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And so it begins: Eat less meat or we’ll make you.
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<blockquote data-quote="LittleGreyCat" data-source="post: 2203320" data-attributes="member: 6467"><p>On a minor (but getting very long-winded) note: <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /></p><p></p><p>to me there are two kinds of Climate Change.</p><p></p><p>(1) Part of the natural cycle of the solar system and our Earth in particular. </p><p>At one point the UK was under ice. </p><p>At one point the UK (as was then) supported a tropical/sub-tropical climate (as shown by the limestone deposits and fossil record). </p><p>We are currently emerging from a mini ice age. </p><p>North Africa was fertile in Roman times. There is now the Sahara Desert. This pre-dates a massive population, massive automated agriculture, and the Chelsea Tractor by a couple of Millennia.</p><p></p><p>(2) Anthropogenic (created by man) climate change. Our impact on the planet is obvious. However I am still not sure that the impact has been quantified.</p><p></p><p>So I think that the term "Climate Change denier" can be confusing and misleading. Accepting that the climate is changing doesn't necessarily accept that this is entirely man made, nor does it prove that taking various proposed actions will stop and/or reverse the change. Mitigate, perhaps.</p><p></p><p>Taking action should improve things. We are pretty sure that the ban on CFCs helped repair the Ozone layer.</p><p></p><p>However the planet itself can do things without our puny help.</p><p><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volcanic_winter" target="_blank">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volcanic_winter</a></p><p>Natural release of green house gasses is taking place all the time.</p><p>I am not sure that areas of high vulcanicity, such as NZ and Japan for instance, include the background emissions as part of their total carbon budget.</p><p>Mid-ocean ridges have a lot to answer for.</p><p></p><p>So for me the jury is still out.</p><p>It makes sense to try and not make things worse, as long as the metrics are realistic.</p><p></p><p>To me, personally in the UK, building more nuclear power stations for a sustainable base load and electrifying the railways instead of relying on diesel might be more effective than destroying the meat industry.</p><p></p><p>Then again, demonising meat is no doubt more "woke" and plays better in the popular media.</p><p></p><p>For example, the calculations for electric vehicles don't always take into account the costs of manufacture, electricity generation, non-fuel particulates, disposal, battery replacement etc.</p><p>So reducing the production of greenhouse gasses seems a good idea.</p><p>However don't be shocked if it doesn't have the expected impact.</p><p></p><p>As I noted earlier, stopping meat production in the UK doesn't mean no meat.</p><p>It just means you import the meat.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="LittleGreyCat, post: 2203320, member: 6467"] On a minor (but getting very long-winded) note: :) to me there are two kinds of Climate Change. (1) Part of the natural cycle of the solar system and our Earth in particular. At one point the UK was under ice. At one point the UK (as was then) supported a tropical/sub-tropical climate (as shown by the limestone deposits and fossil record). We are currently emerging from a mini ice age. North Africa was fertile in Roman times. There is now the Sahara Desert. This pre-dates a massive population, massive automated agriculture, and the Chelsea Tractor by a couple of Millennia. (2) Anthropogenic (created by man) climate change. Our impact on the planet is obvious. However I am still not sure that the impact has been quantified. So I think that the term "Climate Change denier" can be confusing and misleading. Accepting that the climate is changing doesn't necessarily accept that this is entirely man made, nor does it prove that taking various proposed actions will stop and/or reverse the change. Mitigate, perhaps. Taking action should improve things. We are pretty sure that the ban on CFCs helped repair the Ozone layer. However the planet itself can do things without our puny help. [URL]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volcanic_winter[/URL] Natural release of green house gasses is taking place all the time. I am not sure that areas of high vulcanicity, such as NZ and Japan for instance, include the background emissions as part of their total carbon budget. Mid-ocean ridges have a lot to answer for. So for me the jury is still out. It makes sense to try and not make things worse, as long as the metrics are realistic. To me, personally in the UK, building more nuclear power stations for a sustainable base load and electrifying the railways instead of relying on diesel might be more effective than destroying the meat industry. Then again, demonising meat is no doubt more "woke" and plays better in the popular media. For example, the calculations for electric vehicles don't always take into account the costs of manufacture, electricity generation, non-fuel particulates, disposal, battery replacement etc. So reducing the production of greenhouse gasses seems a good idea. However don't be shocked if it doesn't have the expected impact. As I noted earlier, stopping meat production in the UK doesn't mean no meat. It just means you import the meat. [/QUOTE]
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