Carbs to Insulin !!

[Blackadder]

Please could someone tell me how do you determine how many grams of carbs to a unit of insulin?

I am sure I saw somewhere an article that referenced this and broke it down to insulin type. I know that it is also dependant on the person but I am looking for a basic guideline.

Hypurin Animal 30/70 Insulin... is the insulin of choice. I thought I read somewhere that it is 15g per unit of this? Can anyone confirm this?

Regards

 

[hanadr]

I think each person has to find their own I: C ratio.
Try starting with the assumption that yours is 1:10. Check your BG,take a Glucose tab or two and the appropriate insulin. check after an hour ( maximum BG). I and you are not back where you were to begin with,it's wrong. Try again another time with more or less insulin as sems appropriate. Do this a few tims and you will home in on your personal ratio.
I'm not an insulin user, but this makes sense.

 

[LittleSue]

As handadr said, it varies for each person. Also varies with time of day so take this into account when experimenting. I usually need 1.5 units for 10 carbs at bfast and 1 for 10 rest of the day but this varies with menstrual cycle. Start by assuming 1:10 and then adjust, you'll only find out by testing.

I'd say test after 2 - 2.5 hours. A 1 hr reading would give you the max it went up to, but the aim of this experiment is to find the dose that brings you back to the pre-food reading, which will take longer than 1 hour.

 

[lilibet]

Hi
Im on a 70/30 premix and have tried to work out a similar ratio in context of my insulin. Result? - dont bother.Best I have been hoping for is to establish some pattern which at times is successful and others not so successful. You can check the insulin profile on some websites and it does seem quite accurate in respect of mine (am and pre dinner dosing)
I dont eat the same amount of carbs at each meal ( because I dont want to, and quite franky sick of eating 6 times daily) but will eat some at snack times to ward off pre luch lows and pre tea time lows.
If I miss an approx snack time, pretty much guranteed to go low. With pre mix I find the rapidity of the drop incredible and I can test befor driving and be at 5.5 and then test 25 mins later pre-insulin and be 4!

What I have been doing though is looking at the carbs as if I were on basal/bolus - partly to ensure carbs are not huge (cause I am choosing the reduced carbs route) and also to start habit forming in the hope that when they finally get me on to MDI it will become 2nd nature.

L x

 

[Blackadder]

Yeah I am switching to Animal Hypurin Porcine 30/70 tomorrow but already I feel that I will be more suited to the MDI way of doing things. It would be easier for me not to have to eat at regular intervals and inject and eat when I can. My work finds me up and off and working in cold computer rooms at all times of day and night at little notice. It would be easier to be able to eat when I can eat and not have to drop everything to eat.

Still the big switch here is back to animal insulin after 20 years and it was best to try a similar regime to I am currently on. I will try this to see if it helps with all the other human side effects that I have had for countless years and then when this first lot is finished and if I am happy I'll make the change again. I am flexible and have no problems trying different things. I'd really like to be able to find out what my carb/insulin ratio is so that I can control this beast better. Although I have an HBA1c of 6.8 and no complications I want to try the Bernstein approach as I am reading his book at the moment. I feel like the past 30 years I have been guessing, sometimes right, sometimes ok, sometimes bloody wrong but one step at a time.

Although I AM a bit no actually VERY scared really. :-(

Thanks for all ur responses.

 

[suzil]

Blackadder

Interested to hear you are reading Bernstein book as would like to get one myself. Would you mind telling me where you got it and roughly how much was it.

Thanks

Suzil

 

[Blackadder]

Well I got it in Waterstones but it's cheaper online. I did have to order it through Waterstones though. I think it's in Amazon.co.uk.

My wife got it for me but I think it was about 20 pound. Not sure though as it has the price in dollars on the cover.

 

[Stuboy]

huh,

im suprised no one has mentioned the 500 rule!?

Divide your Total Daily Dose by 500. that will give you a good ball in the part figure to start with, then depending on your results 2 horus after eating. adjust the ratio up or down 1 carb at a time...

my TDD is 31.9 over a 6 day average (info from my ultrasmart meter)

500 / 31.9 is 15... so my starting ratio is 15g CHO to 1 unit of insulin. From there i've eventually come to the conclusion that it's actually 12:1 after testing. but it was a good start.

 

[caitycakes]

Thanks for explaining the 500 rule. It has given me a good idea of why my DSN thinks the transition from a pre-mix to basal/bolus might be tricky for me. I only take 1/2 unit of premix in morning and 5 in the evening and I do low carb, so I would imagine that unless pens come in 1/10th measurements I would be in trouble. Have I got that right?

I have told DSN that once honeymoon is over I fully intend to go onto basal/bolus and she agrees. Meanwhile, what with low carbing and rigorous testing, I am doing really well on the mix. I have also got some plain humalog in case I need to do any corrections, but for some silly reason I am scared of the stuff and have never strayed to high enough levels to have to "correct". Just having the stuff staring at me in the fridge makes me stay on the straight and narrow lol

Caitycakes x

 

[Blackadder]

I don't understand where the 500 comes from?

So that means that if I take 40 units a day, thats 12.5g per unit. So who's to say I have 500 grams of Carbs a day? That seems a lot.

 

[Katharine]

Blackadder,

You can't do anything about carb/insulin ratios till you are on meal insulin which is totally separate from your basal insulin.

If you find that the animal insulin suits you well and you would prefer more precision/ flexibility for your meals you can also get appropriate basal and meal animal insulins in cartridge from.

At that point, Gary Schiener's book, Think Like a Pancreas or the course at http://www.dsolve.com will be a great help to you.

 

[lilibet]

Like Caitycakes, am on low dose, currently only on 8 to 10 units per day. Not getting results Id like pp but apparently still 'settling'.

So on 10 the 500 rule would give me 0.02 g of Carbs per unit of insulin. :!:

Now Im trying lower carb but I doubt even Eddie could go that low

Bought the Schneider book and unsurprisingly very little about pre mix in it. When you think of how far regimens have come (ie pumps) it seems archaic to use a premix and it in no ways suits my lifestyle though I do believe it works for some and certainly less injections than MDI.

DSN has also made referencing to honeymoon period but who knows how long that will last, especially if keeping bs lower extends shelf life of beta cells Ive got left.

L x

 

[caitycakes]

Lilibet,

Divide 500 by total units of insulin (10). This would give you 50g cho per unit of insulin. If you are low carbing and say only want 10g cho in a meal then you would need a pen that did 1/5th of a unit.

Caitycakes x

 

[lilibet]

I thought it said divide Total Daily dose (10) by 500 :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

No wonder it was so low

God, I dont stand a chance on basal bolus LOL

lilibet

 

[caitycakes]

Me Either!!!!

caitycakes x

 

[caitycakes]

Not at all Sarah. I definitely want to go on to basal/bolus at some point and was using the 500 rule to try to understand why my DSN thinks basal/bolus transition might be tricky given that I am still honeymooning (and low carbing) and on tiny doses.

Caitycakes x

 

[caitycakes]

Hi Sarah,

So do you think it's entirely possible to change to basal/bolus on my tiny amounts without too much hassle?

Caitycakes x

 

[sofaraway]

caity what is your TDD?
I'm on fairly small amounts of insulin and it can be tricky at times. for example, working out if I can take a bolus for smaller amounts of carbohydrate.
there is a half unit pen avaliable which will help

 

[caitycakes]

Sofaraway,

I am on 5 1/2 TDD but it's premix. I have a half unit pen but wondered about basal/bolus due to small amounts used and also DSN saying it would be difficult.

Sarah,

Thanks, I will see if Katherine has any advice for me.

Caitycakes x

 

[sofaraway]

I reckon you could do a basal bolus,

it might look something like 2.5 units basal and 1 unit of bolus with each meal. I would try discussing it with your DSN again, she could work out properly what doses you would need.

for example yesterday i only used 4 units of novorapid all day, but on other days i can use 10-12 units, it just gives me the flexibility to change the amount of carbs I eat when i wish.