Got my results back

berrylover said:

how long after eating a healthy diet should my thirst and tiredness stop? I know its all early days for me, but I wish I had asked these questions when I was there on tuesday. I feel like I know nothing and just feel ill. :cry:

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When your BG comes down the tiredness and thirst should go away almost immediately (certainly within a very few days). How quickly you can get your BG down depends upon a number of things. These include how high it was to start off with (did the doctor give you any figures?), what state your pancreas is in (you won't really know that until you get the diabetes under control) and how drastic a diet you go on. If you restrict your carbohydrate intake modestly, then the improvement will probably be quite gradual. If you go on an ultra low carb diet then it will probably come down very fast. If you post a summary of a typical days diet on here then we can probably make some suggestions. Also, if you get a glucose monitor then take a fasting test every day (i.e. first thing in the morning before eating). If you do this for a few days, then if your diet is working you should see a downward trend. As it gets close to normal (i.e. that of a non-diabetic) then the symptoms will go away.

One word of warning. Although the tiredness and thirst should go away very quickly, some symptoms might briefly get worse before they get better. I am particularly thinking of blurred vision here. This is because the body tends to take a few days to get used to running with a lower BG It isn't anything to worry about, and it will only last a few days. It can be scary if you haven't been warned, though.

berrylover said:

I feel like I know nothing and just feel ill. :cry:

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There is a lot to learn, but you have come to the right place for that! As long as you are willing to learn, and take the attitude that this is an inconvenience that you are going to surmount then you will be fine. Generally the people who suffer the really horrible complications are the people who are either unable or unwilling to change their lifestyles.

BTW - don't forget that there are other things that you can do than simply improve your diet. Do you smoke? If you do then giving up smoking is now more important than ever (it makes diabetes much harder to control). You should increase the amount of exercise you do - at least 45 minutes of moderately strenuous exercise per day is probably a good target, but however much you do now you should do more. If you are overweight then you should try to loose weight, although if you adopt a seriously low carbohydrate diet then many people loose weight anyway.

Get yourself a meter,follow some of the advice here,lose the weight and the high blood sugar levels by lowering your carb intake.Go back in a month with lower figures and weight and blow them out of the water about their advice! Quote the NICE guidelines at them.

When I was diagnosed, I bought a meter & gave the strip info to the receptionist with a request for test strips. Try it.

Thirst & tiredness ARE normal when you are suffering from diabetes NOT with well-controlled diabetes.

Hiya

Sorry to hear your GP was patronising. Ian D's suggestion sounds like a good plan.
I just bought an Abbott Freestyle Lite monitor for £5.99 yesterday online http://www.chemistdirect.co.uk/freestyl ... 10669.html

It arrived already today complete with 10 strips. You can get additional test strips from the manufacturer for £14.62 which is pretty cheap compared to normal retail prices (around £23 at the chemist). I also just bought a box on ebay for only £10.50.

Goji

(ps. I don't work for them - it's just the cheapest I saw a monitor and strips)

Hi Berry ,

How is it going? I've noticed you've not posted for a few days and just wondered if you'd tried reducing the carbs yet, and if there's any positive result? I notice you have an appointment tomorrow, so good luck there - I hope the advice you get is good advice.

Don't dissappear from the site - we're all in similar positions and will be here to support you when you need advice.

Let us know how you're doing.

All the best,

hehe - sorry - more recent posts just popped up on my screen - I don't know why but sometimes, my computer doesn't show the more recent bits and it looks like nothings been happening for a while .... !!!

Awww berrylover am sorry you are struggling, but it will get easier in time, you will see

Having just read what you have been eating, there are most definitely too many carbs there, now I know from my own experience that reducing/cutting out carbs is a bit of a shock, just when you are feeling so rotten anyway you are not allowed your usual comfort foods, how cruel can life be.

So get a tester, and reduce or even cut out carbs, eat a whole lot more of the low/medium carb veggies to help fill you up, season them with thin gravy or butter and garlic or just sprinkled with Maggi and lots of seeds like sesame seeds, pumpkin seeds, sunflower seeds etc and see how that goes, just try to take it one day at a time, you will see the bg drop and that will be so encouraging for you, its such a good feeling to see that what you are doing is actually working.

There are quite a few recipes in this forum for you to try out too, even low carb chocolate mousse, and remember that you may not have to go as low carb as this forever, maybe when you have lost weight and got used to lots of exercise you can start to increase carbs a bit more.

When I say exercise more, I dont mean just really hard work outs, even fidgeting and fiddling and moving your legs around while you are watching TV will help, every little helps you there and it helps circulation too.

Oh and another thing you dont have to worry about fat, it is the carbohydrates that stop us from losing weight, not the fat, I weighed over 20st once, just weighed myself and am 9st 3lb. You will get there, dont give up, you are doing great already.

All the best

Karen

Listen to the geekly ones, sue and fegus and many others here who have helped me gain a better understanding of my diabetes in the last three weeks (and now probably understand it better than the health care professionals charged with my care)

in my humble (yep, been diagnosed 4 weeks tomorrow) if you want to feel better rapidly, dump the carbs, such as the baked potatoes, sweetcorn and bread (yes even the seeded wholemeal stuff made by donkeys crushing the grain or whatever) and feel an improvement!

just my humble opinion though.

4 litres of water is a lot - but if you are taking exercise it's probably a reasonable amount ...

strawberries are pretty low in carbs compared to other fruits and can really help take the edge off a slightly sweet craving.

Karen - my god woman, how on earth did you manage that? I mean, I understand that we all do whatever we can to improve our health - but that loss is inspirational - send me some of your vibes!

Jem xx

Berrylover,

Well done you! I'm 110% sure this will be the best move you ever make.

Regarding the dietician and/or doctor, I personally wouldn't tell them a thing just yet :twisted: - I'd just agree with whatever they say for now and do my own thing. Only when I've given it a chance and can prove it works, would I come clean!! That of couse, is just what I would do if I expected to get a negative reaction, because there is nothing more demotivating than people going on at you telling you you're wrong all the time.

I can't wait for my appointment with the specialist next Thursday ..... average bm in single figures for the first time in my life, half a stone weight loss (I think - can confirm that once I've been to the gym in the morning) and at least 3% body fat reduction .... all in 16 days. Now, when I see him, I'll try to gauge his reaction when I mumble a bit about 'reducing the carb intake a bit' .... if he seems positive, I'll come clean ... if not, I'll be very vague, then go away and continue with my own regieme.

At the end of the day, our health and wellbeing is in our own hands, and we can only make decisions by trying out things for ourselves. Doctors and DSNs are, at the end of the day, civil servants who are there to help and guide, but NOT to dictate.

Phew - that's cleared that one off my chest!!

The best BM machine I've ever had is my current one - the One Touch Ultrasmart - records absolutely everything - even if you're on holiday! And you can download it and analyse your food intake and blood glucose trends and allsorts. Look it up on the lifescan website if you're interested. (Not sure on the price, though - I've had mine for years).

Your daughter sounds like a great inspiration - my 11 year old is just the same - always praising me on how well I'm doing, especially lately as I've been doing all sorts of healthy meals again! It's a bit of a role reversal, isn't it? Nice one, though!

GOOD LUCK :!:

Keep us posted,

berrylover said:

Well went to the Doctors and felt royally patronised. Was told the thirstyness was normal and will go away "eventually", that the tiredness after eating was probably not related

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That is completely out of order. Doctors should treat patients with respect and discuss their concerns fully. Unfortunately many corners of the medical profession has an arrogance that makes this sort of attitude all too common. I am afraid that GPs frequently don't know very much about diabetes. To be fair to them they have to deal with hundreds of different conditions, and can't be expected to be an expert in all of them. Good GPs tend to admit their ignorance and refer diabetics to a specialist or a clinic where they can get better advice. However, far too often GPs simply recycle badly outdated doctrine from medical textbooks - and it sounds like you are the victim of this sort of advice. Your best bet is to learn all that you can and become your own specialist. Although there is a lot to learn, this isn't as tall an order as it sounds. A knowledgeable patient only has to concern themselves with one disease, and so it is quite possible to learn far more about it that than most GPs know.

Both the tiredness and the thirst are classic symptoms of uncontrolled diabetes. It is possible that you do have some other condition, but it would be a coincidence. Most likely this simply means that the diabetes is not under control yet. They key thing is that you get the diabetes under control - when this happens the symptoms will indeed go away. However, you need to get the diabetes under control first. If you follow the high carb advice then this will probably be difficult. If you follow the no testing advice then not only will this be difficult, but you will be doing it in the dark. If you don't get it under control, then it will get worse and the only option will be to control it with drugs and quite possibly eventually insulin.

berrylover said:

I have decided to stick two fingers up at the doctor. Am going to get myself a meter and some testing sticks and see what is happening with my bg

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Well done - given the advice you have been given that is a sensible attitude. I am glad you have reached that conclusion sooner rather than later.

berrylover said:

I am stopping the high carb diet and going to try a low carb one instead, although I am wondering how the heck to do that, seeing that I am a carb-a-holic!

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OK, that is the key question. If you try a seriously low carb diet you might find that it isn't as hard as you think. There is a school of thought (backed up by at least some scientific evidence) that carbohydrates are actually addictive - which is why so may people crave them. If this is the case then kicking the addiction can cause the cravings to go away to a great extent. I used to eat chocolate and sugary buns with the best of them - but now these are rare treats (not absolutely forbidden, but very rare). Rather to my surprise I barely miss them at all - I really do think that I have got over my carbohydrate addiction.

There are two ways of going about adopting a low carb diet - you can either try to wean yourself off carbs gradually, or you can go cold turkey. Which will work best for you will depend upon your personality. A gradual weaning might be easier, but it will take longer before you feel much benefit and it will draw the pain out. Cold turkey can be a bit of a shock, but it will get much quicker results, and you might find that after a few days you stop missing them so much.

One strategy that I would suggest is to go extremely low carbohydrate for a couple of weeks, whilst monitoring your fasting BG (i.e. a test taken in the morning, before eating). Hopefully, you should see this dropping quite quickly. Once it stabilises at a safe level (definitely under 7mmol/l, and preferably under 6) then you can start experimenting with various carbohydrates. Gradually incorporate them back into your diet whilst watching your BG. Eventually you should find a carbohydrate level that works well for you.

As for your current diet, then here are a few comments. You are drinking an awful lot of water - but that is, no doubt, because of your high BG. As it comes down you should get less thirsty and drink less.

berrylover said:

Breakfast.
2 slices of Wholemeal toast with low fat spread
Mug of tea

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I would avoid bread - at least initially. I would suggest that a high protein breakfast might be worth trying (e.g. eggs are very good). If you can't face a cooked breakfast, then try a low carbohydrate crisp-bread instead of toast. Tea is harmless, but don't put too much milk in it - there is a surprising amount of carbohydrate in milk.

berrylover said:

Dinner
½ can of beans on 1 slice of wholemeal toast
Pear
Portion of strawberries
Mug of tea

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This is all quite high in carbohydrate, I am afraid. Beans and bread both contain a lot, and fruit contain quite a lot of sugar. Pears and strawberries are better than many other fruits, but I suggest that you avoid them both initially. How about trying a green salad for lunch instead? I would suggest that you have either meat, fish, eggs or cheese along with the salad.

berrylover said:

Beef casserole with baked potato, broccoli and baby sweetcorn
Banana

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The beef casserole is good (providing that it doesn't have any starchy vegetables), and broccoli is very god. However, there are a lot of carbs in the potato and sweetcorn - I would suggest avoiding them. You could substitute other (non starchy) vegetables or a salad. If you want something that tastes like starch without actually having many carbohydrates then try microwaving a grated cauliflower for a few minutes. You can then use the resulting substance as a rice substitute (it makes a very good, not to mention low carb, egg fried "rice"). I would definitely get rid of the banana. Bananas contain both complex carbohydrate and sugar (more sugar as they ripen), and so they are very bad for diabetics. If you want to have a sweet fruit, then strawberries are much lower in carbohydrate than bananas. However, there are many other alternatives. Provided you sweeten them with an artificial sweetener rather than sugar, you can make many sweet deserts. Plain yoghurt (check the ingredients to make sure there s no added sugar) is quite good, and you can even make a very good low carbohydrate ice cream (essentially frozen cream, egg yolks and sweeter).

berrylover said:

Snack

Ryvita with thin slice of cheddar cheese.
Mug of tea

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That's pretty good. However, err on the side of the cheese rather than the Ryvita (there are very few carbs in most cheeses - so, if you are hungry, have more cheese rather than more Ryvita).

I hope that is of help.

Best of luck,

Tim.

As for a monitor, I too use the One Touch Ultrasmart. It is a geeky gadget that allows you to enter all sorts of useful data and plots pretty histograms for you. The down side of this is that the strips are expensive (although since the One Touch meters are very common, you can often find them on e-Gay. The Abbott devices tend to hav much cheaper strips (if you get them directly form Abbott.

Berrylover
i have read your posts with interest, i was diagnosed about 4 weeks ago and had a similar experience with the doc etc, i have been to a dietician clinic but learned nothing and was told to have lots of everything apart from sugary drinks (which i don't do) and low fat.

on monday this week i think i overdosed on carbs, not knowing if my BG has fallen when i had to wait a long time for food i had pasta with mushrooms, later feeling not well i then had a large fruit juice to perk me up and eventually had to take myself off to bed as i felt so terrible, felt much better later when i had a big bowl of chilli with virtually no rice but lots of veg and stuff!

i am also not testing at the moment but how the hell are we supposed to know if what we are doing is right when we are just trying to eat?

i too have very cold hands and feet, had to put socks on the other night - not romantic, good job the man was at work!

this forum is a breath of fresh air; today i am starting proper with a regime of little or no carb, so eggs and bacon for breakfast and salad with no carb at lunch, i tried this a bit yesterday and have to say that i work with a massive headache this morning which i think is a symptom of reducing the sugar.
have also logged on to chemist direct and ordered a monitor and strips etc to do some home testing, as others have said this is really an inconvenience as far as i am concerned and the sooner i get myself sorted so i know what i can eat, when etc the sooner i can get on with my life

however i have to say that the post meal tiredness and thirst has reduced since diagnosis now i have not been having choc and potatoes or bread so must have been doing something right!

stick with it girl, we will all get there in the end, it is good to know that none of us are alone x

jaquirs and berrylover,

I know we low-carb enthusiasts probably come across as evangelical zealots at times, and it might even put people off now and again. I hope not, but I have a feeling there are lots of people out there who find it difficult to accept or take in.
That's where you guys are so important. The dieticians haven't got their hooks into you yet so the simple logic of the low carb idea hasn't been twisted out of shape by a bunch of spurious nonsense.
I'm certain you'll have great success when you cut out the refined carbs and when you do perhaps more people out there will see that it will work for them too.
So, no pressure then. :wink:

All the best,

fergus

wotchya!

I won't add to the advice (being newbie and not qualified to haha) but mostly because if you listen to the above, you'll do great!

I admit that low-carbing was a bit difficult at first because the high carb I'd been eating for so long so easy. now I find low-carb CAN be easy too, if you put a little thought first. I may not have had much in the weigh (geddit?!) of weight loss yet, but I have to tell you something really important - to any diabetic wanting to low-carb and lose weight:

once you stop the carb-loading - after a couple of days you actually stop wanting them. and the hunger that I thought was normal has just - gone. no bingeing because I have no hunger. Every relatively normal person (I say relatively because I'm not known for being very normal) will occasionally want to stray from the path - last night I have half a pizza to "celebrate" (oh the irony) being diabetic for four weeks ... and afterwards I felt ****. This morning my stomach is not happy. I feel bloated and groggy - so back to low carb.

I can't unfortunately say I lost loads of weight immediately (maybe 3 lbs so far in a month) but then it's not quite as easy to seriously low carb when you're vegetarian (although some of the books advised by the dear brains on this site have proved invaluable) so I'm keeing some of the fruit and vegetables that others wouldn't use. I like my bananas green

anyhow, the point (sorry for the meander around my decrepit pizza addles brain this morning) is:

for the first time in 18 months I feel able to tackle the world. I can think straighter. I can see better. I have more energy. and I think it's down to the diet.

good luck and remember, however **** you feel, you'll always have us lot (hopefully that bit didn't make you cry haha)

Jem xox

me again

start of day two of no carbs; little but better headache this morning

yesterday no deliberate carbs, had a shape yoghurt in the evening but absolutely nothing else bad

did notice that by the time i went to bed my feet had stopped tingling and settled down (they have been fluctuating hot and cold or tingly for the last couple of weeks)

slept well and just about to have bacon and eggs again

have ordered a testing kit as i really feel the only way i can tackle this is by knowing how the food affects my levels, as the doc is not going to look at this for another couple of months that is the time i have to get myself on track

fortunately i am bright enough not to take advice at face value and i have already had my group therapy with the dietician. i am more likely to take as fact what you guys are saying as you have been there already

so will see what today brings. We are out at friends tonight who have offered take out pizza, have said i will feed myself before i go (can't eat too late) so i will avoid the carbs in that and see how i feel tomorrow

only prob i have at the moment is my lovely husband is feeling guilty that he is able to eat things i can't and he does not want me to get bored, but i'm fine so far.

is good to know there is support out there!

thanks for looking :wink: Jacqui