Testing strips petition and Diabetes UK policy

I have been giving this subject a lot of thought recently.

I signed the petition for strips to be made available to all, now I am questioning if this is the right thing to do.

The present "advice" and guidleines make it easy for HCP's to duck ths issue and refuse to give strips. However, there seem to be quite a few who get them, who don't use them. The one pot Ebayer's must be getting prescribed yeah? They are obviously not using them but are making a nice little earner selling to the desperate like me. :evil: Do their HCP's not check their so called results?
Also those that are prescribed but don't know the first thing to do with the results. There are also those who get the strips and the meds but decide not to make any changes to diet, lifestyle..

So, who should get them. It's a minefield but I firmly believe that those who ask for them as part of their self management should get them.

I went along to an event with Diabetes UK and a HCP yesterday which I will comment on soon. What was noticeable was that the test strips issue had obviously been flogged to death at the previous events (quite rightly) so it is an issue uppermost in a lot of peoples minds.

Is it the right way to go to ask for strips for everyone? I'm beginning to think not, especially as we know that cost is the issue, nothing else, despite what the HCP's like to tell us. :roll:

Thoughts please?

Bit of a tricky one to say the least.
I signed the petition for myself and the majority of T2's who use the strips pro-actively,whether it's to learn about the foods we can or can't eat AND/OR to monitor for changes in our levels that we need to bring to the attention of our HCP's.
I would have NO idea whatsoever how bad things are getting for me if it hadn't been for testing before meals,after meals,fasting and randomly and my referral to the hospital happened because my GP listened to my symptoms in conjunction with him looking at my meters memory and entering the data on to my medical records and my referral letter to the Endo.
However,having said that,it DOES infuriate me the thought of patients who get prescribed strips,but have NO intention of using them pro-actively and sell them on sites such as eBay!! :x
My first purchase of optium plus strips from there,when I recieved them,it appeared as if a Pharmacists label had been removed from the box which infuriated me so now I'm sourcing strips on eBay from Home health uk who supplied me with my codefree SD meter and cheap strips.
Also I agree that strips should not be prescribed to people who have no idea what the results are telling them-they may genuinely not know what a high reading is or how to react to it.

If everyone who asked for strips was given them on prescription, there'd be no market for cheap ex-perscription strips on ebay in the first place!

Mat

Very true-That's why this is a tricky one!! 8)

Good questions ladybird, but our petition doesn't ask for unlimited strips for everyone. We put in the line "we recognise that ongoing testing may need to be provided on a reduced basis...." deliberately, because there is a lot of waste. Once you have found out what foods in what quantities affect you, you don't need to test nearly so much UNLESS you're on hypo-inducing drugs, so strip supplies can be reduced then. We also said "as part of structured education....."because if people aren't testing properly, or are over-testing, it should be picked up. They should then be "educated" on best use or strips again reduced. The issue is, who is going to trtain people on strip use! We could, but I wouldn't trust some of the HCPs I've met to get this right. We need a new, proper education programme on diet, exercise and testing by people who know to go with the issue of strips. We couldn't include all this in the petition because it would have been too long, so we allowed for it in the phraseology we used - well, the best we could manage anyway!

MadMat said:

If everyone who asked for strips was given them on prescription, there'd be no market for cheap ex-perscription strips on ebay in the first place!

Mat

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Are the buyers of strips on ebay only UK based?

I'd imagine they'll be a market elsewhere where restrictions are applied.

That'll teach me to check before I post!

I did read the petition before I signed but had forgotten about that line. Well, for all the good it will do me, I am going to keep nagging every time I see the doc, see if I can persuade him. I haven't been successful so far but never say never..they have a rule that no type 2's on diet or oral meds only get strips, not fair says me.

Perseverance is one of my favourite words..

i completely support diabetes uk in their policy on test strips i wish they were more upfront about the reason.
a) the strips are not that accurate.
b)high and low readings can lead to misplaced/misunderstood reasons for altering diet
c) hospital blood tests give a much clearer picture of diabetes as it shows other things such as liver function, kidney problems.
d) test strips offer a false sense of good and bad diabetic control
e)the nhs cannot afford such self indulgent personal testing because people feel want it - if you want test strips and its that important then buy the strips and it says a lot that people will buy online from ebay when they can pay for a private prescription from their gp and go to a proper chemist - suggesting people aint that bothered about what the strip results are they just want to stick a strip in a meter without even thinking about where the strip came from

nickcave1,
Will you support a petition for:
a)A strip that is accurate within acceptable limits
b)Compulsory provision of courses providing education re diet and high/low readings.
c)free/cheap, readily accessible "hospital standard" blood tests
d)educational courses enhancing good diabetic blood control.
e)strips as in a) which are cheap enough to eradicate the e-bay black market.
I will sign it!

nickcave1 said:

i completely support diabetes uk in their policy on test strips i wish they were more upfront about the reason.
a) the strips are not that accurate.
b)high and low readings can lead to misplaced/misunderstood reasons for altering diet
c) hospital blood tests give a much clearer picture of diabetes as it shows other things such as liver function, kidney problems.
d) test strips offer a false sense of good and bad diabetic control
e)the nhs cannot afford such self indulgent personal testing because people feel want it - if you want test strips and its that important then buy the strips and it says a lot that people will buy online from ebay when they can pay for a private prescription from their gp and go to a proper chemist - suggesting people aint that bothered about what the strip results are they just want to stick a strip in a meter without even thinking about where the strip came from

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Oh dear. So out of line with 99% of people here. So wrong, but sadly no time to explain why I think so. Maybe later

the thought of patients who get prescribed strips,but have NO intention of using them pro-actively and sell them on sites such as eBay!!

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How about repeat strips issued only on the safe return of used ones, either to surgery or chemist ?

Wouldn't that stem the Ebay sellers ?

Geoff

nickcave1 said:

i completely support diabetes uk in their policy on test strips i wish they were more upfront about the reason.
a) the strips are not that accurate.
b)high and low readings can lead to misplaced/misunderstood reasons for altering diet
c) hospital blood tests give a much clearer picture of diabetes as it shows other things such as liver function, kidney problems.
d) test strips offer a false sense of good and bad diabetic control
e)the nhs cannot afford such self indulgent personal testing because people feel want it - if you want test strips and its that important then buy the strips and it says a lot that people will buy online from ebay when they can pay for a private prescription from their gp and go to a proper chemist - suggesting people aint that bothered about what the strip results are they just want to stick a strip in a meter without even thinking about where the strip came from

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nickcave1 said:

a) the strips are not that accurate.

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They are not entirely accurate but accurate enough for T1's to determine their levels apparently. Are their strips any different? The DVLA seems to think they're accurate enough to see if you should be driving. Rubbish argument.

nickcave1 said:

high and low readings can lead to misplaced/misunderstood reasons for altering diet

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Only if your stupid and can't be ars*d to find out what causes levels to rise and fall. Its not rocket science is it? Apparently it is for you as on another thread you only reckon its only sugar that effects levels.

nickcave1 said:

hospital blood tests give a much clearer picture of diabetes as it shows other things such as liver function, kidney problems.

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Rubbish, an HBA1c blood test measures average blood sugar levels in the blood. You need other tests to confirm problems with Kidneys or Liver fuction. Stupid false argument.

nickcave1 said:

d) test strips offer a false sense of good and bad diabetic control

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Well I started testing 4 months ago with an HBA1c of 11.3%. Got my new one today 5.3% so a fall of 6% in 4 months. How do you account for that? I account for it primarily through testing. Are you going to call me a liar?

nickcave1 said:

e)the nhs cannot afford such self indulgent personal testing because people feel want it...

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No one is sugesting a free for all. T2's who show they can use testing successfully as part of their self management should be encouraged to test just as T1's are encouraged to test. That's all the petition states.

So Nick as you don't test and only believe sugar to be a culprit and wont even consider a different viewpoint as all your other posts are suggesting then I'll suggest one. People who don't take their db seriously when they know what to do and could help themselves are very selfish to my mind. They are running risks that ultimately their partners and children have to end up dealing with. Finally the health system will have to care for them at the cost of other patients.

If you don't like what you read on this forum why not just leave and go elsewhere?

"Oh dear. So out of line with 99% of people here. So wrong, but sadly no time to explain why I think so. Maybe later"

Isn't that the point of the forum? Just because someone doesn't agree with the majority doesn't mean that their view isn't worth hearing. It would be pretty boring if we all just agreed with each other.

chris lowe said:

"Oh dear. So out of line with 99% of people here. So wrong, but sadly no time to explain why I think so. Maybe later"

Isn't that the point of the forum? Just because someone doesn't agree with the majority doesn't mean that their view isn't worth hearing. It would be pretty boring if we all just agreed with each other.

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I'd agree 100% if the poster in question was genuine. Read his other posts Chris and you'll see his not. He's sadly another so called "Troll" from somewhere else trying to stimulate argument which I won't rise to. His posts will probably go soon.

nickcave1 said:

i completely support diabetes uk in their policy on test strips i wish they were more upfront about the reason.
a) the strips are not that accurate.
b)high and low readings can lead to misplaced/misunderstood reasons for altering diet
c) hospital blood tests give a much clearer picture of diabetes as it shows other things such as liver function, kidney problems.
d) test strips offer a false sense of good and bad diabetic control
e)the nhs cannot afford such self indulgent personal testing because people feel want it - if you want test strips and its that important then buy the strips and it says a lot that people will buy online from ebay when they can pay for a private prescription from their gp and go to a proper chemist - suggesting people aint that bothered about what the strip results are they just want to stick a strip in a meter without even thinking about where the strip came from

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(a)-(d) are based on a false argument. All experimental measurements are inherently erroneous to some degree...

You could use exactly the same argument for not including a speedometer in your car. The speed you see on your dashboard isn't anywhere near the speed you travel at: it has a built in 10% error, with a further error which depends on how well inflated your tires are. I prefer to use my GPS to guage my speed, but even that's only accurate to a few metres.

So why do I bother checking my speed at all? The speed I see displayed could give me a misplaced sense of security about my actual speed (leading me to perhaps break the law), and give me a false sense of my driving ability? The answer is that it's much better than driving blind.

Most empirical techniques are pretty rubbish at measuring point values, but pretty excellent in measuring trends. It doesn't really matter if your BG is 5.8 or 6.2mmol/l, but it does matter if it jumps 5 points after you've scoffed some pasta.

Gentlemen, gentlemen..Do I detect a little hint of annoyance here? :wink:

Now then - we all know our forum allows for a diverse range of opinions. The majority of us have signed the petition and I don't believe we are self indulgent. Well, maybe a few are but I don't think that has anything to do with the subject of self monitoring.

I for one am very glad that Nick manages his diabetes so well with the avoidance of sugar, I'm assuming his Hba1c is at a level that pleases him and that his HCP is also pleased with it.

So really, it's a no-brainer. If you're happy with your treatment excellent, glad you are doing well. For those who us who rely on self monitoring as the second most important way of being pro-active (dietary management being the most important) then we shall continue to put pressure on for the prescription of test strips.

Simple really isn't it?

ladybird64 said:

Gentlemen, gentlemen..Do I detect a little hint of annoyance here? :wink:

Now then - we all know our forum allows for a diverse range of opinions. The majority of us have signed the petition and I don't believe we are self indulgent. Well, maybe a few are but I don't think that has anything to do with the subject of self monitoring.

I for one am very glad that Nick manages his diabetes so well with the avoidance of sugar, I'm assuming his Hba1c is at a level that pleases him and that his HCP is also pleased with it.

So really, it's a no-brainer. If you're happy with your treatment excellent, glad you are doing well. For those who us who rely on self monitoring as the second most important way of being pro-active (dietary management being the most important) then we shall continue to put pressure on for the prescription of test strips.

Simple really isn't it?

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I have no problem with differing opinions, what I do have a problem with is that people like me, and there are many of us who are working really hard to control our diabetes, but have to pay for strips. I test a LOT but by doing that have an excellent idea of what is going on. I also use my meter to test new foods. I am really proud of all I have achieved in 7 weeks. A loss of 2 stone in weight, and an 7.0 HbA1c at diagnosis to today my very first 4. I would be no where near that far along the road without strips. I buy my own, and will continue to do so if that is what it takes, but I am fortunate that I can afford them, many can't.

I'm one of the many who can't.

Sometimes I think that people post things because they like a bit of aggro. Calling people self-indulgent is guaranteed to ruffle feathers which of course makes one wonder if that was the sole intention. Things is everyone is entitiled to their opinion unless they are abusive or a troll in which case they can take a hike.

You never know, maybe Nick will pop back in sometime and tell us how his Hba1c is, how he manages his diet on sugar reduction only, maybe we can learn a few things.

Ladybird, as I pointed out before, "nick" IS a troll and has been chucked out now. Hence the comment I made earlier in reply to him which I believe you were a little uncomfortable with. As you say, as a troll it's right that he's told to "take a hike" :thumbup: