Totally confused

dingdong said:

Does that mean you need to test after every meal then ?
My fingertips are already sore and bruised after 8 tests

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Hi Dingdong, welcome to the forum. For the first few weeks on lchf I tested at the start of every meal and snack, then again 1 hour and 2 hours afterwards, it's the only way to know for sure which foods you can eat and which you can't.

You don't have to carry that on forever, just until you know how each food affects you, but still testing anything new and several times a day including first thing after getting up and on going to bed just to keep a check on things. But testing does become second nature and it won't bother you.

The guidelines on what / what not to eat are just that, guidelines, and what badly affects one person won't be so bad for another, so test everything and you won't end up giving up foods that you could've stayed with

Regarding the testing, I agree with the above. Any time you change your diet you need to be more vigilant with your testing. When I first started with LCHF I tested very regularly.

As I've become more accustomed to my new diet however, I've definitely been able to decrease the frequency of my testing. My ideal goal would be to test just once (in the morning) on most days, and only do more frequent tests throughout the day once in a while (maybe every week or so). The basic idea is that if my levels are ok in the morning, and I can keep with foods that I know work for me throughout the day, then I can take my chances that everything is going ok with my BSL. Of course it doesn't always work out that perfectly, and if for any reason I can't stick to my diet as well as I'd like to, then yeah I do test more often.

Good luck.

What vitamins are good for diabetics?
Can GP prescribe?

dingdong said:

Having just read a diet on patient.co.uk, recommended by diabetes.org.uk, I am fed up to the back teeth of the amount of contradiction.
As my test kit was given to me by GP ( not normally done, I'm told ) I only have a limited number of tests which is basically to make sure my BG comes down from 26. After that, it's down to me to hope my diet works.
I do not have or will have the opportunity to monitor my BG from the effects of my diet.
I've decided to take a break from the bewildering array of advice, as after 3 days of it, I am non the wiser and got a headache.
Many thanks to all for your replies and advice.

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It can seem very confusing to start with but the two books mentioned in my signature are recommended by lots of people here and are so helpful when you're trying to get to grips with lchf.
Don't give up, it gets easier, I promise!

Forgot to mention, most Type 2s have to buy their own meter and test strips, but worth every penny to get control of your own health. Have a look at this thread, it's the meter a lot here use because the test strips are cheaper and you can get a discount by using the codes in the thread
http://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/code-free.73635/

dingdong said:

Having just read a diet on patient.co.uk, recommended by diabetes.org.uk, I am fed up to the back teeth of the amount of contradiction

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It would be nice if you could have posted a link so we could look at what diet you're referring to. Though presumably it's this one (or something very similar) : http://www.patient.co.uk/health/type-2-diabetes

The above site said:

Eat a healthy and balanced diet. Your practice nurse and/or dietician will give you details on a healthy diet. The diet is the same as recommended for everyone. The idea that you need special foods if you have diabetes is a myth. Diabetic foods still raise blood glucose levels, contain just as much fat and calories and are usually more expensive than non-diabetic foods. Basically, you should aim to eat a diet low in fat, salt and sugar and high in fibre and with plenty of fruit and vegetables.

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I've decided to take a break from the bewildering array of advice, as after 3 days of it, I am non the wiser and got a headache.
Many thanks to all for your replies and advice.

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There is absolutely no argument from me about there being a lot of contradictory advice Dingdong. I don't deny for one minute that a lot of the user advice given here, particularly in relation to LCHF, is contradictory to most "official" dietary guidelines (like the one quoted above for example).

The reason no doubt (for the contradictions) is simply that there has been so much fear surrounding fats over the past 40+ years that most "official" dietitians simply cannot bring themselves to recommend it. Yes many of the ideas you'll find here regarding LCHF are indeed controversial, however as with myself , many members here have failed miserably with the "official" recommendations but have found that LCHF does actually work for them.

BTW. When I was first diagnosed my levels were high 20's just like yourself. I also found much of the dietary advice bewildering and contradictory - so don't feel alone in that regard. I know you have said in your OP that you haven't yet experienced many of the bad symptoms normally associated with such high levels, however you WILL experience them if your levels stay high like that for many weeks. My guess is that the onset of your very high levels was probably quite rapid, and many of the bad effects take some time to kick in. For example, if your levels stay up in the 20's for any significant length of time, you are likely to get very blurred eyesight.

AVT said:

What vitamins are good for diabetics?
Can GP prescribe?

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The biggies for diabetes that most natural health practitioners/writers agree on:

Take a good multivitamin and mineral supplement,

and

Minerals:
Chromium (picolinate)
Magnesium

Hormone/vitamin:
D3

Omega-3 (fish oil form). (for vegetarians - walnut oil form I believe)

There are also some herbs and spices that are agreed on, that enhance insulin production, and pancreatic health (good for we diabetics). Ones that are probably already in your cupboard are: cinnamon, turmeric, oregano, black pepper, sage.

Two important things to note - to begin with - the jury is out on whether or not supplements work! In fact, at the moment the evidence is more weighted on the side of them being expensive urine enhancers! But, saying that, I, like many others who are nutrition and health conscious - especially when something has gone so terribly wrong as in T2D - I take them just in case they DO work, and particularly when I know I have a deficiency in something. Kind of like nutritional insurance. I have also read some studies/evidence/diabetic health practitioners say that some supplements are actually bad for you! (I think I heard it last from Dr Mercola on a youtube presentation.) So quell the urge to overdo on something as EXTRA insurance - apparently it just doesn't work that way.

(The second question I can't answer - there are no country borders online! ! But you can find out the regulations for where you are easy enough in an internet search?)

One thing you can do is ensure you are getting as many nutrients as possible in what you eat, and take supplements for things you have a deficiency in, or a good multivitamin and mineral supplement, and the targeted supplements as listed above. But only truly use as a supplement - not try to use them as a food replacement. ie try and eat three servings of omega-3 rich foods a week (oily fish, and walnuts - just off the top of my head), first and foremost. And find foods that are rich in the nutrient you want to increase that you actually really like to eat - sorry if that seems too obvious but sometimes the most obvious things need to be said? (Eating food that is good for you should also make you feel good.)

dingdong said:

Having just read a diet on patient.co.uk, recommended by diabetes.org.uk, I am fed up to the back teeth of the amount of contradiction.
As my test kit was given to me by GP ( not normally done, I'm told ) I only have a limited number of tests which is basically to make sure my BG comes down from 26. After that, it's down to me to hope my diet works.
I do not have or will have the opportunity to monitor my BG from the effects of my diet.
I've decided to take a break from the bewildering array of advice, as after 3 days of it, I am non the wiser and got a headache.
Many thanks to all for your replies and advice.

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I really feel for you! And totally understand the headache.But as others have said - you really have come to the right place. And the contradictory advice will never go away, alas. I wish I didn't have to say that. It really is going to be a matter of you figuring out what works best for you (and your family).

That's where that that BG testing advice comes in (and is REALLY good advice.)

I also really feel for you about the expense of the test strips if you have to pay for your own. (You don't live somewhere that has them on prescription? This is too bad!) (Check that with your GP - s/he may not realise that you intend to continue to 'eat and meter' to help control your blood glucose levels over time. If you live in a country with socialised medicine those countries usually encourage diabetics to test their own blood glucose - to manage the diabetes -- and pay for it as part of the national health budget as the studies HUGELY support the fact that it works well, and it being cheaper in the long run for the countries. Horrible way to look at diabetes, but countries' accountants do, it seems.)

And last but not least. When I got diagnosed I didn't find the line of my own home country very helpful at all - that getting a diagnosis of T2D didn't mean I would have to eat differently to other people, other than what is officially called a healthy diet. (ie the conventional food pyramid, with carbs in bread and pasta and so on well and truly featuring.) I found that simply to be not true at all. Even though I was 52 and had been feeding myself and my two children, now adult, for years, I had to re-learn to shop (as outlined in a post above), re-learn to cook to ensure the quality and sugar-free nature of the ingredients, I had to re-discover about health and nutrition, and I certainly had to re-learn to move my body more. It was quite simply nothing short of a life transformation - and I don't believe it helps diabetics who want to gain control of their health to say otherwise.

But those things that they call 'lifestyle changes' really do work, to some extent, even to a large extent. Because, to be glib, we are our bodies.

So no wonder you have been way stressed and suffering! I hope you get to watch some good comedies on the tele, and lovely movies with your kids, perhaps, as a way to de-stress. (For me - it was that - and walking.) And that this forum becomes a place for you to clear your head and relieve some of the anxiety, and get a good range of information and good support, from others, who are, more or less, in the same position as you.

AloeSvea said:

And last but not least. When I got diagnosed I didn't find the line of my own home country very helpful at all - that getting a diagnosis of T2D didn't mean I would have to eat differently to other people, other than what is officially called a healthy diet. (ie the conventional food pyramid, with carbs in bread and pasta and so on well and truly featuring.) I found that simply to be not true at all.

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I had very much the same experience as you AloeSyea.

I really believe that a big part of the problem is that when you "turn up" with T2 diabetes there is an automatic assumption that you must previously have been eating a truly terrible diet. Kind of a "you've got T2 diabetes so it's got to be all your fault" attitude.

So I think the dietician (or diabetic nurse or whatever) truly believes that if you stop your (imagined by them) diet of potato crisps and soft drink for every meal and adopt their healthly low fat diet that everything is going to be fine. The problem is that for many of us, we were already eating the "recommended" diet long before even being diagnosed. So though they don't realise it, they're effectively telling us to just keep doing what we've been doing (and what got us to a crazy high BSL in the first place!).

The thing I found the most frustrating is that when you tell them "hey, that's exactly the diet I've always been eating" and you get this kind of "it does not compute" face from them for a second or two, and then they just proceed telling you what to eat (the same as what you were already eating) as though they never even heard you.