Amazed and Amazing - Thanks (& quick question)!!!

[Trixy83]

I joined this forum a few days ago after having struggled with my sugar levels since being diagnosed 6 weeks ago. I think I've read just about every thread relevant and had lots of fantastic advice from folk. I vowed that starting the new month I would strip everything right back and basically start from scratch. I know I'm only 3 days in but so far the results are astounding!! As an example, 2 days towards the end of February my sugar readings were 12.7, 17.5, 8.1, 11.6 then the next day 10.4 , 10.7 , 13.6 and 9.9 (that's as at breakfast, lunch, dinner and bed), since the 1st my sugar levels haven't went above 9 and have stayed pretty much in the 5-8 range, even 2 hours after meals, which is a massive improvement for me! I've started watching what I eat, looking at carb contents closely and I've bought the carbs and cals book. The amount of novorapid I'm having to take has more than halved because I'm eating better and not needing correction doses! I'm absolutely amazed at the difference and for the first time since being diagnosed actually feel like I have a bit of control!

Now quick question! I've always been high at meal times so never had to think about this, but this morning my reading was 7.2, exactly where I want it to be. For breakfast I had an omelette which has practically no carbs, so how much insulin should I give (I know you can't say exact, but in general) In my head I don't need any because I'm where I want to be and not eating carbs, but is that right, can you not take insulin with meals? Or would I need a couple of units at least?

So glad I've found this forum

 

[LucySW]

For me: two-egg scrambled eggs behaves BG-wise like 8g carb. It's 13g protein, and behaves like half that of carb, i.e. 7g. I take 1.5 to 2u Novorapid for it.

 

[Robinredbreast]

I still have to inject for protein foods, I found that out a while ago. Just seen Lucys post and I would say the same amount of Insulin, but just be careful as it's best to go a little lower with Insulin, as you don't want to go hypo. You will find what works best for your body.

Best wishes RRB

 

[noblehead]

Well done on what you've achieved so far.

No carbs meals are tricky to bolus for and we all need various amounts to cover such meals as an omelette, just start with a low-dose and test your postprandial bg readings and see how it goes, it's really trial & error but by testing you'll get there in the end

.Personally I need 4 units of insulin for a 4 egg cheese omelette.

 

[urbanracer]

Congratulations on your BS readings.

I'll be interested to see the responses you get to this question. At weekends, I tried just having a cup of tea and small biscuit (about 4g) upon waking up and didn't inject straight away. I usually found that my BS crept up a bit all by itself around mid-morning so now I always inject something. Also depends on level of (expected) activity of course.

 

[Trixy83]

Thanks for the responses! I went with 4 units this morning but that was obviously too much as by 9.30 by sugar level was at 3.9, I'll try again with 2 next time and see how that goes. I'm not complaining though, a week or two ago I was no where near being able to worry about such low levels so I'm very happy.

 

[stratospheric]

I know low lvls can excite you, just be carefull...

 

[Trixy83]

I know low lvls can excite you, just be carefull...

I am being careful, I'm checking my levels every couple of hours and have lots of jellybabies on standby. This morning when I went to that I had 2 and it put me back up to the 5 range

 

[noblehead]

Thanks for the responses! I went with 4 units this morning but that was obviously too much as by 9.30 by sugar level was at 3.9, I'll try again with 2 next time and see how that goes. I'm not complaining though, a week or two ago I was no where near being able to worry about such low levels so I'm very happy.

You might need to split the 4 unit dose, I find with meals that are protein and fat based my bg levels start to rise 3 hours after finishing the meal, so I inject 2 units upfront before the meal and 2 units 2-3 hours later which works for me, as said it's trial & error.

 

[himtoo]

wow trixy83 -- fantastic work by you!!!!!

i like others who have posted do need to bolus for a protein based meal such as an omelette.
for me it would be 4 units for a ham and mushroom or 5 units for a ham and cheese ( extra fat )

 

[dtennant9]

Well done @Trixy83 thats fantastic.

Never too sure one what the protein does to my levels unless it is a really high protein meal.

 

[LucySW]

You might need to split the 4 unit dose, I find with meals that are protein and fat based my bg levels start to rise 3 hours after finishing the meal, so I inject 2 units upfront before the meal and 2 units 2-3 hours later which works for me, as said it's trial & error.

When I do that my insulin goes hysterical and drops me dramatically every time, 2-3mmol down. Funny, isn't it? That's why I asked about stacking. It doesn't seem to suit me, while it clearly does suit many others.

Moral of the story, keep those notes and work it all out!

 

[tim2000s]

You might need to split the 4 unit dose, I find with meals that are protein and fat based my bg levels start to rise 3 hours after finishing the meal, so I inject 2 units upfront before the meal and 2 units 2-3 hours later which works for me, as said it's trial & error.

This. I inject for half the protein, plus any carbs in the meal just before eating. I then inject for ~25% of the protein about an hour later, and then 25% an hour after that. Seems to generate a nice flat blood glucose graph.

 

[Trixy83]

Wow it never fails to amaze me how different everyone is and how complex all this can become. To be honest I'm still only 6 weeks in and at the moment getting the whole carbs bit right is kind of my priority (as right as I can anyway!) I had no clue that things like protein and fat also come into play, I thought it was just carbs. I really don't want to confuse myself, easily done! So for now I'm thinking my best approach is to carry on as I am looking at carb content and just keep a note of everything and how it affects me. I'm thinking there must have been something related to this for my lunch! I had 2 sausages with some veg and a slice of bread, all in a total of 34 carbs, I took my 3 units of insulin to cover it (using a 1:10 ratio) but I'm currently sitting quite high (11.1) just under 2 hours later. I'll keep an eye on it throughout the afternoon and see what happens. I never realised how much work my poor pancreas had to do haha

 

[noblehead]

When I do that my insulin goes hysterical and drops me dramatically every time, 2-3mmol down. Funny, isn't it? That's why I asked about stacking. It doesn't seem to suit me, while it clearly does suit many others.

Moral of the story, keep those notes and work it all out!

This. I inject for half the protein, plus any carbs in the meal just before eating. I then inject for ~25% of the protein about an hour later, and then 25% an hour after that. Seems to generate a nice flat blood glucose graph.

It's why it's called trial & error, type 1 is a really complex condition and what works for one may not work for another, but perseverance nearly always pays off...........

 

[noblehead]

@Trixy83, do you inject ahead of your food? Quick-acting Insulin's like Novorapid & Apidra take around 15 mins to start to work, so by injecting 10-20 mins before food you can give your insulin a head start before your food digest, by doing this it can reduce postprandial spikes which many of us on the forum have found to be the case, the only time I don't inject ahead of my food is when the meal is high in fat, as high-fat meals slow down the digestion of the food.

To explain things better have a read of the following:

http://www.diabetesselfmanagement.c...blood-glucose-management/strike-the-spike-ii/

 

[Trixy83]

@noblehead yeah at the moment when my meal is ready I check my blood then have my insulin and eat. Maybe I shouldtry what you suggest and have it beforehand. So lunch today was at 12.35 and I was at 5.1, had 4 units of novorapid then I had lunch (as above, 2 sausages, some veg and a slice of bread and fruit) and 2 hours later I was 11.1, just checked now, 4 hours after and I'm 5.8. So! I spiked after 2 hours and back to normal after 4, I've saw posts that you shouldn't test after 2 hours, instead 4, if I'd done that I'd never have known I spiked and thought I was all good.

 

[noblehead]

Try it and see how you get on, just be sure to keep some glucose to hand and test your postprandial bg levels.

 

[LucySW]

But remember, the point is precisely to avoid the spikes. Not have them and recover. It all goes on the HbA1c - which is an aggregate, not an average.

I will probably be fried for saying the above.

In any case, trial and error is the way. Write everything down and the exact times, and try if you can to repeat the sameish meal with different timings and difft insulin doses.

This is called Knowledge !!

 

[Blackers183]

Suggest a small amount of carbs (piece of grain toast) and insulin to match otherwise you liver might put out some sugars and you have not any insulin.