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To Be or Not to Be.......Diabetic?

S

SweetHeart

Well-Known Member
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This morning my husband (MH) has been in to see our DSN. She gave him the results of his one and only HbA1c - 5.7.

Well, that's a great result! BUT then she says she doesn't think he is diabetic after all. However, "once diagnosed as a diabetic you cannot be undiagnosed even if it was a mistake" my cynical mind says that should be translated as 'we'll lose the extra funding....' Then, after dropping that bombshell, DSN says 'Your BP is quite high.....' Wonder why? She doesn't even think he might be pre-Diabetic.

So, where do we stand? When MH was first diagnosed back in February of this year, his BG level was 14.9mmol. Although it was a fasting test, we questioned the result as he had been trying to quench his thirst with litres of apple juice the day before - I think he drank at least two 2l cartons, then went on to water after 8pm ready for his blood test the next morning. The GP didn't order an HbA1c, the diagnosis was made purely on one BG level test, so we have no HbA1c from diagnosis to compare to today's result. The DSN now concedes that the diagnosis BG test could be skewed, especially as we had his BGs down to the high 5's within days of carb cutting. His daily average now is about 4.6mmol.

MH has just phoned the surgery (DSN couldn't/wouldn't do a print out.....again) to ask if they had any lipid levels to compare instead, no, they don't think they do.

The DSN has suggested that MH is Vit B12 deficient instead. I've had a quick google, and have concluded that MH not having had a gallbladder for four years - so very low B12 to start with - and then being on Metformin, one a day, could easily cause a lack of B12. Add to this the fact that he took Ranitidine based anti-reflux drugs for many years before the removal of the gallbladder, and they too cause in-absorption of B vits. There are other things that might be B12 related, such as his plummeting libido, twitchy legs, lack of sensory feeling etc.

So now we're confused. Can anyone shed any light whatsoever on all this, please?

Ju

PS If we get any other results this afternoon when we collect the print out I'll post them up.
 
I read your post with eyes getting wider and wider. My BG levels are now in the 'non diabetic' range. I also have no gall bladder, it was removed many years ago, and I am also still on Lansoprazole for gastric reflux! I do take a Vit B12 supplement, so that would be my only difference really. I am due my fasting HbA1c June 27 so after reading your post, the meeting with my GP a week later will be interesting.

Sorry I can't add any useful information, but just had to share my own experience, as it is quite eerily similar in many ways.
 
Ju

Was the 5.7% hBA1c taken recently or was it taken back in Feb and they just couldn't find it?

If its the former (a recent test) you can be T2 with an hBA1c of 5.7% loads of us are with scores even less than your husband. That's what low carbing will do. If it was at diagnosis then yes its a different story although 5.7 for a non diabetic isn't great.

Presumably your husband is still testing so the simplest way to see if he is diabetic is to give him some carbs but you'll have to do that for a few days before you are likely to see the results. Alternatively you could try doing a DIY GTT test. Again your husband will need to eat more than 150g a day for more than 3 days prior as otherwise you wont get a reasonably accurate result. After he's stuffed carbs for a few days get him to drink 400ml of Lucozade and then test at two hours. That will roughly be the same as a GTT test and he should end up under 11 to pass.

I suppose what I'm saying is if you decide to change diet keep testing to make sure. Ju please remember its not all about BG's. If your husband is still overweight or has bad cholesterol or bad blood pressure he will be high risk even without being T2 so sticking to a healthy diet is the best option whatever the T2 outcome.
 
Hi Sweetheart. We're not doctors so can't diagnose, but my first reaction is that his DSN is simply not used to9 seeing diabetics get there A1cs down to the 5's. As others have said, lots of us do it. My friend was a more glaring example than me. He went from 11.2 on diagnosis to 5.7 3 months later on much rteduced carbs. He's still diabetic though! As xyzzy sasys, do the home-made oral glucose tolerance test and see. If he trips 11.2, he's diabetic.
 
I honestly think you hubby is a well controlled T2.

I reckon if you sent him off to a relatives for a weeks 'holiday' and he was fed on what they ate, he would deliver some lovely diabetic readings and HBA1c.

When i rang for my 2nd HBA1c test the receptionst said 'normal' 5.9%. I'm not normal (anyone who knows me will concur) I worked bloody hard for that result!!!

Mary x
 
Alternatively you could try doing a DIY GTT test. Again your husband will need to eat more than 150g a day for more than 3 days prior as otherwise you wont get a reasonably accurate result. After he's stuffed carbs for a few days get him to drink 400ml of Lucozade and then test at two hours. That will roughly be the same as a GTT test and he should end up under 11 to pass
Click to expand...
.
If you do decide to do this.
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=ca ... jHW61H6Xpg
NB Blood glucose taken at the capillary is not the same as from a vein and will give higher results after the glucose challenge.
The document gives the threshold for diabetes as 12.2mmol.
 
phoenix said:
NB Blood glucose taken at the capillary is not the same as from a vein and will give higher results after the glucose challenge.
The document gives the threshold for diabetes as 12.2mmol.
Click to expand...

Nice one Phoenix, didn't twig that!
 
phoenix said:
Alternatively you could try doing a DIY GTT test. Again your husband will need to eat more than 150g a day for more than 3 days prior as otherwise you wont get a reasonably accurate result. After he's stuffed carbs for a few days get him to drink 400ml of Lucozade and then test at two hours. That will roughly be the same as a GTT test and he should end up under 11 to pass
Click to expand...
.
If you do decide to do this.
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=ca ... jHW61H6Xpg
NB Blood glucose taken at the capillary is not the same as from a vein and will give higher results after the glucose challenge.
The document gives the threshold for diabetes as 12.2mmol.
Click to expand...

Interesting - thanks Phoenix.

You may be able to buy plain glucose at your local chemist.
 
I agree with you all. The more I look into it the more I think that there is a B12 deficiency too. The 5.7mmol Hba1c was from blood taken last Thursday 17th May. We don't have a diagnosis HbA1c as they didn't do one - he was diagnosed using a venal fasting BG test, and only one at that. WE have his lipid levels from diagnosis but no lipid tests were done last week, so nothing to compare those with either.

I do still think that MH is a diabetic. He gets huge spikes from eating one slice of white bread, where as I don't...the same for any other white carb. Even if he was only pre- I don't think he'd go back to a free carb diet. Neither of us could. It's pizza for supper here and I have been trying to persuade him to have pizza so we can test his BGs, but no, he won't do it. Should there have been a miracle cure, and he isn't a diabetic, we have still had our eyes pinned wide open and will be so aware if diabetes that it won't have been a waste of time.

We're seeing the GP on Friday morning, so we're going to demand a proper set of tests so that we have clarification. Meanwhile, he has complained to the practice manager because if he isn't a diabetic then he wants that information removed from his medical records. The DSN said that the information cannot be removed once you are diagnosed - what utter twaddle. Meanwhile, I've got him on a B vits complex. We have to get something done about the confusion, the libido, the twitchy limbs and the numbness that the DSN has said isn't neuropathy.

Ju
 
MH has just come in from his governor's meeting, clutching his print out of results collected from the surgery just before his meeting. There are no lipid results to compare the diagnosis lipids to. However, it is interesting to see that the DSN has written on the test results 'Extremely low HbA1c owing to drastic weight loss caused by Metformin 500mg daily'

MH explained our low carb diet carefully to her, pointed out that starchy white carbs are the things that give him the highest spikes but, obviously she hasn't listened or she did listen and then drew her own conclusion.

Ju
 
i wouldn't call 5.7 extremely low. It's fab -

it's so annoying, the only way to prove the Extemely low Hba1C is due to your and hubbies hard work on the next one.

Mary x
 
Today's Retinopathy results were completely clear - we're very pleased!

Those photos are truly awesome, utterly fascinating.

Ju
 
That's good news SweetHeart. I guess that is the 'Metaformin ' effect again. :D Certainly nothing to do with both of you working so hard. <hugs>
 
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