Any triathletes here?

[vxrich]

Hi doing my first Ironman in June and just wondering if there's any T1 triathletes on here able to give some race day nutrition advice. Training is going really well and definitely seeing the benefits of being fat adapted but I don't think it's going to be possible to do a 70.3 Ironman without any carb intake at all. I'd be really interested to to see how any other T1's have planned their race day... ie when to take carbs/insulin and how often to check bs? Cheers

 

[izzyj09]

Runsweet.com has loads of advice about triathlons and marathons !

 

[ElyDave]

I can give you plenty of advice on bike/run, but not swim I'm afraid. I've ultra marathoned and done plenty of 100km+ rides.

My only duathlon experience was pre-diagnosis.

 

[vxrich]

Hi guys. Yep looked on run sweet but not really found what I'm looking for on there (at least on the triathlon forum?)
ElyDave I'm quite happy with the swim part it's the bike and run that I'm trying to work out. I've done both run and bike 70.3 Ironman distances in training both without any carbs but not together yet. Have you done your marathons and long rides without the need for any carbs? Any advice would be great. Cheers

 

[ElyDave]

I probably could if I went massively low on MDI dosages, but on the pump I find that even if I dial it back to 20% about three hours ahead of the event I still need about 20g/hr of carbs to prevent going too low. Same with the running over longer distances.

Did a 106km audax on Sunday, no carbs for breakfast. Had a snickers, two 9-bars and a piece of cake at halfway, with a total riding time of 4h11 and elapsed about 4h55. Also had a piece of pork pie before driving home as BG was <5.0.

Next experiment in safe conditions might be to let the BG go low and then see if it self-recovers. It's all trial and error. I must admit I didn't find runsweet that much of a heal when you get out of the norm of the C25K, HM plans etc into the more serious stuff.

Are you planning to test during the event, or just set a strategy and go for it? Might be worth taking the time in training to do that periodic testing and develop the strategy, if you aren't already doing so.

 

[vxrich]

Thanks for that ElyDave. I'm planning on testing during the race which is going to take some practice on the bike! Alternatively I may be able to borrow a cgm for the race which would be a great help.
Out of interest did you bolus for the carbs that you took in during your ride or did you let the basal take care of it? So long as I can keep bs level I'm pretty happy to do the whole race without carbs. Was actually thinking of filling some refillable baby food pouches with a homemade low carb gel/smoothie.

 

[ElyDave]

no bolus whatsoever, not needed with those activity levels.

I was also carrying other stuff, like gels and dried bananas, but didn't need those. Drinks are typically Nuun or High-5 Zero

 

[vxrich]

So you're basal and exercise takes care of the carbs. How have you worked out when to take the carbs because obviously without the carbs your bs would start to drop (or is that when you know to take some carbs? ) I'm pretty sure my bs would skyrocket if ate that many carbs without bolus. Horrible feeling having high sugars and trying to run or ride! I really don't want to get into the whole eat carbs, take bolus, adjust if necessary etc etc especially during a race. I'm obviously going to have to do some trials to see what works best aren't I!? Not familiar with bg self recovery... How's that work?

 

[ElyDave]

I test every 45 mins, and eat depending on the BG at that time. Last weekend went a bit like this
Breakfast was scrambled eggs, mushrooms, smoked salmon and coffee with double cream, basal rate reduced.
BG before was 5.5, and on arrival at ride HQ, 7.2 perfect to start out.

I had half a snickers bar (15g carbs) before the start, anticipating a drop.
45 min 7.0, finished the rest of the snickers, another 15g
90 min 7.7, half a 9-bar for 5g
130 min, back to HQ, 50km completed - 6.3, cake for 25g.

About an hour to the next one (working on more carbs in the cake) 5.7, another 9-bar for 10g
Left the next one far too late, a) my Garmin threw a wobbly and b) it was only 30k back to HQ . So tested at the return down to 3.5 (oops), the other half of that 9-bar for 5g more.

Quick cup of coffee and retest for driving home, only up to 4.3 so had half of my reserve pork pie for 15g.

Total 105km, 4hr 11 riding time, 4hr 50 total time, 90g carbs

 

[vxrich]

That's exactly what I'm after... Cheers ElyDave!

 

[vxrich]

ElyDave do you check bg whilst riding or do you stop? Ive read that many people test with they're glucose monitor strapped to their bars whilst riding

 

[ElyDave]

I stop, I don't think I'd have the dexterity to focus on testing whilst riding as well. Each stop takes under two minutes and on a general ride or audax is an opportunity to eat as necessary. I can do it on the turbo but that's not wobbling around under me.

If I were racing I'd probably consider CGM or try and find a method to do it on the bike, unless it was under an hour.

 

[vxrich]

Well I've done a bit of experimenting today. Firstly I was fasted for 14hrs so trained on an empty stomach. BG was 6.0 before a 45 min, 2 km swim (felt like I was in Z2 but don't have a swimming hrstrap) BG was 5.8 after. Then did an indoor bike session at mainly Z2 but BG dropped to 4.4 after 1hr but this is due to not turning basal down on my pump! DOH! So I reckon if I'd dropped the basal to my normal 40% I'd have been about right. I know if I can control BG through swim and ride I'll be ok for the run so long as I run as I'm training.... in Z2 with the odd effort.
As for testing on the bike I think you're right! For the sake of 10 minutes its best to be safe and not in a pile at the side of the road which would properly mess the race up!!

 

[ElyDave]

If your BG was that steady during the swim, you could have been going harder than you think with a bit of a liver dump of glycogen. Your bike response is pretty much what I get if the pump is not low enough for long enough beforehand

 

[vxrich]

Could it not be that I was just burning fat for fuel during the swim? Ketone levels after suggested this?

 

[ElyDave]

could be, you didn't mention the ketones earlier

 

[vxrich]

Ahh forgot that this post got moved from the lchf section too!

 

[Gluneck]

As a Type 1 runner and biker, I use a necklace with glucose gel...
https://m.facebook.com/Gluneck

I probably could if I went massively low on MDI dosages, but on the pump I find that even if I dial it back to 20% about three hours ahead of the event I still need about 20g/hr of carbs to prevent going too low. Same with the running over longer distances.

Did a 106km audax on Sunday, no carbs for breakfast. Had a snickers, two 9-bars and a piece of cake at halfway, with a total riding time of 4h11 and elapsed about 4h55. Also had a piece of pork pie before driving home as BG was <5.0.

Next experiment in safe conditions might be to let the BG go low and then see if it self-recovers. It's all trial and error. I must admit I didn't find runsweet that much of a heal when you get out of the norm of the C25K, HM plans etc into the more serious stuff.

Are you planning to test during the event, or just set a strategy and go for it? Might be worth taking the time in training to do that periodic testing and develop the strategy, if you aren't already doing so.

 

[vxrich]

Gluneck, cant find anything to see how this works..please explain. Im guessing the necklace is filled with gluogel and you suck on the pendant to get some glucose?? Great idea if so, if not Im going to invent it!!