Gaining Muscle

Caractacus

Member
Messages
15
Type of diabetes
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
Does anyone suffer from high blood glucose readings after weight training? I do, I've considered taking fast acting insulin before a workout to combat it as I know the stress of lifting weights means your BG increases.

What does everyone else do to combat this?

I don't seem to get this. Quite the opposite in fact.

My lowest BGs seem to occur after getting back from the gym at weekends (25 mins fast walk each way plus an 60-90mins of barbell abuse)

I'm type 2 and on Metformin 2x500g/day which I gather may discourage the liver from dumping glucose into the bloodstream inappropriately though.
 

apache

Newbie
Messages
3
Type of diabetes
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
I don't seem to get this. Quite the opposite in fact.

My lowest BGs seem to occur after getting back from the gym at weekends (25 mins fast walk each way plus an 60-90mins of barbell abuse)

I'm type 2 and on Metformin 2x500g/day which I gather may discourage the liver from dumping glucose into the bloodstream inappropriately though.
I'm type 2 on metformin and have been diabetic for 5 years, training for over 5 years before that. I initially lost over a stone when I was newly diagnosed but a new diet and exercise routine has made me stronger, fitter and more muscular than I was pre-diabetes. I have even been helping a friend who is a doctor in advising his diabetic patients, almost like a guinea pig! If anyone needs some advice, please feel free to give me a shout.
 

Diamattic

Well-Known Member
Messages
678
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
I don't think cut/bulk cycles should affect blood sugars at all for someone who is carb counting and checking frequently. Weight gain or loss can be looked at in terms of caloric intake as i mentioned before. To gain muscle the most basic requirements are:
1) create a need for your muscles to grow - this would be done by using them, and pushing them.
2) eat a caloric surplus, usually only 200-500 calories above your maintenance is required.

IF someone is already a bit on the soft side, that usually means they are already eating at a surplus (which is how they gained and kept the extra weight) so, that would mean for someone whose 15lbs or more over their ideal weight they would only need to lift weights, while eating the same (provided they get all the required vitamins, nutrients, etc..)

When body builders use term bulk and cut, they always mean bulk = add muscle, and cut = lose fat.
Bulk is very easy lol For the average person it is as simple as going to the gym 3 times a week and lifting heavy, and then simply eating more.
Cutting is the hard part. Without much math, most men can lose fat by simply eating less than 2000cal per day. If your already lean (like <180lbs) then i would go as low as 1800cal per day. So this would mean like eat 2200 cal, and then burn 400cal at the gym = 1800 total at the days end... Or just eat 1800 and skip the gym for a nap, the end result is the same lol

The hardest part in a cut (which usually follows a bulk) is to keep as much muscle as possible, which means cardio, but also lifting heavy (but less frequent, like twice a week).

I prefer the bulk cut cycles because if someone is already relatively lean (like me) its impossible to loose fat and gain muscle. It cannot happen. Because to gain muscle i would need to eat at a surplus of 500cal, but loosing fat is a deficit of 500cal.. so naturally you see i cannot do both at the same time. Its either 2700cal or 1800cal.. whereas eating right in the middle won't accomplish anything other then keeping both my current levels of fat and muscle lol

People who are on the heavy side, or new to working out WILL be able to do both at the same time, but they will eventually hit that wall where they need to make a choice, or waste time trying to do both. This wall comes around 14% BF i have found, which would be right around the time when a dude can start to see ribs, muscle tone, and MAYBE a bit of abs if he works them... Its that point where you think "wow, this is working! i look great" the BAM wall.. and you need to pick lol

But as others have posted, one of the best weight loss meal plans is a ketogenic diet (Low carb, high fat) also happens to be one of the best diets for diabetics. If you plan on hitting the gym, just make sure you also get enough protein (like.. 0.6-0.8g per lb of lean mass... NOT your bodyweight, use your ideal weight, so if your 180 and wanna be 165, eat 165lb x 0.6 = at least 100g of protein each day)

Sorry for the long post, i hope this was informative. My key point is - There should be no down side to working out with diabetes, and its as easy as without it, just keep your sugars normal, check frequently and keep adjusting your basal rates as your weight fluctuates.
 
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Diamattic

Well-Known Member
Messages
678
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Wow, that was long..

ALSO I have found the research of a fellow Canadian - Dr. Michael C Riddell, to be very helpful. He is a fellow Type 1 Diabetic, and avid exerciser, and as such the majority of his research is in how Type 1 diabetes affects the body during various exercises. He has published papers that will likely address every situation you can think of from cycling, to weight training to swimming! He has studied it all and published in peer reviewed journals

His publications are found here - http://scholar.google.ca/citations?user=Nkxy2r0AAAAJ&hl=en&oi=sra

One of the first i learned from a paper of his was light intensity workouts will typically cause sugars to drop, while very intense workouts will cause them to rise.. So cycling with a heart rate at 130-150 they will likely drop, where when you really push your max heart rate they should typically then begin to rise.
So things like intense heavy lifting (which is relative person to person keep in mind), sprints, anything that gets you around 80% of your max HR will likely cause your BS to increase.

Which may be why some folks here claim their sugars go up after working out, they may be working harder then others haha Or at least working harder at longer intervals, or even the structure of the workout (cardio at the start vs at the end of the session) can affect the final BS levels if your only checking before and after..
 

tim2000s

Expert
Retired Moderator
Messages
8,934
Type of diabetes
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@Diamattic I'm not sure that's entirely true. I found with a ketogenic diet containing high protein that I have cut fat and maintained muscle. I'm 196 lbs with about 13% body fat and currently "cutting".
 

Kerr1992

Well-Known Member
Messages
122
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
Diabetes...
Too much concentration on protein and not enough carbs.

Carbs are key to muscle building which is why the 50/30/20 program is popular.

Also you need to calculate your required calorie maintenance which is the calories you need to maintain your weight. So many people just stick to what they are told an average person needs which might be wrong for you. For example I need 3400 cals per day maintenance when an average male apparently should stick to 2000.

Cardio such as cycling has a negative impact on muscle growth which is why bodybuilders and powerlifters avoid it while bulking and do minimal amounts when cutting.
 
Messages
3
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
I've not read through all the comments, so sorry if I'm repeating, but type of training and reps will have a big impact on the results you see. As a general rule you want to be doing 8-12 reps for hypertrophy (muscle growth). 1-6 reps will build strength, but if you're after muscle growth you need to be in the 8-12 rep range. Any more than this and you're going into endurance. Make sure you lift heavy too.. You should be going to failure in your last set... If you are reaching the rep range easily then you need to add some weight.

Hope this helps.. Keep up the training :)
 

tim2000s

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One of the key things to remember is that strength work (low reps) increases the number of nuclei so thy when you cone to the hypertrophy stage, you should get quicker muscle growth.
 

Caractacus

Member
Messages
15
Type of diabetes
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
To me the first thing to do is make sure that my diabetes is controlled, which means controlling carb intake and getting to a low body fat percentage.

So I only consume calories consistent with getting my body fat under say 10% and carbs consistent with what my meter is telling me.

Building muscle has to be secondary to diabetes control surely?
 

tim2000s

Expert
Retired Moderator
Messages
8,934
Type of diabetes
Type 1
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@Caractacus Yes, but diabetes control is what you should be doing anyway. It's then how you increase muscle mass alongside that, I would have thought? Certainly, I've found that by cutting carbs, counting cals and going to the gym for specific workouts three to four times per week, I went from 25% to 12% body fat, and saw lean muscle gains of around 8-10kg. And at the same time I was and am controlling my glucose levels.
 

Kerr1992

Well-Known Member
Messages
122
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
Diabetes...
You can reduce bf% without much carbs but you won't do well at increasing muscle mass without carbs. The are two completely different goals. You can't do both effectively at the same time. I can manage my diabetes and consume enough carbs and calories to gain muscle.
 

Kerr1992

Well-Known Member
Messages
122
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
Diabetes...
Use must be on different insulin to me or something because my blood sugar is where it Is supposed to be. I eat just as many carbs as a non diabetic lifter and take insulin to suit my carb intake as and when I eat them.