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Unmedicated vs a little metformin

sanguine

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,340
Location
Devon
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Dislikes
Intolerance, career politicians, reality TV and so-called celebrity culture, mobile phones in the quiet carriage.
I have my first DN session on Wednesday, and as you can see from my signature I've been making progress already just from the information and support on here.

I now have a bit of a dilemma. My heart says I want to do this without medication, and I believe I can. I don't like medication of any kind if I can possibly avoid it, and I'm certainly not accepting statins for my cholesterol. My wife (who is very supportive and has joined me in LCHF so we can still eat the same) is suggesting that I accept a small dosage of metformin, if proposed, just in order to take some of the burden of control off me and give my pancreas a hand in the short term. My head is now uncertain of the stance I should take.

In my situation, what would you do? I'm still leaning towards the non-medication route if I can swing it, at least as a further trial period, but am I throwing away low-risk assistance in the process?
 
You and I are in the same place. I have gone from 3 down to 2 down to 1 metformin. The dn at the hospital says give up and the doc wants me to eventually give up but not quite now. I want to get rid of the statin too. I currently weigh 14 st 5 and I need to drop 3 st 5. Unlike you I'm on ramapril for bp. I'm sticking with the met for a bit longer because I want my fasting bs to go down further and my weight. Why not hang in there a bit longer till the weight comes off - it is an appetite suppressant too!
 
I understand, I really do.

I've been offered metformin 5 or 6 times. Even accepted it once. Hated it and the metallic taste it left in my mouth. Stopped it after less than a month.

You've certainly been making progress, looking at your numbers! Why not show them to your nurse and suggest a deadline of, say 6 months to reach a certain HbA1c? If you fail, take the prescription. If you succeed, you get a huge confidence boost, better health AND respect from the DN!

I've seen several people posting on the forum who have done similar, and intend to try it myself the next time I see the prescription pad looming.
 
I'm glad you asked this question because I may have the same dilemma in a few days. My first 3 month HbA1c test is tomorrow so when I see the DN next week with the results I need to have some facts ready in case she wants me to have meds. I don't want meds but will take them if they will definitely help me. I have lost 20lbs and still losing, with another stone to go. I am not hungry, my BP and cholesterol are excellent.

I believe Metformin reduces insulin resistance, supresses appetite, and supresses the production of glucose from the liver, BUT all to a small extent. There are other health benefits, but I'm not entirely sure what.
 
In my home practise, the default first step with T2 is D&E, then Metformin if there is insufficient progress. I was, and remain determined to remain I non-medicated. I have a niggling fear I wouldn't try so hard, if I couldn't be sure if any change was me or Metformin. Of course, that's just me.

I was about to embark on a long trip overseas (where I am still), and the prospect of having medication that might need tweaking, or side effects to manage just horrified me.

Thankfully, thus far, I have been able to take diabetes by the throat and give it a good old shake, and remaining D&E is my objective, for as long as possible. Ideally, that would be forever.

Your choice, but I sort of feel that once the medics have you on one treatment, just adding another, and another is so easy until one rattles when crossing speed bumps.

On an aside, you may well find your cholesterol comes down along with your HbA1c. Why not wait until after your next review to make plans. Your nurse should be very happy with your progress, and may just suggest you keep doing it.

Good luck with it all.
 
IMHO, For T2, if you haven't got your BG within 'normal' levels yet, take a drug to get it there. Then back off the drug as you can when Insulin resistance maybe resolved by diet.
You are only making it hard for yourself by running high BG and there is plenty of evidence that diabetics who take drugs if needed have better long term outcomes
some people are antidrugs and won't even vaccinate their kids.
some people are just fearful of being a diabetic on drugs, don't let fear get in the way of your long term health.
 
Pretty much my view. Weight seems to play a major part in lowering everything. This is what the good doc, not the rubbish one told me. He said that there'd been a doc at the same practice who'd gone through everything we're going through and once the weight came off bp, cholestrol and bs came down. He was then able to come off the metformin. This is what I'm going to aim for.
 
Thanks for all the replies so far, very helpful. Jack, by 'normal' do you mean 'normal normal' or 'T2 diabetic normal'? I seem to recall reading in here somewhere that 4-7 mmol/L pre-meal is a guideline 'normal' for a T2, with +2 no more than 8.5 (mine are mostly in the 7s).

I'm also bearing in mind that I've been at this for only 3 weeks (is that all?!) and hopefully can still make significant inroads by D&E in the short term.
 
normal is near enough to fasting under 5.5, 1hr is under 8 and 2hr is under 6.5, I think the diabetic recommended numbers are on the upper limit and aren't the numbers I'm chasing as a T2.
3 weeks is early on the path, I'm an old hand at a wopping 13 weeks j/k
 
Hello Rod, from my own experience, I would listen to your DN's words of wisdom on the advisability or otherwise of taking Metformin and then make your own decision as to whether you want to take the drug or not.

I was in a similar position and decided to see how far 'lifestyle interventions' (as NICE calls them) would take me along the road of controlling my diabetes. We agreed that a decision on Metformin and statins should be postponed for 3 months and await the results of further HbA1c and cholesterol tests. Those tests were carried out over two weeks ago and I have not heard from my healthcare professionals so I assume (rightly or wrongly) that all is well.

Looking at your numbers I would think that DN will push statins more strongly than Metformin, so beware.

Again from my own experience, I feel much more 'health motivated' than I fear I would have been had I pursued a 'pharmacological solution'. Or put it another way, since refusing medication I have more 'aggressively managed' my diet and exercise regime with a view to showing my healthcare professionals who was right (me!).
 
If you've been diagnosed quickly before any complications have occurred and you can sustain your low carb lifestyle, then go for the diet controlled.

Metformin does have some good heart protective qualities.

If like me, were undiagnosed for many years and already had problems with feet and eyes, then my aim is to get my HbA1c as low as possible and keep it there to prevent more complications.
 
I was very happy with my last A1c of 38/5.6% and FBG 5.4 with good lipids, so I am backing my metformin back to 1000 and cutting the statins in half, thinking that the LCHF should kick in more as I go on. I'd like to get rid of the statin at the next A1c test and hopefully the metformin back to 500.
weight is still a big issue with me and every pound lost is like pulling teeth
 
Most of my big weight loss was when I was on Metformin. My Doctor refuses to prescribe it now.

I'd love to be back on it, I've often thought of going on a carb fest before my next HbA1c so that I could pretend that I'd fallen off the waggon, and need some metformin help.
 
I've been stuck around 110kg for 2 months, 109 this week but probably 110 again next week. the forum have said this can happen, so I'm just waiting till the constant weight loss kicks in again
 
I managed to keep my BG's mostly within 'normal' range for 3 years on LCHF only. I am now asking for Metformin because l didn't lose the weight. I have heard that it helps to increase insulin sensitivity as well as supressing appetite. I have found some exercises which are supposed to help increase insulin sensitivity too , so hopefully with this dual approach I will start to lose weight more easily.
 
Please would you share the exercises?
 
Scandichic said:
Please would you share the exercises?
Click to expand...

Yes, I have a book somewhere. I'll dig it out when I can....it's well hidden at the mo because I don't actually like doing the slow-stretch type of exercise, yawn, so boring. Not really sure if they work but we can but try.
 
jack412 said:
I've been stuck around 110kg for 2 months, 109 this week but probably 110 again next week. the forum have said this can happen, so I'm just waiting till the constant weight loss kicks in again
Click to expand...


I think weight loss does kick in again. I went 6 weeks without losing anything, after losing 3 stones, but the last 2 weeks I have lost 1 lb+ each week. Maybe our bodies have to adjust to being lighter - not sure.
 
I had heard that if you hit a plateau, you increase your calories for a week then go back to original diet and that it kick starts you into weight loss. Does anyone know if this is true?
 
Scandichic said:
I had heard that if you hit a plateau, you increase your calories for a week then go back to original diet and that it kick starts you into weight loss. Does anyone know if this is true?
Click to expand...

If you eat too few calories your body goes into starvation mode, things kick in and you stop losing weight. Hence, if you increase your calories for a while, then reduce them but not quite as far as to put you in starvation mode again, you should start to lose again. If you stick to a sensible amount of calories, an amount which is less than your body needs but not drastic, you should lose steadily without any plateaux. I discovered on some website or other than I need 1600 calories (age/weight/exercise based) to maintain health and weight, with more if I increase exercise. An ideal weight loss amount for me is 1200 calories, more if I increase exercise. I've followed this and have lost 20lbs so far with no plateaux. So far!!!!!
 
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