk after my evening meal, adjusting the timing of my meds, intermittent fasting (and currently experimenting with alternate-day fasting on top of this).

 

[TheSecretCarbAddict]

Just to add... CGM, if you can get access to one, can provide really good insights into this and understand which interventions have the most impact for you.

 

[Lamont D]

Recently been giving a blood sugar monitor to check how certain foods spike my blood sugars. First evening I had 28g carbs and ending the meal 2 hours later at 8.3MMOL(149MG/DL ). Yesterday I had 50g carbs and ending the meal with a reading of 8.4MMOL(151MG/DL) . Before both these meals my blood sugar was 6.1 mmol (108mg/dl). These after dinner readings were also bedtime readings due to my late meal times.

Both mornings i've woken up (around 6am) with blood sugars of around 8 (148mg/dl) but then when checking mid morning (I don't eat breakfast, first meal is around 1:30pm) by blood sugars have spiked to 10.1 (181mg/dl) and 9.1 (163mg/dl). When checking before my first meal (lunch) it's back to normal levels around 6.6mmol (117mg/dl)

Is there anything that could of caused this morning spike? I haven't eaten anything during this time, so surely it should lower not higher?
Could it be not going down at night and then carb spiking 14 hours later?

I'm guessing the answer will be that I need to track more and eat different things for a more accurate data but just wondered if anyone had an early insights.

Thanks!

Are you active during those times when spiking to 9 & 10, before you drop before pre meal result?
This could be your body's natural response to fasting. As in a providing you with some glucose from your natural stores for energy. The drop to pre meal will be the normal insulin to provide you with energy.
Some can fast and it won't bother your BG levels. Some can't, and of course the reverse is possible.

I would imagine @EllieMay11 that all this is new to you.
And reading up on how to benefit from using your glucometer and results. And how to interpret such things as dawn phenomenon, fasting blood glucose levels, pre meal, two hours after first bite, spikes, lows, hypers, hypos, false hypos and such.
It is a learning curve and then finding out about what to eat and exercise and such.
By asking these questions, reading the threads, gaining the knowledge, understanding why you are T2.
And by the way, it is unusual to test between waking, fasting and pre meal.
It would make more sense as a benchmark to test pre meal and two hours after first bite. This would give you an idea of what foods or mix of foods do to your blood glucose levels.
What to look for after two hours is, if your reading is less than 2mmols higher than your pre meal reading. What you are is ok. If it is higher than 2mmols from your pre meal then something in that meal is causing the longer spike.
As a T2, higher than normal spikes are to be avoided.
Hope this helps.

 

[EmilyMay11]

Are you active during those times when spiking to 9 & 10, before you drop before pre meal result?
This could be your body's natural response to fasting. As in a providing you with some glucose from your natural stores for energy. The drop to pre meal will be the normal insulin to provide you with energy.
Some can fast and it won't bother your BG levels. Some can't, and of course the reverse is possible.

I would imagine @EllieMay11 that all this is new to you.
And reading up on how to benefit from using your glucometer and results. And how to interpret such things as dawn phenomenon, fasting blood glucose levels, pre meal, two hours after first bite, spikes, lows, hypers, hypos, false hypos and such.
It is a learning curve and then finding out about what to eat and exercise and such.
By asking these questions, reading the threads, gaining the knowledge, understanding why you are T2.
And by the way, it is unusual to test between waking, fasting and pre meal.
It would make more sense as a benchmark to test pre meal and two hours after first bite. This would give you an idea of what foods or mix of foods do to your blood glucose levels.
What to look for after two hours is, if your reading is less than 2mmols higher than your pre meal reading. What you are is ok. If it is higher than 2mmols from your pre meal then something in that meal is causing the longer spike.
As a T2, higher than normal spikes are to be avoided.
Hope this helps.

So if a blood sugar is in the ‘normal’ range after dinner (Or under 2mmols increase) that meal didn’t spike your blood sugar? Or can you spike after 2 hours?

 

[TheSecretCarbAddict]

Depends... impact of carbs should be visible at 2h mark as carbs take 2-3h to fully digest. If you consume carbs that have low GI (digest slowly) or eat high protein diet, the spike can come later as protein, for example, takes 3-4 hours to digest and any surplus that can't be used directly will be converted into blood glucose. It's also worth noting that these are general principles, and our individual bodies will behave differently.

 

[Lainie71]

Recently been giving a blood sugar monitor to check how certain foods spike my blood sugars. First evening I had 28g carbs and ending the meal 2 hours later at 8.3MMOL(149MG/DL ). Yesterday I had 50g carbs and ending the meal with a reading of 8.4MMOL(151MG/DL) . Before both these meals my blood sugar was 6.1 mmol (108mg/dl). These after dinner readings were also bedtime readings due to my late meal times.

Both mornings i've woken up (around 6am) with blood sugars of around 8 (148mg/dl) but then when checking mid morning (I don't eat breakfast, first meal is around 1:30pm) by blood sugars have spiked to 10.1 (181mg/dl) and 9.1 (163mg/dl). When checking before my first meal (lunch) it's back to normal levels around 6.6mmol (117mg/dl)

Is there anything that could of caused this morning spike? I haven't eaten anything during this time, so surely it should lower not higher?
Could it be not going down at night and then carb spiking 14 hours later?

I'm guessing the answer will be that I need to track more and eat different things for a more accurate data but just wondered if anyone had an early insights.

Thanks!

Dawn phenomenon its a blighter, its the last thing to drop apparently. Having said that though, if I intentionally fast my levels will rise to unacceptable (to me) levels. Yet if I go without a meal due to being busy it will drop, work that out

 

[Alexandra100]

can you spike after 2 hours?

Confusingly, my bg can have dropped to eg a gratifying 4.8 2 hours after a meal, only to rise 4 hours after. Even more confusingly, this pattern is not consistent. I just hope I never reach the point of injecting insulin to cover my meals, as it would be a nightmare.

 

[EmilyMay11]

Confusingly, my bg can have dropped to eg a gratifying 4.8 2 hours after a meal, only to rise 4 hours after. Even more confusingly, this pattern is not consistent. I just hope I never reach the point of injecting insulin to cover my meals, as it would be a nightmare.

I hope this too. I’m so determined to put my diabetes into readmission. Especially as I’m only 28.
I just wish there was an easy, fit everyone type number for all of this

 

[EmilyMay11]

Depends... impact of carbs should be visible at 2h mark as carbs take 2-3h to fully digest. If you consume carbs that have low GI (digest slowly) or eat high protein diet, the spike can come later as protein, for example, takes 3-4 hours to digest and any surplus that can't be used directly will be converted into blood glucose. It's also worth noting that these are general principles, and our individual bodies will behave differently.

Thank for replying to all my messages. They have been so helpful, it’s all so new to me so is very confusing, thank for you being patient with me.
So if it’s unusual to test between waking, fasting and pre meal should I cut out the 9am blood sugar check and just do; waking, pre lunch, after lunch, pre dinner, after dinner?
Thank you.

 

[EmilyMay11]

Dawn phenomenon its a blighter, its the last thing to drop apparently. Having said that though, if I intentionally fast my levels will rise to unacceptable (to me) levels. Yet if I go without a meal due to being busy it will drop, work that out

I think I might start trying breakfast when waking, see if that stops the spike. Wish it was a fit all diet and wasn’t so confusing

 

[Alexandra100]

I just wish there was an easy, fit everyone type number for all of this

Yes, it is a struggle, at the beginning I used to think how much easier it would be just to stop eating altogether! But just think how much better off we are than people with other health problems. We can access lots of info, and morale-boosting videos and books. We can get blood glucose monitors with which to check everything we are told and also find out our own personal diabetes quirks. Embarrassingly, we can soon realise we have come to know more than our health advisers about our condition. I suggest you have a look at the "Beat Diabetes" and "Adapt Your Life Academy" Youtube videos.

For the problem that your bg rises after the initial morning fasting reading, I experienced this for a while. I had some success placing a little low carb snack eg a piece of low carb cheese in the bathroom to eat as soon as I had done my 1st test. I believe some people use coffee in the same way (even bullet-proof coffee). After a while I didn't seem to need this any more. I often unintentionally fast all morning without raising my bg.

Good luck!

 

[Jaylee]

Confusingly, my bg can have dropped to eg a gratifying 4.8 2 hours after a meal, only to rise 4 hours after. Even more confusingly, this pattern is not consistent. I just hope I never reach the point of injecting insulin to cover my meals, as it would be a nightmare.

Hi,

What does it rise to at the “4 hour” mark & does it steadily fall back after that?

 

[Alexandra100]

What does it rise to at the “4 hour” mark & does it steadily fall back after that?

Hi Jaylee, these days I don't test very often. Because of the delay I have described, in order to get a meaningful picture I would either have to test at least every hour, or spash out on a cgm. I have decided there is no point. I test fasting every morning without fail. After that, I am eating as low carb as I can tolerate, (c.10 net g a day) and I don't feel well enough to exercise much, so there is no point upsetting myself with numbers I can't change. In any case, they are unlikely to be so very high. Certainly not high enough to interest my GP.

 

[Fern Hopper]

Breakfast is the most important meal of the day.

 

[Jaylee]

Breakfast is the most important meal of the day.

Not for me.. Normally get FotF can’t do breaky. & any correction dose for the liver dump keeps me going til either a “brunch” or lunch.?

Hi Jaylee, these days I don't test very often. Because of the delay I have described, in order to get a meaningful picture I would either have to test at least every hour, or spash out on a cgm. I have decided there is no point. I test fasting every morning without fail. After that, I am eating as low carb as I can tolerate, (c.10 net g a day) and I don't feel well enough to exercise much, so there is no point upsetting myself with numbers I can't change. In any case, they are unlikely to be so very high. Certainly not high enough to interest my GP.

I’m sorry you felt anxiety testing at the 4 hour mark.

Where were they (approx) when you were still testing?

 

[Alexandra100]

Where were they (approx) when you were still testing?

Jaylee, I was talkng about (my) ancient history (before the pandemic, and then some). Its no use living in the past. I only mentioned it to encourage Emily May. I have seen others report that their bg would keep on rising in the morning, and the only thing that halted the rise was, counter-intuitively, to eat.

 

[Lamont D]

Breakfast is the most important meal of the day.

This was a message from originally the cereal industry.It is not important as lunch, brunch, elevenses etc. Dinner, tea, supper.

It all depends on your individual nutritional needs.

If you suffer from insulin resistance or your first phase response is weak, then the carbs and sugars you have for that first labelled food intake, will cause a rollercoaster of BG levels at the start of the day. Spikes and false hypos are part and parcel of eating high carbs in T2 diabetics and to a certain extent, prediabetics.

Do you have a set time for meals?
I don't!
I eat when I want to!

 

[JTL]

Coffee is a problem for a lot of diabetics.
Even without milk and sugar in but a lot of people give it no thought.
Coffee can cause an adrenalin rush and cortisone too if I remember correctly as your brain and heart are geared up fo fight or flight.
Your liver then joins in and pumps glucose into your bloodstream for required energy needs for that fight or flight.
Avoid caffeine see what happens.
Avoid sweeteners too because they can also fool your brain and always read the label on them because believe it or not some contain glucose.

 

[MrPeaky]

Just to add... CGM, if you can get access to one, can provide really good insights into this and understand which interventions have the most impact for you.

Abbot - FSL2 do a free trial of their CGL just fill out the form and should be with you in a week or so.