LCHF and FASTING or EAT WELL PLATE? Or something else?!

Your nurse told you to eat as stated in UK guidelines for a healthy person ie the Eatwell Plate. She also told you reduce your Hba1c to around 31. Can't she make her mind up? These two requirements are mutually exclusive.

preRR said:

Any advice on whether LCHF or eat well plate is better....whether intermittent fasting works...or anything other dietary advice would be so helpful...feeling a little lost in all the information available!

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"Better" is subjective and that's something you'll need to decide for yourself. There are plenty of people who have had success with a balanced diet (eat well plate) just like there are plenty of people who have had success with a LCHF diet. Each diet has its own psychological and physiological benefits and drawbacks, and we each rank what's most important to us differently.

In the end, no diet will work if you can't stick to it. With that in mind, perhaps you can share with us what your particular struggles were over the last 10 years trying different diets? It's important to be self-aware of why you failed so you can make the necessary adjustments and learn from those experiences.

Personally, I follow a LCHF diet most of the time as it's easy for me to adhere to, and it helps me achieve my blood sugar and body composition goals. However, during the holidays I tend to follow a low-calorie balanced diet so I can enjoy the occasional party or celebration and simply exercise portion control rather than avoid an entire macronutrient (carbs).

You will find that many people on this forum have found success following a LCHF diet, and I expect you will receive quite a few responses from people sharing those success. It's certainly an approach that works for many of us, but just know that there are other effective approaches as well.

I would start with reducing carbs and not worry about fat for the time being. It's useful to know that you can add fat if you are hungry, this makes LCHF easier to stick to because hunger can be a thing of the past. Just remember to have full fat products, not low fat ones and you will be fine.

Here's a couple of links that may help:-

http://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/a-new-low-carb-guide-for-beginners.68695/
www.diabetes.co.uk/lowcarb

As above.

Focus on reducing your Carbohydrate intake as much as possible....ditch Bread, Potatoes, Rice and Pasta and see how your BG levels react.

When I was first told that I had glucose in my urine, and needed to take care of my diet I started following the Low GI diet, and ended up with full blown TD2 in less than 2 years, so I wouldn't personally recommend the Eat Well Plate method.

@preRR apart from contributing to weight gain, carbohydrates turn to sugar in your body. So you should understand they aren't good for diabetics, or pre-diabetics. I wish I had known that when I was pre-diabetic. I could have avoided becoming diabetic.

My suggestion is to reduce your carbs (bread, pasta, rice, potatoes and flour) as much as you can sustain, avoid all sweet stuff including fizzy drinks, and swap all your low fat products for the real thing. You don't need to have high fat, just stop avoiding it. Also be careful with fruit and milk.

TorqPenderloin said:

You will find that many people on this forum have found success following a LCHF diet, and I expect you will receive quite a few responses from people sharing those success.

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I misspoke in my previous post. The bolded part should have read "blindly advising you to follow a LCHF diet because they assume that just because it works for them means it must work for everyone."

TorqPenderloin said:

I misspoke in my previous post. The bolded part should have read "blindly advising you to follow a LCHF diet because they assume that just because it works for them means it must work for everyone."

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Torq we can only advise on what works for ourselves, and maybe mention what didn't. I can't advise someone to follow a diet that didn't work for me. I don't see anything wrong with starting with LCHF and modifying it to suit oneself and then trying something different if necessary. Surely it makes sense to start with the diet that seems to help most people? My GP gave me a low GL diet. I put on 8 pounds in 2 weeks. I can't honestly tell someone else that's a good choice. If LCHF doesn't work for the OP then they can try something else.

It's carbs together with fat that causes the problem. So an alternative would be HCLF. However realistically this is only suitable for vegetarians/vegans because anyone who eats meat would probably already be having too much fat to be LF anyway. To my mind LCHF is preferable because we all need a certain amount of fat in our diet. Carbs aren't necessary, so it makes sense to reduce carbs and increase fat.

I did a HCLF low cal diet for 7 weeks and suffered for it, that's why I can't advise anyone else to follow it. You yourself usually follow LCHF so I don't know what your problem is. It's up to the individual to choose. I'm not forcing them to do what I say. I'm just giving my point of view. If that doesn't suit someone then they will soon find out and try another option: everyone has to start somewhere.

@preRR I agree with @Squire Fulwood that the UK Eatwell Plate is not a good choice. Besides breads and cereals it includes things like cola and sweets. The problem with carbs is that they are addictive so the more you have the more you want them.

http://www.nhs.uk/livewell/goodfood/documents/eatwellplate.pdf

As a start, I would say cut out sugar completely and avoid all processed foods (ready meals/pizzas/takeaways etc.) Reduce your carb intake and get yourself a Blood Sugar Monitor (SD codefree is the cheapest overall as the test strips are far less costly than other brands). Test before meals and 2 hours after when hopefully your blood sugars will return to the pre-meal reading). Mostly, don't panic it takes a lot of time to understand diabetes and how you as an individual react to certain foods. Get plenty of exercise, a 20 min brisk walk can do wonders, perhaps go for a swim or to the gym - do whatever appeals to you. Drink plenty of water and stay in touch with this website - there is no end of good information and kindly people willing to share their experiences.

Hi @preRR and welcome to the forum.
You will find that people are passionate about the dietary plan that they follow and so I am going tag @daisy1 to provide you with some basic information that will explain things.
You may have to restrict the carbohydrates that you eat but how many is a perfect amount for you is like asking how long is a pice of string as we are all unique as to how many grammes we can tolerate.
Keep asking questions, have a good read around the forum and remember that gaining control is a marathon as opposed to a sprint.

preRR said:

Thanks again all!

Quite a lot of trial and error ahead then!...Feeling anxious!

I'm thinking as a starting point...reducing the obvious sugary stuff (for me that's mainly chocolate and cake)...lowering my carb intake but not total elimination...and trying non low-calorie/low-fat versions of things...those 3 steps for me are quite big changes!!!

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That sounds like a good plan to me. Some of us have a couple of squares of 70%+ dark chocolate when we feel the need. I started with Lindt 70% and have now worked up to 99%. The taste is so strong you don't need much. Check the packs though as some dark chocolate is still quite high in carbs. Lidl and Tesco sell their own which is OK too. I can't help you with cake because I've never really been that keen on cakes, but there are lots of recipes around the forum if you are good at baking. (I'm not!)

@preRR

Hello and welcome to the forum Here is the information we give to new members and I hope you will find it useful in making your eating choices. In particular there is much advice on carbs which should be restricted. Eating reasonable amounts of fat is OK. Ask as many questions as you like and someone will be able to help, in addition to all the good advice you have already had above.

BASIC INFORMATION FOR NEW MEMBERS

Diabetes is the general term to describe people who have blood that is sweeter than normal. A number of different types of diabetes exist.

A diagnosis of diabetes tends to be a big shock for most of us. It’s far from the end of the world though and on this forum you’ll find over 150,000 people who are demonstrating this.

On the forum we have found that with the number of new people being diagnosed with diabetes each day, sometimes the NHS is not being able to give all the advice it would perhaps like to deliver - particularly with regards to people with type 2 diabetes.

The role of carbohydrate

Carbohydrates are a factor in diabetes because they ultimately break down into sugar (glucose) within our blood. We then need enough insulin to either convert the blood sugar into energy for our body, or to store the blood sugar as body fat.

If the amount of carbohydrate we take in is more than our body’s own (or injected) insulin can cope with, then our blood sugar will rise.

The bad news

Research indicates that raised blood sugar levels over a period of years can lead to organ damage, commonly referred to as diabetic complications.

The good news

People on the forum here have shown that there is plenty of opportunity to keep blood sugar levels from going too high. It’s a daily task but it’s within our reach and it’s well worth the effort.

Controlling your carbs

The info below is primarily aimed at people with type 2 diabetes, however, it may also be of benefit for other types of diabetes as well.
There are two approaches to controlling your carbs:

• Reduce your carbohydrate intake
• Choose ‘better’ carbohydrates

Reduce your carbohydrates

A large number of people on this forum have chosen to reduce the amount of carbohydrates they eat as they have found this to be an effective way of improving (lowering) their blood sugar levels.

The carbohydrates which tend to have the most pronounced effect on blood sugar levels tend to be starchy carbohydrates such as rice, pasta, bread, potatoes and similar root vegetables, flour based products (pastry, cakes, biscuits, battered food etc) and certain fruits.

Choosing better carbohydrates

Another option is to replace ‘white carbohydrates’ (such as white bread, white rice, white flour etc) with whole grain varieties. The idea behind having whole grain varieties is that the carbohydrates get broken down slower than the white varieties –and these are said to have a lower glycaemic index.
http://www.diabetes.co.uk/food/diabetes-and-whole-grains.html

The low glycaemic index diet is often favoured by healthcare professionals but some people with diabetes find that low GI does not help their blood sugar enough and may wish to cut out these foods altogether.

Read more on carbohydrates and diabetes

LOW CARB PROGRAM:
http://www.diabetes.co.uk/low carb program


Eating what works for you

Different people respond differently to different types of food. What works for one person may not work so well for another. The best way to see which foods are working for you is to test your blood sugar with a glucose meter.

To be able to see what effect a particular type of food or meal has on your blood sugar is to do a test before the meal and then test after the meal. A test 2 hours after the meal gives a good idea of how your body has reacted to the meal.

The blood sugar ranges recommended by NICE are as follows:

Blood glucose ranges for type 2 diabetes

• Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 8.5 mmol/l

Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (adults)

• Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 9 mmol/l

Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (children)

• Before meals: 4 to 8 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 10 mmol/l

However, those that are able to, may wish to keep blood sugar levels below the NICE after meal targets.

Access to blood glucose test strips

The NICE guidelines suggest that people newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes should be offered:

• structured education to every person and/or their carer at and around the time of diagnosis, with annual reinforcement and review
• self-monitoring of plasma glucose to a person newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes only as an integral part of his or her self-management education

Therefore both structured education and self-monitoring of blood glucose should be offered to people with type 2 diabetes. Read more on getting access to bloodglucose testing supplies.

You may also be interested to read questions to ask at a diabetic clinic

Note: This post has been edited from Sue/Ken's post to include up to date information.

preRR said:

More thanks! Especially for the further reading and advice.

Sorry, I'm new to forums as well as prediabetes so struggling to keep up but I really appreciate all the advice and ideas

The exercise part doesn't scare me as much as the food bit!...cutting anything out completely fills me with fear although I realise this may be necessary depending how my sugar levels change over the next few months/years. I'm hoping to be able to reduce/restrict than cut out carbs completely, at least for now.

I exercise every day....walking just doing my usual routine stuff is around 20-30 minutes plus 45 minutes aerobics/jogging/swimming a few times a week on top of that....although a broken toe has not helped in the last couple of months...getting back to normal now!

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I hear what you are saying. Remember to add new things to your diet to replace the things you are cutting out/reducing then you won't feel so hard done by. As far as I know only one person on this forum has cut out carbs completely. The rest of us have plenty of leafy green veg and low carb fruits like berries. Opt for taste as far as you can and you will wonder what you ever saw in bland foods like bread and pasta. I didn't have the benefit of this forum when I started LCHF, but I well remember filling my plate with tasty foods. For the first time since childhood hunger was not an issue. Fried breakfasts were back in again (minus the fried bread and hash browns -pity I don't like eggs ) I wasn't hungry anymore. There's an amazing freedom in that. Remember too that you are only just pre-diabetic, it's great that this has been picked up so early.

Oh and keep posting so we can share your progress and in doing so you will be helping others too.

I was eating something close to the Eatwell Plate, and I got diabetes. I switched to an LCHF lifestyle and reduced my HbA1c/glucose levels dramatically within a few months. Carbohydrates raise my glucose levels so I now see that as a very good reason to avoid them where possible in my current diet.

Robbity

preRR said:

cutting anything out completely fills me with fear

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You've already had lots of good advice, but my tuppence-worth is that you don't actually have to cut anything out completely. You're not allergic to carbohydrates, they're just not particularly good for you. Reducing them will certainly improve not only your numbers at the moment, but protect your long-term future. As you're in pre-diabetic numbers, it might not take a huge change to keep you the right side of things. You're not looking for a dramatic change, just an improvement.

I would start with a program of gradual reduction - a drastic stopping of all carbohydrates can make you feel pretty off-colour and it takes a little while for both your digestive system to adapt to different make up of food to process, but dropping blood sugar levels quickly can give rise to its own set of problems. Your body needs time to adapt to that too. It's also easier to maintain if you gradually evolve your diet and get used to it, rather than an overnight change that you might not be able to sustain. You're not going 'on a diet' you're looking at a whole new approach to eating, so steady does it.

On the plus side, if you reduce carbs and replace it with protein and full fat foods like eggs, cheese and full fat yogurt, you won't feel hungry. I get hungry in advance of a meal, but I don't sit here at 4pm wondering what I can get away with eating as I'm starving and it's hours until dinner. I most certainly did when I ate more carbs and less fat.