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Initial Success With Fasting And Lchf But Stalling

Mat_Hunt

Mat_Hunt

Newbie
Messages
2
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
Hi,

I have type 2 diabetes and I have been looking at the books by Dr Jason Fung on fasting and also ketogenic diets. Initially I had quite a lot of success with this. My numbers came down to around 4.5-5.5mmol/l and when I was fasting, my morning blood glucose levels were around 4.5-5.4mmol/l and I was very happy with that, I quite rightly thought that I was getting on top on my diabetes reversing it. Then my numbers started to creep up annoyingly and although I could still get some very impressive results with my morning blood glucose levels when fasting my numbers would shoot up when I started to eat.

I think that even now, when I fast (I fast for up to 72 hours) the numbers aren't coming down as much as they used to and my blood stays around the 5.5mmol/l level.

Any idea what is going on? I've started ketogentic way of eating recently rather than low carb, so I don't quite understand just what is going on.

Mat
 
Thanks @Guzzler
Hi @Mat_Hunt
You say you have changed from LC to Keto .. ? Would you mind sharing what you have changed in what you eat just to see if there are any things that may be problematic.
Your numbers won't continue to come down all the time otherwise you'll end up at zero and won't be around any more!
My bloods usually live in the 5-5.5 range with odd excursions below 5 and odd peaks up to 6 ish or just over. I only get very low numbers (sub 4's) when on extended fasts, usually day 3 or 4 when my ketones get really high as well. It sounds like your numbers are similar to mine.
 
I was wondering about how one should break the fast. I'm assuming that it would be with something quite small and light, would that make such a difference?
 
@Mat_Hunt, there is the effect of physiologic insulin resistance, or "adaptive glucose sparing" on a LCHF or keto diet.

A great article about this is by Anne Mullens in the diet doctor's site, called 'Why high fasting glucose on LCHF or keto? It deals with FBG rather than post-meal BG but I can't see why the mechanism wouldn't apply to post meal dysfunction too? The thing to bear in mind is that it is a normal physical response to a low carb way of eating, in order to ensure the brain gets the glucose it needs, and happens to everyone, and is part of being in fat-burning mode rather than glucose-burning, but for those of us with blood glucose dysregulation it can be difficult to see. (BTW - I would be very happy with your level of dysregulation! :). Isn't 5.5 rather good going?)

I say this as someone who has eaten keto/LCHF for over three years, and I no-food fast fairly often, and IF as a matter of course. My liver still responds in a dysfunctional way to my blood glucose levels, even after all this time.

So, let your HBA1c be your guide to how your whole BG system is doing? How are those readings going?
 
Guzzler said:
I was wondering about how one should break the fast. I'm assuming that it would be with something quite small and light, would that make such a difference?
Click to expand...

Hi @Guzzler, I was re-reading this thread, and saw your unanswered question.

I have just come out of a four-day 'maintenance' fast, so I thought I might give it a bash. I eat normally, ie LCHF (with low carb fruit like berries and tomatoes), or hearty Keto, after fasting. Even after my longest one of 10 days. I have hard to solve metabolic problems, but refeeding syndrome is not a part of it. So no quite small and light refeeding for me. Meats and meat, cheeses, eggs, cream, a bit of almond flour, and a little low-carb fruit, is the usual.

Yes, the longer the intensive dietary management treatment (to borrow Fung's phrase for a wider range of treatments) ie no food, IFing, low calorie etc, the longer the lowered BG levels are after, in my own experience, and if this coincides with ketone levels I don't know but could experiment with this more in the future (but only via ketostix). Longer time away from the treatment - up the BGs go out of 'reversing' into 'prediabetes' range. It should be noted that I have severe insulin resistance, so this is true possibly for my type of T2D, but at least it is for me.
 
AloeSvea said:
Hi @Guzzler, I was re-reading this thread, and saw your unanswered question.

I have just come out of a four-day 'maintenance' fast, so I thought I might give it a bash. I eat normally, ie LCHF (with low carb fruit like berries and tomatoes), or hearty Keto, after fasting. Even after my longest one of 10 days. I have hard to solve metabolic problems, but refeeding syndrome is not a part of it. So no quite small and light refeeding for me. Meats and meat, cheeses, eggs, cream, a bit of almond flour, and a little low-carb fruit, is the usual.

Yes, the longer the intensive dietary management treatment (to borrow Fung's phrase for a wider range of treatments) ie no food, IFing, low calorie etc, the longer the lowered BG levels are after, in my own experience, and if this coincides with ketone levels I don't know but could experiment with this more in the future (but only via ketostix). Longer time away from the treatment - up the BGs go out of 'reversing' into 'prediabetes' range. It should be noted that I have severe insulin resistance, so this is true possibly for my type of T2D, but at least it is for me.
Click to expand...

Interesting stuff, thank you for replying.
 
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