Advice regarding high fasting bloods in a morning

[BottomlessPit]

Hi, I was diagnosed late in my pregnancy with gestational diabetes. I didn't have any of the risk factors (no family history of diabetes and I'm not overweight). I went for the lucozade test three months after giving birth and my fasting blood was 10.3. I put myself back on LCHF diet and my GP did an hba1c a month later and it was 48. I was told by my practice nurse that they didn't consider me to be diabetic but because I had a meter from my pregnancy I knew that my fasting blood sugars were higher than they should be. When I showed concern about this, I was given a booklet of dietary advice and it was full of food I know I can't tolerate. The nurse said I wouldn't have been given a meter by them and I should test less and not worry as much. I got a referral back to the hospital and had the yearly diabetes check and the consultant showed concern that my blood sugars were still high in the morning but decided against starting on medication and has referred me to see a dietician. My hba1c was now down to 45. I don't seem to be able to get my fasting blood sugars lower than in the 6s and was looking for advice. Obviously looking after a baby means I'm not getting the usual amount of sleep so I wondered if this was affecting the results? My blood sugar last night was 5.7 but this morning it was 8.2. I've completely cut out rice/pasta/potatoes/milk etc and I'm struggling to see where I can make any more changes. I was taking 500mg of Metformin with my evening meal during pregnancy as ketosis can be harmful to the baby but currently not taking anything. Any advice would be much appreciated.

 

[ickihun]

Well. You are doing everything to combat spikes in your bgs which whilst looking after a baby is a big task.
You could try a liver block before bed but only if your sleeping for longer than 4/5hrs a night.
Babies aren't babies for long so you're guaranteed more sleep as they grow so only a temporary thing if not possible, at mo.

I know the NHS is looking after our mental health but no testing....really! I wish they'd either spend the money explaining thoroughly what's needed or just say nothing. Advice to not test is medieval. Cruel, even.

You're doing fantastic. Well done.

 

[BottomlessPit]

You're doing fantastic. Well done.

Thank you for your kind words. What would a liver block involve? I googled it but couldn't find much.

 

[Robbity]

I found that my morning/fasting levels stayed highish long after I got my HbA1c levels down to near normal - and my other levels were vastly improved. So It's not necessarily something to worry about - just your liver trying to make sure you have enough energy to start the day...

The general opinion/advice seems to be look after your pre and post meal levels, get these nice and stable and your fasting levels will (eventually!!) follow suit.

But in general, I've found eating enough fat keeps all my glucose levels steady overall. Fat allows you to store and access much more fuel for you energy that short term carbs do. so there's less need for your liver to be topping you up.

Robbity

PS I'm definitely no way an expert but have a Google for information regarding babies and ketosis or ketones - breast fed babies are being fed a high fat "ketogenic" diet.

 

[Bluetit1802]

Hi, I was diagnosed late in my pregnancy with gestational diabetes. I didn't have any of the risk factors (no family history of diabetes and I'm not overweight). I went for the lucozade test three months after giving birth and my fasting blood was 10.3. I put myself back on LCHF diet and my GP did an hba1c a month later and it was 48. I was told by my practice nurse that they didn't consider me to be diabetic but because I had a meter from my pregnancy I knew that my fasting blood sugars were higher than they should be. When I showed concern about this, I was given a booklet of dietary advice and it was full of food I know I can't tolerate. The nurse said I wouldn't have been given a meter by them and I should test less and not worry as much. I got a referral back to the hospital and had the yearly diabetes check and the consultant showed concern that my blood sugars were still high in the morning but decided against starting on medication and has referred me to see a dietician. My hba1c was now down to 45. I don't seem to be able to get my fasting blood sugars lower than in the 6s and was looking for advice. Obviously looking after a baby means I'm not getting the usual amount of sleep so I wondered if this was affecting the results? My blood sugar last night was 5.7 but this morning it was 8.2. I've completely cut out rice/pasta/potatoes/milk etc and I'm struggling to see where I can make any more changes. I was taking 500mg of Metformin with my evening meal during pregnancy as ketosis can be harmful to the baby but currently not taking anything. Any advice would be much appreciated.

When we are in a fasting state, as we are first thing in the morning before we eat, our blood glucose will have dropped lower than our body is used to. This happens to everyone, not just diabetics.

In normal healthy people the liver will dump glucose in the blood stream from its own stores whenever it detects glucose is low. The pancreas then leaps into action and secretes some insulin to balance this out and keep glucose levels stable, at the same time telling the liver to stop dumping. This is all regulated by certain hormones. (adrenalin, glucagon, growth hormone) It saves our lives, because otherwise in times of fasting and between meals (and exercise ) our glucose levels would be insufficient to feed our brains and red blood cells, and we would die.

This system breaks down when we are diabetic with insulin resistance. The liver dumps its stored glucose but due to insulin resistance the secreted insulin can't do its job properly, the liver keeps dumping and the glucose stays in the blood stream until enough insulin has been produced to clear it, which can take ages.

The system also breaks down if our pancreas is a bit worn out and doesn't produce enough insulin.

Basically, for those with insulin resistance the only real way to prevent it happening at significant levels is to reduce the amount of insulin resistance. This is why it takes so long to see improved fasting glucose. The best indication of how your levels are doing is to keep an eye on your level before your evening meal, and also your 2 hour post meal levels.

 

[BottomlessPit]

I found that my morning/fasting levels stayed highish long after I got my HbA1c levels down to near normal - and my other levels were vastly improved. So It's not necessarily something to worry about - just your liver trying to make sure you have enough energy to start the day...

The general opinion/advice seems to be look after your pre and post meal levels, get these nice and stable and your fasting levels will (eventually!!) follow suit.

But in general, I've found eating enough fat keeps all my glucose levels steady overall. Fat allows you to store and access much more fuel for you energy that short term carbs do. so there's less need for your liver to be topping you up.

Robbity

PS I'm definitely no way an expert but have a Google for information regarding babies and ketosis or ketones - breast fed babies are being fed a high fat "ketogenic" diet.

Thank you for your advice. I do worry that I may be eating too much fat. I think I may have to read more about this diet.

 

[BottomlessPit]

When we are in a fasting state, as we are first thing in the morning before we eat, our blood glucose will have dropped lower than our body is used to. This happens to everyone, not just diabetics.

In normal healthy people the liver will dump glucose in the blood stream from its own stores whenever it detects glucose is low. The pancreas then leaps into action and secretes some insulin to balance this out and keep glucose levels stable, at the same time telling the liver to stop dumping. This is all regulated by certain hormones. (adrenalin, glucagon, growth hormone) It saves our lives, because otherwise in times of fasting and between meals (and exercise ) our glucose levels would be insufficient to feed our brains and red blood cells, and we would die.

This system breaks down when we are diabetic with insulin resistance. The liver dumps its stored glucose but due to insulin resistance the secreted insulin can't do its job properly, the liver keeps dumping and the glucose stays in the blood stream until enough insulin has been produced to clear it, which can take ages.

The system also breaks down if our pancreas is a bit worn out and doesn't produce enough insulin.

Basically, for those with insulin resistance the only real way to prevent it happening at significant levels is to reduce the amount of insulin resistance. This is why it takes so long to see improved fasting glucose. The best indication of how your levels are doing is to keep an eye on your level before your evening meal, and also your 2 hour post meal levels.

Thank you for taking the time to post an explanation. Hopefully with time (and hopefully sleep) they will start to come down. I was beginning to think I had done something drastically wrong with the diet and it’s very disheartening.

 

[ickihun]

Thank you for taking the time to post an explanation. Hopefully with time (and hopefully sleep) they will start to come down. I was beginning to think I had done something drastically wrong with the diet and it’s very disheartening.

Sorry I didn't see your reply.
A liver block is a fatty protein before bed which cons the liver into not dumping through the early hours. Its something I discovered on my heavy low carb plan and it made a huge difference to my hba1c result and fatty liver high level enzymes.
It gives you the same or nearly same meter reading as you go to bed on, on rising. Many find an increase of 2-3mmol/l from their liver dump very negative with all their hard work from low carbing still doesn't help.
A great emotional booster I needed, time and time again.

 

[BottomlessPit]

Sorry I didn't see your reply.
A liver block is a fatty protein before bed which cons the liver into not dumping through the early hours. Its something I discovered on my heavy low carb plan and it made a huge difference to my hba1c result and fatty liver high level enzymes.
It gives you the same or nearly same meter reading as you go to bed on, on rising. Many find an increase of 2-3mmol/l from their liver dump very negative with all their hard work from low carbing still doesn't help.
A great emotional booster I needed, time and time again.

Thank you for this, I will have to give it a try when I hopefully get more sleep. Blood sugars were 8.2 this morning which was quite a shock.

 

[Bluetit1802]

Thank you for this, I will have to give it a try when I hopefully get more sleep. Blood sugars were 8.2 this morning which was quite a shock.

If it doesn't work, maybe you should consider stopping testing your FBG at least for the time being. There are so many factors, and it doesn't necessarily come down to food, plus it only adds to the stress. It is better to concentrate on your pre and post meal levels, and the level before evening meal is usually a better indicator of your progress.

 

[BottomlessPit]

If it doesn't work, maybe you should consider stopping testing your FBG at least for the time being. There are so many factors, and it doesn't necessarily come down to food, plus it only adds to the stress. It is better to concentrate on your pre and post meal levels, and the level before evening meal is usually a better indicator of your progress.

Thank you for the advice. At my annual diabetic review, the dr wanted me to test in the morning, before my evening meal and before bed only. My post breakfast and lunch levels are pretty stable. My fasting level was 6.2 yesterday after I had a bit of sleep so I think the reason they are so high is definitely sleep related. I feel more confident that the diet is working now.

 

[DCUKMod]

Thank you for the advice. At my annual diabetic review, the dr wanted me to test in the morning, before my evening meal and before bed only. My post breakfast and lunch levels are pretty stable. My fasting level was 6.2 yesterday after I had a bit of sleep so I think the reason they are so high is definitely sleep related. I feel more confident that the diet is working now.

Hi BottomlessPit (love the name ) - When you test in the mornings, how long have you been up?

I refer to my fasting test routine as doing it as soon as my feet touch the floor. I tend to wake, visit the loo, wash my hands and test. Some find if they do this their score is lower. That doesn't mean their fasting blood glucose level is lowerr, it just means the first test of the day returns a lower number.

As others have said, our body gives us a bit of a boost in the morning around the time we wake up. Adrenaline can also raise our blood glucose number, and I imagine if you are being woken by a baby demanding your attention, adrenaline could be in play too.

A great number of people find their fasting score is the last to moderate back to lower levels, so whilst of course you want it to come down, please try to look at along with your wider numbers, from other times of the day too.

Congratulations on the little one. One way or another, you have your hands full!

 

[BottomlessPit]

Hi BottomlessPit (love the name ) - When you test in the mornings, how long have you been up?

I refer to my fasting test routine as doing it as soon as my feet touch the floor. I tend to wake, visit the loo, wash my hands and test. Some find if they do this their score is lower. That doesn't mean their fasting blood glucose level is lowerr, it just means the first test of the day returns a lower number.

As others have said, our body gives us a bit of a boost in the morning around the time we wake up. Adrenaline can also raise our blood glucose number, and I imagine if you are being woken by a baby demanding your attention, adrenaline could be in play too.

A great number of people find their fasting score is the last to moderate back to lower levels, so whilst of course you want it to come down, please try to look at along with your wider numbers, from other times of the day too.

Congratulations on the little one. One way or another, you have your hands full!

Thank you. I have started testing first thing now. My fasting blood sugars have been in the 5s for the past week now so I'm very pleased. I would like to thank everyone for their advice.