needlephobia -picc or similar possible for bood tests&iv treatment?

[grantg]

Wondering if anyone has some suggestions. Struggle getting bloods done. Receiving counselling via psychologist to assist. They've referred me to community mental health team earlier today as already have had 6 sessions (max allowed via primary care mental health team for the hospital)

Recently been offered some immune system changing iv which can delay for a few years Rather than have to go through several bloods done daily alongside IV line inserted 14 days in a row.

I'm after alternative possible longer term solution I had though perhaps picc line? That way would be one procedure having to sit through (hopefully asleep) once only.

I did ask if possible for cannula to be left in. Due to treatment being 14 days and would be done in day ward they can't leave in for infection control.

If someone has some experience would appreciate. I had idea of picc line from family member who has several over the years for an other condition.

Not quite sure how best to request above either .

 

[Pipp]

I am not sure of your reason for wanting a PICC line, @grantg.
Are you saying that you will be having IV treatment daily for 14 days? Also that blood samples will be drawn several times a day?

PICC lines come with their own problems, but I think you will have researched and understood those. Inserting one does involve having a needle, (local anaesthetic, or general anaesthetic).

I think the best advice would come from the medical teams you will be seeing both for the phobia, and the 14 day immune therapy.

 

[grantg]

I am not sure of your reason for wanting a PICC line, @grantg.
Are you saying that you will be having IV treatment daily for 14 days? Also that blood samples will be drawn several times a day?

PICC lines come with their own problems, but I think you will have researched and understood those. Inserting one does involve having a needle, (local anaesthetic, or general anaesthetic).

I think the best advice would come from the medical teams you will be seeing both for the phobia, and the 14 day immune therapy.

Yip new iv line each day. Bloods monitored start and finish. Each treatment period can't leave hospital with line still in. Aware of some of the infection issues picc lines have alongside some of the other potential issues. Family member has had several over the years. Once going through preferably asleep (which is possible) I think I could deal with even though would need get it out again in the future at some point is very likely should of of issues it can bring come into fruition. Going through multiple iv insertions alongside blood work don't think I can cope with that. Really wish it was done via injections like originally was informed which i was prepared for I'm not too bad with likes of jags. Immensely better than was just a few years ago. Every few months spinal injection cope okish with as well. Not the blood nor needle have issue with as such. More the insertion itself which likely doesn't make too much sense.

My preferred solution which asked consultant isn't possible would of been cannulae left in and covered.

Other worry I have regarding treatment is if I start it and unable to continue if that would then destroy someone else's chance of having it. I don't mind treatment doesn't agree with me for other reactions if having stop that's not a waste, stopping due to what is an irrational fear is entirely different.

I'm unable to see the primary care physiologist anymore. Community team which been referred to by them today is exceptionally long wait and most likely would then be too late for that treatment by the time either cognitive behaviour therapy and/or exposure therapy would help enough.

Teplizumab is the immuno therapy treatment which was offered. Have researched it pretty thoroughly aware risks, just the usual method don't think I could tolerate for the extensive period lines would be in daily for. Diazapan and temazepam are given for simple blood draws (max dosages both) alongside some other distraction techniques still frequently hyperventilate and pass out from the panic/anxiety attack that occurs hence looking for a possible alternative solution. Does not necessarily have to be picc line. Suggestions for the phobia open to as well. Have done a lot of research and made a few small steps in right direction just not enough yet I did ask today's appt they will write to gp and diabetic team in hope of perhaps able to speed up further counselling alongside trying to arrange for me to spend a little time speaking to a phlebotomist. Various needle phobias effect a fairly high percentage of people.

 

[Royjk]

Hello @grantg I know that needle phobia thingy, but I have so far managed to just focus on the windows, or intensly study a spot on the wall and pretend nothing is happening while the nurse does her stuff on my arm. With 5 days infusions, there is normally several bloods and up to 6 hours a day plugged in through the cannula. My wife suggests I get a port fitted but so far I have managed to do cannula's.
I am not a medical expert but I understand they like to do PICC lines for long term longer than 15 days, and up to several months. But also there is a midline catheter, that they would use for up a month, this may be an alternative for your 14 day outpatient visit, but I am unsure if they do multiple lumens. They may, it would just need a request to your doctor, tell him about your phobia.
Royjk

 

[grantg]

also there is a midline catheter, that they would use for up a month, this may be an alternative for your 14 day outpatient visit, but I am unsure if they do multiple lumens. They may, it would just need a request to your doctor, tell him about your phobia.
Royjk

That's something I haven't researched thanks will look into it to see if it's something might be able to tolerate and indeed a question will raise with consultant if is. Thanks very much appreciated. Procedure is max couple of hours a day for intended treatment. I didnt whilst admitted hospital cannulae only issue was initially going in then lot less coming out. Hookes up for several days to get dka under control. Had several lines within that stayvdue to various reasons (none of them my fault) Sorry to hear own woes with needles. Best wishes

 

[Pipp]

I'm unable to see the primary care physiologist anymore

Do you mean psychologist?

It is most unfortunate for patients and hardly cost effective for the health services , to limit contact time and discharge patients before they have their mental / emotional health fully addressed.

I do have empathy for you and the situation you are in, regarding your phobia.
When faced with similar, a severe phobia to general anaesthetic, I had four short sessions with a psychologist who used compassion based therapy. I had to do a lot of work myself, but the new perspective I found on reasons for the phobia, and how to deal with, and conquer the effects of that fear have enabled me to have the surgeries under GA that I needed.
Perhaps the resources could be of use to you? I hope so. It would be a shame to miss out on a potentially life improving treatment .

Videos

www.compassionatemind.co.uk

 

[Grant_Vicat]

Yip new iv line each day. Bloods monitored start and finish. Each treatment period can't leave hospital with line still in. Aware of some of the infection issues picc lines have alongside some of the other potential issues. Family member has had several over the years. Once going through preferably asleep (which is possible) I think I could deal with even though would need get it out again in the future at some point is very likely should of of issues it can bring come into fruition. Going through multiple iv insertions alongside blood work don't think I can cope with that. Really wish it was done via injections like originally was informed which i was prepared for I'm not too bad with likes of jags. Immensely better than was just a few years ago. Every few months spinal injection cope okish with as well. Not the blood nor needle have issue with as such. More the insertion itself which likely doesn't make too much sense.

My preferred solution which asked consultant isn't possible would of been cannulae left in and covered.

Other worry I have regarding treatment is if I start it and unable to continue if that would then destroy someone else's chance of having it. I don't mind treatment doesn't agree with me for other reactions if having stop that's not a waste, stopping due to what is an irrational fear is entirely different.

I'm unable to see the primary care physiologist anymore. Community team which been referred to by them today is exceptionally long wait and most likely would then be too late for that treatment by the time either cognitive behaviour therapy and/or exposure therapy would help enough.

Teplizumab is the immuno therapy treatment which was offered. Have researched it pretty thoroughly aware risks, just the usual method don't think I could tolerate for the extensive period lines would be in daily for. Diazapan and temazepam are given for simple blood draws (max dosages both) alongside some other distraction techniques still frequently hyperventilate and pass out from the panic/anxiety attack that occurs hence looking for a possible alternative solution. Does not necessarily have to be picc line. Suggestions for the phobia open to as well. Have done a lot of research and made a few small steps in right direction just not enough yet I did ask today's appt they will write to gp and diabetic team in hope of perhaps able to speed up further counselling alongside trying to arrange for me to spend a little time speaking to a phlebotomist. Various needle phobias effect a fairly high percentage of people.

Interestingly @grantg a phlebotomist noticed that I am needle phobic and said "So am I! Many phlebotomists are, but it helps us put ourselves in your position." I entirely empathise.

 

[grantg]

Do you mean psychologist?

It is most unfortunate for patients and hardly cost effective for the health services , to limit contact time and discharge patients before they have their mental / emotional health fully addressed.

I do have empathy for you and the situation you are in, regarding your phobia.
When faced with similar, a severe phobia to general anaesthetic, I had four short sessions with a psychologist who used compassion based therapy. I had to do a lot of work myself, but the new perspective I found on reasons for the phobia, and how to deal with, and conquer the effects of that fear have enabled me to have the surgeries under GA that I needed.
Perhaps the resources could be of use to you? I hope so. It would be a shame to miss out on a potentially life improving treatment .

Videos

www.compassionatemind.co.uk

Indeed psychologist didn't have glasses on sometimes struggle to read without them big fingers small mobile at other times.

thanks very much will be watching the videos. Will look up 'compassion based therapy' as well see if it has something which isnt in the leaflets alongside other stuff have looked up. Moodjuice been the most helpful so far for me

agree its unfortunate limitations of sessions. however more sessions would mean even longer wait times for others. i waited from mid jan this year. was seen twice in january whilst hospitalised. Assessed to see if had capacity or not to section under AWI. was suppossed to be seen a third time whilst in, big storm prevented that.

a wee win, now able to attach libre sensor myself using emla cream, currently leaving it on for 5-10 mins less each time which i hope in time will get used to it enough so don't feel the need to use.

glad you were able to conquer your own fear. have no doubt in time i will be able to.

 

[grantg]

Interestingly @grantg a phlebotomist noticed that I am needle phobic and said "So am I! Many phlebotomists are, but it helps us put ourselves in your position." I entirely empathise.

effects 10% population so not surprised there is phlebotomist's that have same issues too. what would be great if they actually read notes inclusive of whats written on whiteboard on wall above hospital bed stating issue and current meds/methods used to try assist rather than showing frustratoin "don't have time for this" followed swiftly by "do you want it done or not". Few hours later yet another attempt at AWI (adults with incapacity) to get put in place. AWI was never granted.

 

[Grant_Vicat]

effects 10% population so not surprised there is phlebotomist's that have same issues too. what would be great if they actually read notes inclusive of whats written on whiteboard on wall above hospital bed stating issue and current meds/methods used to try assist rather than showing frustratoin "don't have time for this" followed swiftly by "do you want it done or not". Few hours later yet another attempt at AWI (adults with incapacity) to get put in place. AWI was never granted.

You are very unlucky judging from my experience!

 

[grantg]

You are very unlucky judging from my experience!

theres been a few times was good nhs staff, night vs day difference depending whom/where eg: drs surgery nurse very patient and understanding giving up part of her lunch break. local hospital few weeks ago was also fairly good gave flu jag same day instead of needing to pop back for it a couple of weeks later (no emla for the flu jag area either) which was last sucessful time, local hospital were terrible the time before that. Have had several spinal injections as well for pain relief due to spondylothesis. Those injections don't particulary bother me now. slightly worried with honeymoon phase... effect. 12th dec is next one still going to go ahead with that.

getting there which is why have faith will eventually overcome alongside never missed (intentionally) any of the min 4 daily insulin injections required to do. so lucky for honeymoon period managed to stop entirely needing (which is very rare) less than 3%. I wouldnt say unlucky.

edit: forgot one sentence the very last above.

 

[Antje77]

Have had several spinal injections as well for pain relief due to spondylothesis. Those injections don't particulary bother me now.

You may be onto something with your phobia here.
Do you know what caused you to have less issues with those injections now than you did at the beginning?
It proves that your fear can change for the better in particular situations. Can you look for something similar with other injections?

 

[grantg]

Do you know what caused you to have less issues with those injections now than you did at the beginning?
It proves that your fear can change for the better in particular situations. Can you look for something similar with other injections?

No idea what caused initial issue. Been that way for as long as I can remember.
35+ years ago. Earliest memory for blood draws coming around after passing out surrounded by loads of hospital staff. Had very high iron count, never did find out cause.was unable to get checked properly despite multiple attempts over several years.

Have fear of dental work as well I'm aware of cause for dental issue don't think related.

Spinal injections, think tolerate them due to relief brings even though it's relatively short term. Able to sleep more than couple of hours at a time for a few weeks after them.