Over 40 statins as standard?

[Katson80]

Hi, I’m a type 1 diabetic, 42 years of age, was diagnosed 24 years ago. I’ve just had a diabetes check, over the phone, with a nurse practitioner, as part of my gp diabetes annual check.

The practitioner prescribed me statins, because she said they give them to all diabetics over 40. I found this to be quite a shock. I’ve have no blood tests recently to check my cholesterol or anything like that, should I have been prescribed them? I’m healthy, I have a good diet, I exercise 2-3 times a week with a trainer and at my hospital diabetes check up in November, I was in target for 70% of the time.

I feel like I’ve just been given this medicine as standard, instead of anyone looking at me as an individual. Is this normal for diabetes patients?

 

[Deleted member 567885]

Well I'd say you were right that you'd been given these LDL reducing meds as standard based on the hypothesis that the damage caused to your arteries by years of abnormal glucose levels (that bit is true sadly) is going to be made better by the reaction of LDL cholesterol which the statins will achieve.
You don't know if you even have a high LDL cholesterol number so perhaps you could ask to have your lipids checked.
Its up to you whether you feel this medication will help you but I would be asking some questions e.g. what are the numbers need to treat to prevent a heart attack? How much longer will my life be extended if I take them? And what are the common side effects?
I was also offered statins aged 40 but decided against it having done a bit of reading around the topic and thinking I won't benefit and may even be harmed ( I am 51 and have had type 1 for 40 years with a high cho of 8.4 . I think they like diabetics to have a total cho of 4.

 

[Katson80]

Well I'd say you were right that you'd been given these LDL reducing meds as standard based on the hypothesis that the damage caused to your arteries by years of abnormal glucose levels (that bit is true sadly) is going to be made better by the reaction of LDL cholesterol which the statins will achieve.
You don't know if you even have a high LDL cholesterol number so perhaps you could ask to have your lipids checked.
Its up to you whether you feel this medication will help you but I would be asking some questions e.g. what are the numbers need to treat to prevent a heart attack? How much longer will my life be extended if I take them? And what are the common side effects?
I was also offered statins aged 40 but decided against it having done a bit of reading around the topic and thinking I won't benefit and may even be harmed ( I am 51 and have had type 1 for 40 years with a high cho of 8.4 . I think they like diabetics to have a total cho of 4.

Thanks so much, appreciate you sharing your experience and knowledge. I need to do the same as you and get some reading done, was just very curious about what others have experienced. A call to the diabetes nurses tomorrow for me

 

[In Response]

About 10 years ago, I too was told that prescribing statins to everyone with diabetes over the age of 40 is standard. However, I was also told this recommendation was based on research for people with diabetes who are overweight and do little exercise. As I am slim and exercise most days (and have always had low cholesterol), I declined.
This was raised again recently by another consultant who suggested the reason for statins was fluctuating blood sugars put additional strain in the heart. Again, I would rather manage my blood sugars and minimise the fluctuations than take statins. So I declined again.
The only drugs I take are insulin.

 

[Mrs HJG]

Blimey - get them to at least test your blood so you have the information to make an educated decision!!

I was offered statins, (aged 51 at diagnosis) via a text I said no; and when I talked it through with another nurse who was doing my foot check at 3 months in, he said it was a nonsense, as I had already dropped to a non-diabetic HbA1c, a BMI of <20, otherwise fit, active and healthy non-drinker, non-smoker and cholesterol figures that were all in range for a non-diabetic. I guess it ticked a box somewhere that it was offered, (irrespective of individual requirement).

If all the figures start going in the wrong direction I may reconsider, but as I don't fit into any of their other 'diabetic norms' I am not going to accept blanket 'treatment' like that.

Using the NICE calculator, my risk jumps from 7.3% to 21.7% chance of heart attack in the next 10 years just by ticking the 'T1' box, (but is that assuming insulin-dependent and 80% in range or whatever for an average 'T1' ??), but it also doesn't work for anyone with a BMI <20 and rounds your weight up! There's also a patient decision guide link from the NICE site that might be helpful/interesting.

indepth.nice.org.uk/are-statins-the-best-choice-for-me (copy and paste into Google, as it won't let me post the link).

Apologies Admins if I'm not meant to be posting external Links.

 

[MrsA2]

. Is this normal for diabetes patients?

A non-diabetic friend of mine was just prescribed them. She'd gone with a painful knee from a botched knee replacement surgery. She was told they prescribe them to everyone as a precaution! Sometimes I think they make it up, other times I think they prescribe them to everyone, regardless of 'need'

 

[HSSS]

indepth.nice.org.uk/are-statins-the-best-choice-for-me (copy and paste into Google, as it won't let me post the link).

Are statins the best choice for me?

A helpful article by the National Institute for Health and Care Excellence (NICE)

indepth.nice.org.uk

 

[Mandy p]

I was prescribed statins last year - Atorvastin? I was keeping my HbA1c just below 48 with low carb diet and exercise. My cholesterol is 4.4.
The statin seemed to cause my HbA1c to rise to 58. I came off it and it went down to 50. Not sure if this is a common experience. The GP wanted me to try another type but it seemed to me that I could end up on metformin and a statin. I’m still not sure what to do. Currently focussing on reducing my HbA1c back below 48.

 

[Hatcher]

Hi, I’m a type 1 diabetic, 42 years of age, was diagnosed 24 years ago. I’ve just had a diabetes check, over the phone, with a nurse practitioner, as part of my gp diabetes annual check.

The practitioner prescribed me statins, because she said they give them to all diabetics over 40. I found this to be quite a shock. I’ve have no blood tests recently to check my cholesterol or anything like that, should I have been prescribed them? I’m healthy, I have a good diet, I exercise 2-3 times a week with a trainer and at my hospital diabetes check up in November, I was in target for 70% of the time.

I feel like I’ve just been given this medicine as standard, instead of anyone looking at me as an individual. Is this normal for diabetes patients?

Hi , I have been type 1 for over 27 years and have had the same conversation with my consultant , I decided not to take the statin after some research into it and with an LDL of 4.02 and an HbA1c of 6.8 I could not see what benefit there would be , After several conversations about the statin with the consultant he has now accepted my view and did concede that if my LDL stayed stable I should be fine

 

[Beefeater]

I was on Atorvastatin for a year and after a couple of months started suffering muscle pains, frozen shoulder etc,.

On going to the GP was given steroid injections and other medications in an attempt to mitigate my symptoms, but I did have my suspicions about the statins as little changed after treatment.

I eventually decided to tell my GP to cease using statins. "So your refusing this treatment?" This was the answer I received intimating I was committing heresy.

About three weeks after ceasing medication my muscle cramp like pains disappeared. This led me to think wether there was actually damage being caused, because let's face it, the heart is a muscle.

 

[Kalobe]

Read The Great Cholesterol Con by Malcolm Kendrick. Then you will know the answer.

 

[JAB-IN..]

Good morning to you all...I too am a long term type 1 diabetic and I believe they prescribe them as a prevention method not a cure, I personally think this is a good idea.

 

[Kalobe]

Read The Great Cholesterol Con by Malcolm Kendrick

 

[carolm]

Not all medical staff seem to want us to be educated, keep fighting, but we should not have to.
I do wonder how much the nurses who are allowed to prescribe actually know about all the conditions they treat. In my own case, I am type 2 but also have rheumatoid arthritis. So during covid told to leave off the arthitis medication. I sorted this, I hope by phoning rheumatology and a specialist nurse spoke to the surgery nurse and explained why I had to stay on my medication!! I hope the surgery nurse understood. what she was told. They had not even done the correct blood tests for inflammation, let alone diabetes.
So far little interest has been shown in the blood glucose levels, getting the correct blood tests, ie Hb1Ac and even what my blood glucose levels have been generally. No mention of statins. Do they just study a module in university, then only remember bits to pass exams..
You might get the results they have by asking for a Subject Acccess Request, (SAR) which is supposed to mean they have legally to tell you. If they haven't bothered with the proper tests you have it in writing, but that is no help in getting them.

2nd opinion, gp is above nurse practitioner, hospital and consultant if not, Good luck, don't be browbeaten.
Carol

 

[copey399]

I was on Atorvastatin for a year and after a couple of months started suffering muscle pains, frozen shoulder etc,.

On going to the GP was given steroid injections and other medications in an attempt to mitigate my symptoms, but I did have my suspicions about the statins as little changed after treatment.

I eventually decided to tell my GP to cease using statins. "So your refusing this treatment?" This was the answer I received intimating I was committing heresy.

About three weeks after ceasing medication my muscle cramp like pains disappeared. This led me to think wether there was actually damage being caused, because let's face it, the heart is a muscle.

My brother-in-law and my husband were talking about Statins recently and my B-I-L said that he was on them and developed similar pains to you. He did his own experiment and stopped taking them for a couple of weeks and the pains subsided, started them again and the pains came back. He discussed it with his GP and the GP was reluctant for him to come off them so with a bit of trial and error he managed to prescribe one that didn't affect him. Worth knowing if you do need to take them but have similar side effects.

 

[HSSS]

Not all medical staff seem to want us to be educated, keep fighting, but we should not have to.
I do wonder how much the nurses who are allowed to prescribe actually know about all the conditions they treat. In my own case, I am type 2 but also have rheumatoid arthritis. So during covid told to leave off the arthitis medication. I sorted this, I hope by phoning rheumatology and a specialist nurse spoke to the surgery nurse and explained why I had to stay on my medication!! I hope the surgery nurse understood. what she was told. They had not even done the correct blood tests for inflammation, let alone diabetes.
So far little interest has been shown in the blood glucose levels, getting the correct blood tests, ie Hb1Ac and even what my blood glucose levels have been generally. No mention of statins. Do they just study a module in university, then only remember bits to pass exams..
You might get the results they have by asking for a Subject Acccess Request, (SAR) which is supposed to mean they have legally to tell you. If they haven't bothered with the proper tests you have it in writing, but that is no help in getting them.

2nd opinion, gp is above nurse practitioner, hospital and consultant if not, Good luck, don't be browbeaten.
Carol

You are legally entitled to your test results anyway without the hassle of a sar in the uk. if you get the nhs app there is a results section but you may need to get your surgery to activate it first. Otherwise they should either tell you or better give you a printed copy (they may charge for the printing but it must be reasonable).

 

[agwagw]

The GPs prescribe them primarily as a box-ticking exercise. I was prescribed them in the same way some years ago. After a few weeks my legs became very weak and my back muscles were very painful. It was the start of Rhabdomyolysis, stopped taking the statins immediately and the acute pain stopped quite quickly though it took three months to recover my strength. I refuse to accept any statins now, despite pressure from the medics.

My cholesterol ratios are excellent despite being on a high fat low carb diet (important to get the full info, not just the 'total' cholesterol, which is of limited value despite being the 'target' set by medics and the statin drug manufacturers). Have a read of 'A Statin Free Life' by Dr Aseem Malhotra (a British cardiologist).

 

[arndale]

Hi, I’m a type 1 diabetic, 42 years of age, was diagnosed 24 years ago. I’ve just had a diabetes check, over the phone, with a nurse practitioner, as part of my gp diabetes annual check.

The practitioner prescribed me statins, because she said they give them to all diabetics over 40. I found this to be quite a shock. I’ve have no blood tests recently to check my cholesterol or anything like that, should I have been prescribed them? I’m healthy, I have a good diet, I exercise 2-3 times a week with a trainer and at my hospital diabetes check up in November, I was in target for 70% of the time.

I feel like I’ve just been given this medicine as standard, instead of anyone looking at me as an individual. Is this normal for diabetes patients?

Must admit that automatically being given any medication makes me cross. This standard practice costs the NHS a fortune and makes a fortune for big pharma.
As with any medication there are side affects.
Long story short as an over 40s type 1 I persuaded my specialist to find out what condition my arteries were in before agreeing to go on statins permanently.
Arteries were completely clear.
So my summary is one size does not fit all. Take statins if you want or it has been proven that you need them but not just because of your age or due to being type1!

 

[PaulXC]

Hi, I’m a type 1 diabetic, 42 years of age, was diagnosed 24 years ago. I’ve just had a diabetes check, over the phone, with a nurse practitioner, as part of my gp diabetes annual check.

The practitioner prescribed me statins, because she said they give them to all diabetics over 40. I found this to be quite a shock. I’ve have no blood tests recently to check my cholesterol or anything like that, should I have been prescribed them? I’m healthy, I have a good diet, I exercise 2-3 times a week with a trainer and at my hospital diabetes check up in November, I was in target for 70% of the time.

I feel like I’ve just been given this medicine as standard, instead of anyone looking at me as an individual. Is this normal for diabetes patients?

Firstly I think any advice or consideration to this issue will be completely different based on whether you are Type 1 or Type 2. Two different conditions, two different body systems and medications, two different durations when you reach age 40 / 50.

As you are Type 1, as I have been for the last 41 years since diagnosis age 26, my experience is similar. I was first offered statins aged 50 I think and it seemed to be a similar standard offer from my GP. My cholesterol results were good, hbA1C reasonable, and I was and am very fit, reegularly running half marathons and marathons and also triathlons, with a resting heart rate of 50. As one of the publicised complications at this time was muscle cramps, which I really needed to avoid with my running training, I discussed this with my GP and we agreed that we would defer the statins,, but reconsider after 3-4 years.

This offer of statins and reconsideration was repeated through my fifties and early sixties, but cholesterol results were still good, so i questioned what help they would do to me and we always agreed to reconsider later again. Mid sixties I had intensive investigation of my heart under private health after a small arrhythmia (an abnormal heart rhythm) was noted at an employer health check. Arteries were clear and all tests found no further problem, but I did accept the prescription of statins and some other preventative drugs. I was advised the modern statins (Atorvastatin) had been improved and the incidence of muscle cramps had been reduced, but it I still accepted this on trial.

So I have had no side effects I'm glad to say, and although I was very reluctant, it probably was the sensible choice. despite using insulin for 41 years, i really don't like taking medicines. In your case i would try to have the discussion as to what advantges statins offer in your personal circumstances. As long as you have better than average blood results, I'm not sure there is any advantage at this point in time. Just don't make it a final decision as you can always change later. Obviously I am not medically qualified, just 40 years experience and a computer analyst by trade so very analytical. Also try to get some real researched and proven feedback on side effects, not what someone moans about on Facebook or similar.

 

[Old’un]

I have had type one for almost fifty years now and when I turned forty I was prescribed aspirin as they thought it was beneficial. Some time later they suddenly dropped it as they decided it was more likely to do harm than to benefit me as there were no other cardiovascular risk factors present. During that time I also found my ability to balance deteriorated to the extent that I felt unsafe riding my bicycle and had to drive instead. I had already stopped taking the aspirin before the consultant officially ended it.

Recently I was prescribed statins as this is the latest craze apparently. I said that I didn’t see the need for them as my total cholesterol was 3.3 and LDL only 0.9. I was told that whatever my cholesterol level was it was too high and I needed to take statins. I tried them but started experiencing joint and muscle pains and felt really lethargic and had to force myself to continue with the active lifestyle I am accustomed to. Over the course of a month I lost 4kg in weight and it was muscle that was disappearing and abdominal fat was developing too. My blood sugar was running higher and despite eating less I had to increase my insulin doses and then had sugar levels fluctuating more. I refused to take them after the first month as it was clear to me that they were doing more harm than good.

I do not doubt that statins are excellent drugs for those who need them but I do not believe they are of universal benefit and each individual case needs to be evaluated before drugs are prescribed.

I also had one consultant who was keen to prescribe me with metformin as well as my insulin but after a lengthy debate he backed down on that one.