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<blockquote data-quote="Oldvatr" data-source="post: 2516071" data-attributes="member: 196898"><p>OK, as I read the intro, they took 191 T2D and split them randomly. 4 years later they followed up, and 50 of them had doubled their creatinine levels and therefore halved their eGFR. In other words one quarter of the cohort got afflicted by Stage 3 or 4 kidney disease. Thats a very high number over a short period especially since there were 20 who did not get the follow up. I smell a rat or at least a guinea pig. These people must have had some oother selection criteria that is not declared in this report that is posssibly confounding since that rate of atrition is greater than the general diabetic poulation. Again the same number, but reduced by one for some reason either died or had a kidney transplant. Again higher than the average population. So presumanly the cohort was selected for being at the last stages anyway before this study started. Presume but not declared? We also have to presume that none of the first statistic also appear in the second. i.e. those who halved their creatine successfully did not die or get transplanted. So again we have to presume that 18 extra people died or got new kidneys in the test group. </p><p></p><p>The other possible confounder is how many in the Control Group changed their diet and became vegetarian or vegan in the interval or just reduced meat content. Did they even ask the question at the follow up? I have to ask myself, these authors may be learned, but do they actually understand the function of creatin?</p><p></p><p>Edit to add correction. Apparently all the participants were nephrology patients to start with. The entry GFR needed to be between 15 qnd 75 ml/min. The primary outcomes were creatinine doubling from baseline whatever that was when measured at start, or death.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Oldvatr, post: 2516071, member: 196898"] OK, as I read the intro, they took 191 T2D and split them randomly. 4 years later they followed up, and 50 of them had doubled their creatinine levels and therefore halved their eGFR. In other words one quarter of the cohort got afflicted by Stage 3 or 4 kidney disease. Thats a very high number over a short period especially since there were 20 who did not get the follow up. I smell a rat or at least a guinea pig. These people must have had some oother selection criteria that is not declared in this report that is posssibly confounding since that rate of atrition is greater than the general diabetic poulation. Again the same number, but reduced by one for some reason either died or had a kidney transplant. Again higher than the average population. So presumanly the cohort was selected for being at the last stages anyway before this study started. Presume but not declared? We also have to presume that none of the first statistic also appear in the second. i.e. those who halved their creatine successfully did not die or get transplanted. So again we have to presume that 18 extra people died or got new kidneys in the test group. The other possible confounder is how many in the Control Group changed their diet and became vegetarian or vegan in the interval or just reduced meat content. Did they even ask the question at the follow up? I have to ask myself, these authors may be learned, but do they actually understand the function of creatin? Edit to add correction. Apparently all the participants were nephrology patients to start with. The entry GFR needed to be between 15 qnd 75 ml/min. The primary outcomes were creatinine doubling from baseline whatever that was when measured at start, or death. [/QUOTE]
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