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Message: <blockquote data-quote="phoenix" data-source="post: 944581" data-attributes="member: 12578">No you are just shouting not discussing .You yourself appealed to the authority of these three men, and if I remember felt it necessary in your first post to quote your own qualifications, why was that?  Personally I think you are appealing to 2 celebrity doctors and cherry picking a third  so it's slightly ironic that you accuse me (very rudely ) of appealing to authority.You acknowledge Dr Unger's work on Glucagon but somehow ignore the rest of his work on insulin which is very relevant to this discussion.Why is that?  Do you really think that peer review somehow works for his paper on insulin but not for the rest of his work? How do you decide?He has worked on islet cell,  insulin. glucagon and how the pancreas loses function in Type 2 and the consequences of the lack of function in T1 for 50 years .  So yes I would consider him far more of an authority than you ( someone who arrives claiming that Type 1s  could develop  T2 [happens sometimes but not that often ] and Type 2 becomes T1 , no it doesn't)You certainly  haven't addressed at  the mechanisms of the development of insulin resistance mentioned in either  the paper or my earlier post. You suggest that digestible carbs alone increase obesity, this increases insulin production and  release and this is  followed by insulin resistance.  Why then does weight loss by whatever means even very high carbohydrate diets  reduce insulin resistance ?  Certainly, as Hall has recently demonstrated,  lowering insulin is not essential for fat loss.I'm sure you've seen Carston Chows recent piece, but  others may not(and yes  I think that he and Kevin Hall are more of an authority than either  you or I) <a href="https://sciencehouse.wordpress.com/2015/09/09/the-world-of-gary-taubes/" target="_blank">https://sciencehouse.wordpress.com/2015/09/09/the-world-of-gary-taubes/</a>Neither have you addressed whether indeed 'too much'  exogenous insulin maybe a problem in T1. This was one of the original points of the thread  Interestingly Unger has addressed this fairly recently. And indeed,  levels needed for tight control may be contributing to  risk although.. perhaps not  Unger is a little ambiguous  ( From my own point of view, there are no long term outcomes in this study and the main findings are from animals . We  do know that people who keep their levels below around 7% have much better long term outcomes. We also know that people who omit insulin are at much  higher risk of all types of complications so to me this places the emphasis on hyperglycemia  )   <a href="http://www.jdcjournal.com/article/S1056-8727(12)00269-3/fulltext#back-bb0050" target="_blank">http://www.jdcjournal.com/article/S1056-8727(12)00269-3/fulltext#back-bb0050</a></blockquote>

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