Statin, yes or no ....?

PenfoldAPD said:

Really appreciate everyone who has taken time to respond - thank you. I need to research more - HbA1c results tomorrow (11 weeks after diagnosis) and cholesterol so that will be interesting. My GP is returning at the end of March - she is wonderful, but I'm hoping the next one might be more forward thinking ... eyes raised when I said I was testing doesn't help does it?

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It is hard to understand what is the matter with HCPs. It obviously does help and is how I have reduced my Hba1c.

AtkinsMo said:

There are no circumstances where I would take statins. The studies supporting them are not reliable, in my humble opinion. I am not a doctor, but have read and read and read on this topic and really believe that drug company profits have lead to exaggeration of the benefits of these drugs and understatement of the risks.
The only group of people for whom statins have a benefit are men who have already had a heart attack, where they offer a small but statistically significant benefit in terms of reduction in likelihood of a second event, for everybody else there has never been statistically significant benefits. Statistical tricks are played with figures, reporting benefits in relative terms (so they appear much greater) and risks in absolute terms (so they appear much smaller). Women with the higher cholesterol levels live longest! Benecol and the like reduces total cholesterol but worsens the profile, as well as reducing LDL it reduces HDL. A superb book to start reading is Malcolm Kendrick's 'The Great Cholesterol Con', but there are loads of others.

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I have had years of feeling sort of harassed to take statins, then find, on doing the reading, that my levels may not be too bad after all. Very confusing. Also re the risks of statins, it seems to depend who is taking them, this latest study finds a rare problem -
http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMra1515161
- as someone who already has several autoimmune diseases this makes me more sure i won't be taking statins.

I neve rhad a ny trouble or pain taking statins but after reading forums on hereabout them I decided on my own to stop taking them...Doctor is unaware I have stopped but I will inform the diabetese Nurse begging of May when i have my 3 monthly blood test results i feel no different having not taken them so unsure if doing right or wrong

One of the problems with statins is that side effects can suddenly come, out of the blue without warning and some of them (the rare ones) are severe and irreversible. That is why you have a liver and kidney function test every year.
It is also the effects of statins in general that concerns me, they block a pathway that prevents cholesterol being made in the first place but it also effects other pathways, resulting in other processes being disrupted, like the synthesis of Vit D.

These arbitrary levels for targets for Cholesterol levels have been plucked from the air, the presumption was made that 'the lower the better' but there is no evidence to back that up. The presumption was made that the diabetic threshold should be even lower because diabetics tend to have more heart disease risk, but the reality is that statins can and do worsen blood glucose control and it is the high blood glucose levels that cause inflammation in the arteries.

Since 2005 there has been more regulation of the pharmaceutical industry, they have to pre-register research and they have to publish the results, good or bad. Since then there have been no studies showing any benefits to statin therapy, for the vast majority of people. More and more independent researchers are going back and looking again at the earlier Statin trials, and concluding that the benefits were over-stated and the risks down-played, there are many trials where the original data has never been published, so it cannot be interrogated independently. It is an international disgrace, pharmaceutical companies putting profits before people.

... another convert to the cause Not preaching from the pulpit mind you.

Enclave said:

I was put on statin some years ago .. The worst thing I ever did was to take them .. I fully believe that they are the cause of my T2 and my ill health, along with being ordered to eat low fat and high carbs !
I have stopped taking them now and LCHF .. I feel and look 10+ years younger ..
But if they aggree with you then go for it .... I did try plant steroid tablets, the side effects were the same as taking statins for me

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I was put on them also and blame them for causing my Diabetes.... I am absolutely sure of it as never showed any signs of Diabetes untill a year after taking them and everyone I have spoken to also say they were on statins before being diognosed with Diabetes this realy needs looking into don't you think?

I was put on Atorvastatin 15 years because my GP said it would protect me being Diabetic. I have never experienced any muscle pain and my cholesterol has always been below 4, last result was 3.4 in January this year. It's a personal choice wether you take them or not? My Father died of a sudden Heart Attack and my 2 Brothers have both had minor Heart Attacks - they now take Statins in hope to not have anymore heart trouble.

I found this to be a good article...
http://www.docsopinion.com/2014/07/17/triglyceride-hdl-ratio/

Incidentally my Triglycerides/HDL ratio improved significantly from 5 to 2.2 just though LDL went up slightly 114mg to 134mg after 1 month of LCHF.

I did research on statin and cholesterol yesterday and decided to stop my meds. Not enough research to confirm the need for it, but plenty adverse reactions.

As a physician, for years I subscribed to the Statin dogma. Taking them for 2 years from 2011 changed my opinion. I was one of the 25% or so who must have the genes that make Statin side-effects more likely. Not straight away, problems developed in a subtle way, becoming progressive after 9 months or so. Symptoms included muscle wasting, weakness, muscle fibre tears [particularly in the calf, I'm a jogger] tendon tears, low mood, cognitive issues, peripheral neuritis, loss of joint position sense, ED, sluggish bowel etc.
On Simvastatin 10mg my total cholesterol was in the 3's. Now, without Statins my level is 4.3. Not that I'm at all interested. CHD prevention does not require low cholesterol, it needs low intravascular inflammation. Statins work, modestly, by suppressing inflammation.
I'm convinced that the data on Statins has been cherry-picked by the Pharma companies and the profession has swallowed it hook, line and sinker. The 2013 Lancet Meta-analysis on Statins involved, I believe 28 trials, all but one sponsored by drug companies. The trials were not properly blinded and everyone knew which subjects received the Statin. There was more surgical and other intervention in the Statin group. There is also the issue of absolute versus relative risk. The results show the what that the Physicians believe in and what the companies seek. It is interesting to see that there's more scepticism in Italy regarding Statins and omega-3s are used a lot instead.
I've gradually recovered from what I see as Statin toxicity, probably aided by self-medication with Ubiquinol and PQQ [repairing the mitochondrial damage inflicted]. I can now complete 3x 5km runs each week with no muscle tears.
I do not advise stopping Statins if one is at high risk [angina, previous MI, stroke etc] but arm yourself with a big dose of scepticism ,question the physicians and maintain 3G/day intake of omega-3 fatty acids.

From today's Daily Telegraph, an item strongly critical of the Cholesterol hypothesis, statins and the Pharma industry.

Good old Aseem Malhotra! Will the politicians, will NICE, will the doctors be listening? I see they have approved a new drug for 'treating' high cholesterol for use in the NHS. The gravy train continues.

Oh - and thanks for that @Cap'n M

News headlines this past week:

"Statins benefits underestimated, review says"

See: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-37306736

Don't you believe it, there's a lot of criticism in the pipeline of this Oxford review.
Try this paper:

"Beyond Confusion and Controversy,
Can We Evaluate the Real Efficacy and
Safety of Cholesterol-Lowering with Statins?"

http://jcbmr.com/index.php/jcbmr/rt/printerFriendly/11/26

And who were the reviewers? Answers on a post-card please!!!