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Type 2 If carb, the staple ones (pasta, potato etc) spike late how can our 2hrs after reading be accurate?

ickihun

ickihun

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I had a thought today......
If staple carbs spike us late. How accurate is our 2hrs after meter reading?
I appreciate meters are just a guide for either increased or decreased bgs but I feel unless no carbs in your diet would this delay occur. (Is that sustainable?)
Vegtables hold low volumes but accumulated with protein and even low staple carbs. That 2hr spike reading is misleading? Surely?
 
Spike is perhaps the wrong word that we're all become accustomed to using and something else might be a better word to describe what takes place to our blood glucose levels after eating.
As we diabetics know it's carbs (sugars) that are the problem and depending on the Gi/Gl of that food/drink item will give a rise in B/G levels, sometimes this rise will be slowly built up to a peak (spike) and gradually die back or with other food items the rise might be initially very rapid reaching a greater peak value than another food/drink item.
The 2 hour testing interval has more or less become the standard point where measurements are taken after knowing the initial levels before eating that particular food item, yes it's quite right that the peak might well occur before the 2 hour period has elapsed and many individuals will take additional readings at the 1 hour as well as the 2 hour points.
Ideally it would be nice to take multiple reading at short time intervals, but with the cost of strips being so expensive, and us type 2's having to pay for them, this option isn't practicable.
Using your blood/glucose meter before eating and then again 2 hours later is a compromise but it's the best that we can achieve, and should a reading indicate that the individual's B/G level is crossing into the TOO high level then that particular food/drink item should be rechecked at some later period and if the similar high Peaks (Spikes) should occur then the individual should be aware that that particular food/drink combination is probably best avoided.
I hope that this answers your question but I fear that it might not give the answer that you seek.
 
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I do feel i haven't got the whole picture of my diabetes. How can you solve a problem when you only have half the info?
It's a shame diabetes is just blundered through when it doesn't need to be.
I guess I should see it as at least we have the glass half full of info rather than half short?
I just need to concentrate on what I can do rather than what I carn't!
Positivity seems to be the key.
I need to find some, at the mo.
 
Have you thought about getting a libre for a couple of weeks? Then you would see EVERYTHING!
 
This is exactly why I find the libre so useful.

I eat VLC, so that is minimal carbs, normal protein and lots of fat.
The last two slow the absorption of what few carbs I do eat, and then there is a bit of a low flattish peak when the protein gets digested.

Turns out (thank you Libre) that all the time I tested at 2 hours, I was missing the peak I did have at around 2.5-3.5 hours.

HOWEVER, most people eat more carbs than me. And carb peaks are much earlier. In which case, the 2 hour prick test is a nice consistent comparison, and has allowed a LOT of people to tailor their diets to suit themselves. So I still think it is the best thing to suggest to newbies when they ask for a testing regime.
 
Nobody ever said that the two hour reading was accurate or useful. The only NHS advice was that if you took a reading two hours after eating and it was less that 8.5 then you were still alive. That is the official view. Those of us who show a bit of interest may test at other times and may aim for lower numbers. That's up to us. There is no reason why you shouldn't test at other times or frequencies to learn more.
 
Like brunneria I eat very low carb so my peak is always after two hours but it's slow and stays low. I found this out by testing at many intervals for a while and I never peaked fast unless I had carbs OR a large meal. All this frequent testing was a lot of strips and sticks but it helped me find my meals. So now I eat the same amount of carbs protein and fat at each given meal and I know pretty much where my bs will be. Now IF I are carbs I would spike closer to the one hour and it would be higher and it would not slowly come down. That was more information I got through frequent testing. I also need a certain amount of fat to slow my protein. All that being said frequent testing helped me put together macros at meals to get my bs where I wanted it to be without spikes and drops. I probably could go on autopilot now and not test but since I take insulin that would be foolish . That's just showing how predictable my bs is with my insulin and carefully constructed meals due to frequent testing.

I am one who really doesn't care what I eat. Don't get me wrong, I love my food and I wouldn't eat anything I don't like. I eat a variety of proteins and fats. Veggies stay similar but add a few new in here and there
I just get a little creative with sauces/ dressings to mix up flavors but most are mayo based. And let's not forget the avocado queen. Some with each meal does me well.

It can all be a bit mysterious and when I tried just eating whatever, I never got my numbers where I wanted so I just found a 'plan' and I'm sticking to it
 
@Brunneria that's interesting as when I was first diagnosed I was told 3hrs after. In pregnancy, tighter control on 5 insulin inj it was 2hrs.
My dn only wants pre-meal readings and fbg.
I like the whole picture so I need to invest in a libre, I think. Just to see what's going on. :)
 
Don't feel that you have to fund a libre and run it 24/7/365

It is about £150 for the reader and 2 sensors. That will give you 4 weeks of 24/7
- and that was plenty long enough for me to identify the blind spots I had, and correct them.

Since then, I consider my Libre indispensable when I am on hol or away from home, to monitor the (cough) disruption and encourage me to exert a bit of self control. :) I would also slap a sensor on if I were ill, to monitor bg levels during that. My bg during food poisoning was v entertaining. lol

But I could easily manage the rest of the time on prick tests or winging it (since I am T2 diet and exercise, no meds)

So don't think '£100 a month! Ow!!!'
Think instead 'a one off £150 for some in depth knowledge, with possible optional additional costs after that, at my convenience'
 
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ickihun said:
I had a thought today......
If staple carbs spike us late. How accurate is our 2hrs after meter reading?
I appreciate meters are just a guide for either increased or decreased bgs but I feel unless no carbs in your diet would this delay occur. (Is that sustainable?)
Vegtables hold low volumes but accumulated with protein and even low staple carbs. That 2hr spike reading is misleading? Surely?
Click to expand...

Type 2 is usually down to insulin resistance, of lack of beta cells to produce insulin. Or both.
So in a normal response, the body quickly releases insulin, and the glucose gets dealt with within 2 hours.
It you have an issue dealing with it, it's possible you will take longer to mop the glucose up.
(a reason why the GI works well for many, trickle the carbs in, and the limited insulin response can still keep up)
 
Brunneria said:
My bg during food poisoning was v entertaining. lol
Click to expand...

Personally, I'd say eating dodgy prawns or whatever gave you food poisoning was above and beyond the call of duty.

On a more serious note, @ickihun , we can all speculate how and why we peak at differing times, but my peak is my peak (not that I'm territorial or anything!), and Brunneria's is hers, if you see what I mean. Even very low carb, I tend to peak fairly promptly, then meander on down again.

Your discomfiture is exactly why I first invested in the Libre. I was concerned about both understanding my personal peak levels over a variety of foods, and my overnight blood activity. A "bonus" learning was how my bloods reacted to stress when I had a potentially tricky medical question unanswered for some time.

Honestly, I do appreciate it's a chunk of money, but there is a massive you could learn so much. Once you have the reader, you can pick and choose when, if at all, you have another sensor, or sensors.

The Libre gave me so much confidence about what was going on, and I now have a sensor from time to time, just to check I'm not meandering off track, or that my condition (away from those few snap shot, finger prick tests) isn't degrading.

I applied a sensor last night, so I'll be activating it tomorrow evening, then it's back to swiping my arm every now and then. After the sensor expires, if I'm not applying another, I still find myself scanning my arm. It's what happens when you get old, I'm advised by MrB. He lived. Just.
 
If you are insulin resistant, protein and dairy are pretty insulinogenic meaning they require more insulin so if you are resistant or not making enough, or both, they could cause a spike, especially in the absence of carbs and / or fat. If I eat protein without fat I will spike higher and faster than if I add fat.

Many don't have issues with protein or dairy but it's worth testing. Dairy sky rockets me, dang ! And it is worth testing adding fat to protein.
 
Yes definitely get a Libre, it can both confirm things for you and sometimes open your eyes to others. I think it's well worth the high outlay even if you only use it for a short while.

Regarding testing, I think these are just basic options, and it's probably simplest to suggest this regime to anyone who's confused and newly diagnosed. But you don't have to stick to these two reference points, you can adjust testing times to investigate your reactions to the different types of food you eat: e.g. at one hour for sugary food, and 3 hours for slow release starchy ones, and sometimes other points in between, and I know that people do this. It's essentially a matter of what exactly you hope to find out, and some of us tend to be much more curious than others. I actually cut most of the high starches and sugars from my diet before I got my meter, so I never felt the need to do this sort of detailed testing when I started, but I will now do a one hour test sometimes if I eat a different fruit or go a bit overboard eating something with a bit more sugar than usual in it. But my Libre has told me much more about the actual ways my glucose levels behave. My meter readings for meals have always tended to be a good way of ensuring I'm keeping on track.

Robbity
PS I think I may have possibly re-hashed a lot of what @Lazybones has already said...
 
@ickihun I was having a bit of an idle think - and concluded that two hour tests can actually tell you a few things:
  • if your pre meal and 2 hour post meal levels are similar, you could either have had a short sharpish spike/rose that's come down again quickly, or had very little rise at all
  • if your 2 hour post meal levels are somewhat higher then you're likely to be getting a longer slower rise or a late one
  • if post meal tests are very much higher, then it must mean you need to have a good think about what you're eating :wideyed: - or maybe you need to wash your mucky hands :eek: and retest
So presumably they'd be of more use in conjunction with a food diary. The patterns might well be more useful than actual figures, though you'd maybe need to do extra tests to see what's happening - or use a Libre...

Robbity
 
Recently I have found I am getting two peaks after my evening meal particularly. After eating my BG will rise then fall then rise again and then go down again normally within two to three hours. the second peak often higher than the first.
 
JohnEGreen said:
Recently I have found I am getting two peaks after my evening meal particularly. After eating my BG will rise then fall then rise again and then go down again normally within two to three hours. the second peak often higher than the first.
Click to expand...
Mine too. I thought it was just liver output.
On an evening but if I forget an injection on the morning too. Is that not part and parcel of insulin resistance. Stage 1 insulin different to stage 2. I use a mixed insulin M3. 70% on stage1 and 30% stage 2. Maybe it should be changed?
 
Could it be the carb spike 1st and then the protein is coming in?
I think that's where avocado helps me. Bridges the gap. Before avocado I would go low first and then high. It's probably the rate the different macros are getting there. I could be totally wrong....
 
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