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BS going up over night

Scubastu

Scubastu

Active Member
Hi all
I'm type 2 but recently being put on insulin 25% fast acting 75% slow in one pen twice a day 18 units am with breakfast 12 unit pm with evening meal.
Went to bed with a reading of 7.5 @ 10pm, this morning I have a reading of 12 @5.30am, I didnt snack before going to bed, How / why have my BS gone up?
 
Scubastu said:
As an addendum to the above its now 8 am and without eating my bs has gone up to 15.7
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Hi Scubastu. I'm also T2 and I used to get exactly the same issue. When I was first diagnosed I tried to bring my levels down by fasting, and the longer I'd go without eating the higher my BG levels would go. It really drove me nuts because it just seemed so counter intuitive.

What's going on is that, being highly insulin resistant and essentially having a carbohydrate metabolism which is broken, your body (liver) just keeps producing glucose until your levels are high enough to allow your body to access that glucose for energy. Otherwise you would die.

After a while on a LCHF diet my levels stopped climbing like that. It seems that once your body adjusts to using an alternate energy source to glucose (namely dietary fats and oils), the liver stops going crazy trying to make enough glucose to power your body.

So the surprising solution for me was just to eat more fat, a lot more fat, and a lot less carbs (and no real change in protein). Take a look at the LCHF forum here for more info.
 
Scubastu said:
As an addendum to the above its now 8 am and without eating my bs has gone up to 15.7
Click to expand...
As has been suggested, it sounds like dawn phenomenon, the liver is dumping glucose into the blood stream like there's no tomorrow. The interesting thing is that after waking you can stop the rise by eating, sounds daft but it switches the liver off because you're providing another source of energy, especially if it's some carb.
Some people might have a late night snack to overcome the problem. As we're all slightly different, you can try the snack before bed or something as soon as you wake and check with your meter.
Welcome by the way, there's a lot to take on board and unfortunately your GP/DN may not know it all. There's a lot of fellow diabetics on this forum who will have been there, done that, got the t-shirt and still making the video.
 
I would agree that it is Dawn Phenomenon. I get this as well, overnight my sugars slowly rise starting at bout 3am stopping at about 7am. Typically the body begins your so called 'wake up cycle' and thinks it being helpful by giving you some morning energy in the form of glucose right before the sun rises.

It our case it is not at all helpful lol

I can't comment on the "eat to stop it" part mentioned above because i NEVER eat breakfast. I wake up around 730-8am get my stuff ready and head to work for the day. I don't eat until 1230pm at the earliest and I find that once i wake up and start my day my BS begins to fall and is usually back under 6mmol/L before lunch.

I could also be a combination of dawn phenomenon and not enough unsulin, as i find i can prevent it from happening with an increase in basal insulin. So perhaps speak to your Doc about an increase?
 
Diamattic said:
I can't comment on the "eat to stop it" part mentioned above because i NEVER eat breakfast.
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I read it in an article by the American Diabetes Association, although they say that eating a small amount doesn't work for everyone and even the Dawn Phenomenon affects non diabetics as well to varying degrees.
 
andyh19 said:
It could possibly be that you have gone too low and had a nightime hypo. Your bodies natural instinct kicks in and what is refered to as a liver dump happens where your liver kicks in and burns off some glycogen to save you.

www.diabetes.co.uk/blood-glucose/dawn-phenomenon.html
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Hi, It sounds as if you have some experience with this. I have the same problem. I am a new DT2 and trying LCHF diet and Intermittent Fasting also. I have started checking my sugar at 530 and again at 630 and even an hour later. It just keeps going up. Should I just check it at 530 to get a consistent value. Also, I tried eating at 530 this morning and it did stop the rise. Is that good?
 
graj0 said:
As has been suggested, it sounds like dawn phenomenon, the liver is dumping glucose into the blood stream like there's no tomorrow. The interesting thing is that after waking you can stop the rise by eating, sounds daft but it switches the liver off because you're providing another source of energy, especially if it's some carb.
Some people might have a late night snack to overcome the problem. As we're all slightly different, you can try the snack before bed or something as soon as you wake and check with your meter.
Welcome by the way, there's a lot to take on board and unfortunately your GP/DN may not know it all. There's a lot of fellow diabetics on this forum who will have been there, done that, got the t-shirt and still making the video.
Click to expand...
 
Hi, It sounds as if you have some experience with this. I have the same problem. I am a new DT2 and trying LCHF diet and Intermittent Fasting also. I have started checking my sugar at 530 and again at 630 and even an hour later. It just keeps going up. Should I just check it at 530 to get a consistent value. Also, I tried eating at 530 this morning and it did stop the rise. Is that good?
I am new to this Forum business as well, so am posting to 2 of you with the same reply. Hope that is ok.
 
JOANN K said:
Hi, It sounds as if you have some experience with this. I have the same problem. I am a new DT2 and trying LCHF diet and Intermittent Fasting also. I have started checking my sugar at 530 and again at 630 and even an hour later. It just keeps going up. Should I just check it at 530 to get a consistent value. Also, I tried eating at 530 this morning and it did stop the rise. Is that good?
I am new to this Forum business as well, so am posting to 2 of you with the same reply. Hope that is ok.
Click to expand...

I would wait for 2-3 weeks on the LCHF diet and then check FBS readings again. It takes sometime to get it sorted from my personal experience. LCHF diet plays a crucial role. Are you taking less than 50g carbs? Good luck joann k
 
I'm also getting almost all of my highest readings first thing in the morning, and over the course of most days it goes down, in both the before and after meals readings. I've been on a low carb diet since early July, plus increased exercise, and am not on any medication. I was also wondering if I just have to wait longer to see the change in diet have its effect. I was on a conventionally 'good' sort of wholefood diet before, which included carbohydrates at each meal, so it's been quite a change. But it had been a low GI wholefood diet for several years, since having had that suggested when I was in the pre-diabetic range, so maybe my body's not experiencing this as quite enough of a change? Heaven knows! This does make me realise how different we each are, despite the things that we have in common.
 
I eat a low carb and low protein high fat snack before bed, which gives my stomach something to grumble away at and convinces my liver that it has enough fuel to get me out of bed in the morning. The reason for the low protein part, is because protein is insulinogenic. I don't want my glucose or insulin levels to go up, especially not when I'm sleeping with my metabolism at lowest ebb.
 
Celeriac said:
I eat a low carb and low protein high fat snack before bed, which gives my stomach something to grumble away at and convinces my liver that it has enough fuel to get me out of bed in the morning. The reason for the low protein part, is because protein is insulinogenic. I don't want my glucose or insulin levels to go up, especially not when I'm sleeping with my metabolism at lowest ebb.
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That's particularly well put!
 
Celeriac said:
I eat a low carb and low protein high fat snack before bed, which gives my stomach something to grumble away at and convinces my liver that it has enough fuel to get me out of bed in the morning. The reason for the low protein part, is because protein is insulinogenic. I don't want my glucose or insulin levels to go up, especially not when I'm sleeping with my metabolism at lowest ebb.
Click to expand...

Nobody want to their glucose go up. Well put..Keep going.
 
Celeriac said:
I eat a low carb and low protein high fat snack before bed, which gives my stomach something to grumble away at and convinces my liver that it has enough fuel to get me out of bed in the morning. .....
Click to expand...

What sort of things do you eat for the bedtime snack?

And how long after your evening meal is this?
 
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