Fats and carbs and maths

friendlyfish · Jun 13, 2016

Hi,

Recently I have been curious how I can eat 100g fresh coconut with 100g pistachios and barely get any movement in my blood sugar, despite the 33g carbs (not counting fibre).

Yesterday, I had a "too tired, too hungry, too stressed" episode that led (as it sadly often does) to crisps and sugar (500ml Oppo ice cream). A total of 150g carbs and very high blood sugars.

So, today, I sat down with my calculator to see if I could learn something from the good blood sugar meal and the disastrous blood sugar meal.

I learnt that both meals had the same amount of protein. But the coconut and pistachios had in total twice as much fat as carb (33g carb to 75g fat). Whereas the crisps and Oppo had half as much fat as carb (150g carb to 60g fat).

So I tried an experiment today. I matched the Oppo ice cream with enough nuts and peanut butter (whole earth seeded - has flax, sunflower and pumpkin!) to make in total twice as much fat as carb. In total there was 18g carb and 36 g fat.

And my blood sugar rose less than 1 mmol/L despite the 18g carb.

Will this calculation always work? I don't know, but it is relatively simple, so is worth a try for those difficult days when I cannot stop a high carb meal - I will try to mop up the total carbs with double fat.

P.s. Waitrose here said they are only allowed to order 6 tubs of Oppo at a time!

Lamont D · Jun 13, 2016

Hi,

friendlyfish said:
Hi,

Recently I have been curious how I can eat 100g fresh coconut with 100g pistachios and barely get any movement in my blood sugar, despite the 33g carbs (not counting fibre).

Yesterday, I had a "too tired, too hungry, too stressed" episode that led (as it sadly often does) to crisps and sugar (500ml Oppo ice cream). A total of 150g carbs and very high blood sugars.

So, today, I sat down with my calculator to see if I could learn something from the good blood sugar meal and the disastrous blood sugar meal.

I learnt that both meals had the same amount of protein. But the coconut and pistachios had in total twice as much fat as carb (33g carb to 75g fat). Whereas the crisps and Oppo had half as much fat as carb (150g carb to 60g fat).

So I tried an experiment today. I matched the Oppo ice cream with enough nuts and peanut butter (whole earth seeded - has flax, sunflower and pumpkin!) to make in total twice as much fat as carb. In total there was 18g carb and 36 g fat.

And my blood sugar rose less than 1 mmol/L despite the 18g carb.

Will this calculation always work? I don't know, but it is relatively simple, so is worth a try for those difficult days when I cannot stop a high carb meal - I will try to mop up the total carbs with double fat.

P.s. Waitrose here said they are only allowed to order 6 tubs of Oppo at a time!

Until you gain real control of your diet, blood sugars and being in denial about what carbs do to you, you can calculate all you like and two plus two will always make five!

Unfortunately you have a condition that doesn't allow you to go off the rails and have a day off! Only being in normal levels all the time will stop the temptations and cravings, you don't need comfort food once in control!
Why do you want to be ill?

There are always alternatives to eating stuff that harms you!

Don't mean to be harsh but you are going against nature and nature will always win if you don't have control over it!

Best wishes.

Brunneria · Jun 13, 2016

I never do the maths calc, but I have long used fat and protein as a companion/control for carbs.

HOWEVER it is worth remembering that combining fats and carbs is a surefire way to gain weight. It is a killer combo and over time will increase cholesterol triglycerides and increase risk of heart disease.

So while it is a very useful emergency technique, please don't get into the habit of using it regularly.

Hope that helps.

friendlyfish · Jun 13, 2016

I quite agree I do not want to be more ill than I am. But without the blood sugar problems I have been ill for 20ys, and while I do not willingly respond to fatigue by eating disastrous meals, I have had to learn to not beat myself up when things go wrong - because that makes me feel worse and care less. So I have to treat the disasters as learning exercises.

It is true, using fat as a way to eat everything is no better than a diabetic being told to use insulin as a way to eat everything. It does not work in the long run.

But knowing that there are options when life goes up the spout, that is good. And knowing how to make a healthy meal healthier while still eating the vegetables that I can manage within my multiple disabilities - that is very useful.

So yes, I hear you, this is not licence to run riot in the corner shop. But the maths does help me understand how to choose my meals even on a good day, particularly since my other disabilities limit what I can eat.

ChrisSamsDad · Jun 13, 2016

I've seen some pro-LCHF diet doctors talking about the total carb load being the issue for many diabetics, so trying to eat more carbs by eating low-GI carbs or, what you're doing, effectively making high-GI carbs appear in your bloodstream more slowly and steadily, will stop the spikes and might even effect your HbA1C but the load on your pancreas is still there.

Lamont D · Jun 13, 2016

ChrisSamsDad said:
I've seen some pro-LCHF diet doctors talking about the total carb load being the issue for many diabetics, so trying to eat more carbs by eating low-GI carbs or, what you're doing, effectively making high-GI carbs appear in your bloodstream more slowly and steadily, will stop the spikes and might even effect your HbA1C but the load on your pancreas is still there.

Good point! And correct, slower digesting carbs are better, unless as you say your pancreas does react to the carbs. But to someone like the op, he is in a conundrum, if he gets it slightly wrong the insulin overshoot is what makes him worse but so does not getting enough natural carbs from other sources rather than fats, so he has to rely mostly on vegetable low carb! It's a fine balancing act.
He does need to find it to be well!

But having a day off, is not the answer!

Lamont D · Jun 13, 2016

friendlyfish said:
I quite agree I do not want to be more ill than I am. But without the blood sugar problems I have been ill for 20ys, and while I do not willingly respond to fatigue by eating disastrous meals, I have had to learn to not beat myself up when things go wrong - because that makes me feel worse and care less. So I have to treat the disasters as learning exercises.

It is true, using fat as a way to eat everything is no better than a diabetic being told to use insulin as a way to eat everything. It does not work in the long run.

But knowing that there are options when life goes up the spout, that is good. And knowing how to make a healthy meal healthier while still eating the vegetables that I can manage within my multiple disabilities - that is very useful.

So yes, I hear you, this is not licence to run riot in the corner shop. But the maths does help me understand how to choose my meals even on a good day, particularly since my other disabilities limit what I can eat.

Good post and I do agree with most of your post and it is a huge pain!
I understand the urges to try and be better by experimenting and I've been through that phase myself.
The guilt, the worry, the attitude and mood change, this is your body and minds response to what is going on. That's natural and you shouldn't get angry with yourself, another symptom!
Take it easy and do try to be kind to your pancreas, for a couple of days, just eat what you know works and get your head together and go again.
Control is the most important treatment you can give your body and future health.

ickihun · Jun 14, 2016

friendlyfish said:
Hi,

Recently I have been curious how I can eat 100g fresh coconut with 100g pistachios and barely get any movement in my blood sugar, despite the 33g carbs (not counting fibre).

Yesterday, I had a "too tired, too hungry, too stressed" episode that led (as it sadly often does) to crisps and sugar (500ml Oppo ice cream). A total of 150g carbs and very high blood sugars.

So, today, I sat down with my calculator to see if I could learn something from the good blood sugar meal and the disastrous blood sugar meal.

I learnt that both meals had the same amount of protein. But the coconut and pistachios had in total twice as much fat as carb (33g carb to 75g fat). Whereas the crisps and Oppo had half as much fat as carb (150g carb to 60g fat).

So I tried an experiment today. I matched the Oppo ice cream with enough nuts and peanut butter (whole earth seeded - has flax, sunflower and pumpkin!) to make in total twice as much fat as carb. In total there was 18g carb and 36 g fat.

And my blood sugar rose less than 1 mmol/L despite the 18g carb.

Will this calculation always work? I don't know, but it is relatively simple, so is worth a try for those difficult days when I cannot stop a high carb meal - I will try to mop up the total carbs with double fat.

P.s. Waitrose here said they are only allowed to order 6 tubs of Oppo at a time!

I'm buying from walking into the store, so no limit. I'll still buy it in the winter as only sweet thing I eat.
Very interesting findings for you @friendlyfish . Well done for investigating and sharing. Thank you.
I appreciate you are RH so might be different for me. I find upping the fat to ratio doesn't help my weight loss.

ickihun · Jun 14, 2016

Just want to add @friendlyfish .
If I doubled up on my insulin for all carbs I've had as a lapse I would be far heaviler than I am now.
I vowed once I went of insulin. Carbs wouldnt rule the roost.!
I too have bad days. Most people do.
It's how you recover from that lapse that's important.

Ps. You know I've always know a flour, fat and sugar combo gave me trouble but ignored it , thinking it was too simple.
It's amazing how combis can change the balance!
You have put your finger on an interesting point.

Fats and carbs and maths

friendlyfish

Member

Lamont D

Oracle

Brunneria

Guru

friendlyfish

Member

ChrisSamsDad

Well-Known Member

Lamont D

Oracle

Lamont D

Oracle

ickihun

Master

ickihun

Master

Fats and carbs and maths

Member

Oracle

Guru

Member

Well-Known Member

Oracle

Oracle

Master

Master

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency