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Gutted

I’ll check with dr tomorrow, thanks
 
The thing to really think is while it may not seem much of a decrease it still is a decrease

If you hadn’t changed your ways etc…. Then the number may have been significantly higher

T2 is often considered progressive.. and at the moment you’ve halted that progression

New year… well that’s only just over 3 months which is not a great deal of time either
 
I would be gutted too if I restricted my carbs so much and didn’t achieve normal blood sugars. I don’t blame you for wanting to swear! It does sound like something more than type 2. Good luck.
 

Depends what you mean by failure/success I suppose.
I think keto (with some excursions due to lack of self control) has kept me from progressing beyond Metformin so far.
It certainly hasn't cured me or put me in remission.
However I can see that if I didn't eat LCHF and spend a lot of time in ketosis then I would need further drugs (up to and including insulin) to keep my BG down.

Your last HbA1c was 53 (7%).
My last was 56 (7.3).

Surgery put it down to Christmas under lockdown but I am due a retest soon.
Hopefully it will be lower.
 
For me it’s failure because I’ve been since 7/1 no excursions away from keto at all. I just kept getting stricter and stricter.
The 7/1 was a takeaway and that was one in a week anyway.
Last year I hit 54 having been enjoying eggs at Easter and eating carbs, not overly so but defo more than this time.
I haven’t got a retest, this is my retest.
If keto isn’t going to get me into normal range or into remission then my journey is into insulin and it’s never going to improve. I guess I can stop the progression or slow it down but at the moment I can’t see the point, my whole mission was to go into remission and that’s failed.
If it isn’t going to work then what is the point in being so restrictive. If eating carbs (not stupidly) is going to get the same results.
 
Hi @woollygal I completely understand why you would be feeling gutted. All the years I have spent doing low calorie and counting every darn thing and not losing weight. Well I also was gutted and wondered why I even tried. Also felt a failure and just that my body was broken. So I get it.

I think getting the tests to see whether you are still producing your own insulin is the next step. I think any dr after seeing your results with the lack of carbs would be more than willing to undertake more investigation.

Good luck with the tests and let us know what the results are.

Virtual hugs
 


I get this frustration. We are of an age (maybe a factor too?), diagnosed at a similar time and both stuck at a point that is not where we desire to be. Not awful but not anywhere near as good as others manage with apparently less effort. Both weight and bgl wise. (I’m also refreshing the online results tab hourly waiting on my hb1ac as I type). I posted similar frustration a couple of weeks ago.

As @LittleGreyCat says it depends on how you define success and failure. You (we) see the goal as remission/normal bgl. He sees it as not needing to progress to additional medications and to maintain the status quo.

If I asked you would you rather stay where you are or progress and deteriorate which would you choose? That is the point. To not get worse. It might not be the ideal option but it is the better of the two. So keto is achieving a better outcome that not doing it. Eating carbs again would undoubtedly get you a worse outcome.

You are comparing last years results on a less strict regime with this years on keto. IF you are indeed LADA then deterioration is inevitable without the right treatment. To have held it so static is a massive achievement, albeit not a long term option.

Get the tests and reevaluate with the additional evidence it gives.
 
That’s just it though, my numbers are the same as before I made the drastic change. I was always super low carb but this was severely keto for want of a better word.

I’ve had that decrease before with less severity and restriction as this time.
 
I’m waiting for a call but there is no guarantee of a time or even a call. It’s up to dr to decide if she calls or not. I’m hoping that because the comments on results said she wanted to talk that will get me a call.

my body definitely doesn’t like the carbs. I I’ve had chocolate and my old butter chicken the last two nights and I don’t feel great. I feel today like I need to go carb free because I feel icky,
Honestly I can cope with the carb free but the body needs to respond to such efforts. It can’t keep punching me in the gut and moaning when I go to lower carb from keto if it’s ignoring keto.
 
Could age affect my body responding to keto? Hadn’t thought of that. I’ll add hrt to the dr call list as well.

I’m worried the dr won’t give me the blood tests for c peptide. I think I’ve asked before and she just said no, no need you are type 2. Although I guess I have some ammo this time in that I was so strict,

got to order my shopping and I’m completely stuck as to what to buy. Do I stay so strict on keto (not sure I can stomach that again) or do I increase a bit to maybe 50g. If keto isn’t going to work I just don’t see point in depriving myself. I wasn’t enjoying the food it really was a means to an end.
If going slightly higher means I can add some veg to my meals and change things a bit. Instead of keto chicken soup every day I could have a broccoli soup.

My choice would be stay where I was rather than deteriorate, it’s just for the last three months my mission (literally obsessively- it’s the only way I could stop the cravings) was to aim for remission or at least pre diabetes and then maybe come off the meds, maybe introduce some carbs and be less restrictive. So it’s almost like everything I’ve worked for has been destroyed, slightly melodramatic and I’m slowly getting over it, but I am still struggling to even want to eat meat lol. Having said that I don’t much fancy bread or porridge either. I seem to have gone off all food except chocolate. Although me giving the D the finger has lead to it giving me the even bigger stronger finger back (today feeling bit icky].
I know others don’t see keto as being harsh but I do feel my diet of under 10g was harsh, I don’t think I could sustain it long term. Just eating the same thing day in day out with no change or change in flavour and just meat and dairy was too strict. I fancy a tomato based thing, just something with a zing,

but yes, main problem today is knowing what to buy, do I stick with what I’ve been eating for the last three months (which I really don’t want) or do I change it, but to be honest I’m not sure what to change it to. Not sure how to introduce things.
I’m very stuck in general I think.
 
@woollygal I thought long and hard about posting this as it’s probably not what you want to read however it could be that you need different, or more, medication to help control your BS. Unfortunately sometimes we need drugs to keep us ‘healthy’ and not all T2s will remain unmediated. For example my OH has a number of health issues and is currently taking 16 pills a day and his neurologist is still ‘tweaking’ his pills and dosage to help his Parkinson’s whilst being cognisant that he’s also on a number of heart pills and blood thinners etc. I hope you find an answer soon
 

completely understand. Is that likely on such low carbs though?
i always thought keto was a wonderful odds on way to beat diabetes or at least get really good sugars.
it dies seem my body prefers it because I seem to sleep better than I did before etc but we shall have to see.
 
Everyone is different and keto or low carb is not guaranteed to reverse to such an extent so that everyone achieves non-diabetic or drug free results I'm afraid. Sometimes it is reported almost as a miracle cure that works on everyone which might lead to unrealised expectations

But also, it is a drop, you have achieved a lot! Also, there may be further drops in the upcoming months. The trend is going the right way

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6561315/

Related but slightly different editorial discussing:
https://www.lchf-rd.com/2019/07/17/keto-diet-does-not-cure-diabetes/
 
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Reactions: ert
I understand how disheartened you must feel. IS it worth persevering for another couple of months. You may have a slower than average turnover of red blood cells and may not yet be seeing the full reduction in HbA1c. At the moment things are heading in the right direction.
 
TBH I don’t know - I tend to be low (ish) carb ie approx 130g per day but a lot on here @bulkbiker, @Brunneria and @Goonergal to name but a few have succeeded on keto so may be able to answer your query.
 
Daphne917 said:
TBH I don’t know - I tend to be low (ish) carb ie approx 130g per day but a lot on here @bulkbiker, @Brunneria and @Goonergal to name but a few have succeeded on keto so may be able to answer your query.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the tag @Daphne917

@woollygal I don’t think there’s a definitive answer. For me, keto (and now carnivore) absolutely has been a way to non-diabetic numbers. However, it may not work for everyone. Having read the thread again, I’d agree with those who’ve suggested it’s a bit early to give up on it - you may not have the results you want, but are moving in the right direction. The links I posted above explain that HbA1c is affected by many things and for some people is out of sync with their own records.

I’d also say that if you don’t feel that the way you’ve been eating the last couple of months is sustainable, then I’d be looking for something that can be maintained, whether or not that involves medication.
 
I have waited all day for a call from the dr to discuss things and despite me ringing at 8 this morning and then again at 4.30 I have literally just had a text tos ah she is happy with everything. She couldn’t even be bothered to call me. How does she know everything is good if she doesn’t know the background.
I now have to sit here all weekend and until she gets back in next week with no means of finding out what the hell to do.
I am beyond stressed and apparently my dr doesn’t care to even let me talk to her
 
@woollygal
I know you are frustrated with an apparent lack of progress through low carbing, and thee doctor's response has added to that, but were you aware how much effect stress can have on bg?
That fact really hit home to me last week. I am using a libre constant bg monitor and had a day where I ate moderately at 12 noon, then not again until 12 noon the next day so no food would have been affecting my bg. However an external stressful situation arose at 4pm, got steadily worse, peaking at 3 am then resolving. Let's just say several emergency agencies were involved. My bg graph shows those event so clearly.
Now that was an extreme example but really proved to me that even a moderate amount of underlying stress may have an effect on bg levels.

I do wonder if this is so in your case? Not prying, and not saying you can stop it overnight but anything you can be doing to reduce stress levels will help your bg. And eating low carb, of course

In the past I have used everything from yoga to meditation , counselling to chocolate! Diabetes-wise I have more or less given up on NHS, and have decided I have to do it for myself. Please don't fall off the low carb wagon just yet, or not for very long if you do really need a break. Imho you are much better being on lowcarb than off it.
 
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