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Blood test shock-now what?

I

Ixchelcoventina

Member
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8
Am type 2 diabetic. After 3 years I finally got blood testing kit today. At docs blood glucose been between 5 and 6.9 taken in mornings. Hba1c was 54 and now 51 for last 6 months. Tonight at 8pm bg was 4.6 before meal. 1 hour later it was 10.2. Then 2hours after the meal of veg soup and half a bread bun bg was 11.4 :( that's the highest reading I ever had. How do I achieve lower bg levels? And how was I supposed to know I was spiking when denied monitor all these years?
 
Hi,
You won't have been spiking much over the year otherwise your HBA1c wouldn't have come down and, although it is in the diabetic range, it is at the lower end. It's probably a question of getting used to your meter. You may well be doing something wrong.

My meter manual says not to worry about the occasional reading of 11. My nurse only when they are 15s and 16s should I get I touch. Having got your meter, you will learn that some foods do spike you. I am mostly 5s, 6s and 7s but if I had a white bread bun, I'd be in the 10s after 2 hours. If I have a wholegrain rye roll, I'd be in the high 7s. Boiled potatoes are not too bad for me, mashed potatoes, well I may as well enjoy a Mars bar. White rice bad, brown rice good. Your overall diet must have been good for your HBA1c to fall. You can use your meter to now fine tune the diet and get it even lower.

I must say I am envious of your 4.6. I only ever had one reading in the 4s and that was so long ago I think I must have dreamt it.
 
Thank you for getting back to me. Well today has been interesting. 3 days into blood glucose testing and finding a possible pattern. Pre-meal range 4.6 -5.8 before every meal.'normal'. 1 hour post meal range 8.7-12.7. 'diabetic' 2 hour post meal range 7.9 - 11.4 'diabetic' EXCEPT tonight. Pre-dinner 5.4. 1 hr later 6.2. Two hours after meal 6.2 four hours after meal 5.9. So what did I have in every other meal except the last one? ESP the higher spikes? Wheat flour . Porridge cause raise to 8.-7-9.3. Too soon yet to declare definitive results but very interesting. I now suspect bg been spiking for years hence 'non-diabetic or igt' with bloods at docs and hba1c results diagnosing diabetes. I do know I am new to the forum and testing and so much to learn.
 
And the hba1c drop from 54-51mm was-I think- because I stopped taking simvastatin 40g given to me years before diabetes diagnosis. I stopped after reading many studies since 2000 that showed that for significant numbers of people, that statin at that dose precipitates some people into type 2. Definitely affects bg levels I made no other lifestyle changes at all for 4 months between tests. Your 5,6 and 7 levels are a credit to you :)
 
Well I still get the odd funny result and the reason is, my insulin ain't what it used to be :-)

Even normally healthy people spike with foods. If you charted the levels every 15 mins after eating you'd get an interesting curve with a sharp rise within 30 mins to 45 mins, depending on foodstuff. For the healthy person, the decrease is much more rapid as the insulin responds and by two hours after the meal, they are usually near the start level, or certainly within a safe level. Type 2s are much slower at reducing the spike. There are several posible causes, ineffective insulin, low levels of insulin, resistance to what insulin is produced so the best way to speed up the reduction in BG levels is to speed up the insulin response. Diet and exercise improve insulin sensitivity effectively, more effectively than some of the drugs, so you are making better use of what you are producing.

I was very interested in your comments on simvastatin. I have asked the GP about this before diagnosis as I have suspected some side effects, but he is a pill pusher. I used to be on Atorvastatin, but I was moved onto simvastatin I suspect for economic reasons.
 
Ixchelcoventina said:
Porridge cause raise to 8.-7-9.3.
Click to expand...

Porridge is one of the most unpredictable foodstuffs on this forum. For me, it is slow release but gives a moderate spike which lasts and lasts and lasts. I went to a museum in Dumfries and Galloway a few months ago called 'The Devil's Porridge'. It was actually about cordite production but the name is an apt one, coined by Sir Arthur Conan Doyle I believe.
 
Looks like the devil's porridge is apt. Not eaten since 7.15am. It's now 2.10pm n bg is still 6.2. I now have another (daft) question. I thought feeling v hungry, bit nauseous,n dizzy n shaky meant my BG had dropped to a low. But I feel like that even though BG is 6.2. Are hunger and BG levels connected?
 
I find that BGs and hunger are not strictly connected, rather for me hunger was a signal that carb levels have been raised and are now dipping :cry: . Since moving to a low carb diet, I no longer have the hunger pangs I used to have on the NHS "carbs are needed" diet.
 
Thanks Fergus -that makes sense about the carbs related spike then drop. This effect was much worse and much quicker when I used to have white bread toast for breakfast.
Hi Yorksman. On statins studies - there are so many references - often in medical journals that need an interpreter for non-medics like me - but time and time again studies are showing that for some people e.g. post-menopausal women on 40mg or more of simvastatin for years, including those with no previous stroke or heart attacks, there IS an increased risk of type 2. The issue then is whether reducing cholesterol to the currently recommended low levels is healthy, necessary or desirable especially if the risk involves developing Type 2 diabetes and especially if there is a family history of Type 2.
See for example http://www.theheart.org/article/1338497.do
and
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/05/opinion/the-diabetes-dilemma-for-statin-users.html?_r=0
and
http://www.ctvnews.ca/health/statin-drugs-may-raise-type-2-diabetes-risk-health-canada-1.1127975

My point is that this risk has been known about since at least 2000. So why was I not told? Why was I not given a CHOICE about taking statins rather than them being pushed as a wonder drug for everyone? When I try asking various medics inc docs, nurses and a diabetic consultant about this risk, I have been told a) it's just an insignificant finding being bigged up so a researcher can get a name for themselves b) now you are diabetic you need to be on statins (er excuse me???? catch 22 or what?); c) I was told I am in denial about causing the diabetes myself (mmm blame game or what) and d) I was in denial about being diabetic!

It seems to me, in the end, that regardless of the merits or otherwise of statins (and I know many people are happy to take them and do benefit) I believe there is now over a decade of evidence, which is growing, that shows statins are not a benign drug for everyone. All I want is an open and balanced discussion but I have been made to feel like a pariah when I have even raised the idea that there is a more nuanced debate to be had so that I (shock horror) might have a sporting chance of making an informed decision about my health and well-being.
 
I should add that I was put on simvastatin 40mg over 6 years ago because cholesterol was 7.2 and at that time had no raised blood sugars. I was diagnosed as diabetic (on and off -medics couldn't agree if I was or not) 3 years ago.
 
Thanks for info on simvastatin. My triglycerides are too high and they've always assumed I drank too much, despite me telling them I don't drink much. I'm off for my bloods testing on Friday and I will be interested, now that I have been dieting, to see what they are. If the hdl, ldl and triglycerides are all ok, I will ask if I can have a lower dosage.

Blood glucose from eating foods is only one source. Your body puts it into your blood if it thinks you are either hungry or need some extra energy, because of work. An otherwise healthy human can not eat for days and the BGs don't keep going down. There are various stores, muscle, subcutaeous and visceral fats. Exercise improves insulin sensitivity but vigerous exercise can cause too much glucose to be added to the blood, at a faster rate than the insulin can mop it up, although it does it shortly after.

There is a lot going on with various triggers for the release of hormones and the production of enzymes. I started today with a 6 which spiked to a 10 after porridge and added bran , which is supposed to even it out but which obviously doesn't work for me, but after having rye bread for lunch I ended up 4.8 before tea, despite snacking on cherries and blackberries. I had three goes on the rower during the day, each session 4 mins - it's like walking up a steepish hill without a break. The spike went down to 6.4 within 30 mins of the first rowing session. Things are sort of half working, but more significantly, improving.

The researchers themselves are tryng to work out how all the metabolic processes work together. Take this conclusion of one study, "Plasma Glucose Levels Throughout the Day and HbA1c Interrelationships in Type 2 Diabetes":

CONCLUSIONS— These results suggest that
1) the majority of non–insulin-treated type 2 diabetic patients have exaggerated plasma/blood glucose excursions with meals, and many of them have higher-than-recommended glucose concentrations 2 h after the meals;

2) plasma/ blood glucose levels throughout the day are not as strongly interrelated as one might believe;

and

3) HbA1c is more related to preprandial than postprandial plasma/blood glucose levels. These findings have potential implications for treatment and monitoring of metabolic control in type 2 diabetes.


I have highlighted point 2 because you wrote, "Not eaten since 7.15am. It's now 2.10pm n bg is still 6.2." There are other processes which makes the body think that you require more energy. There is always more put in than you need. The problem that type 2 diabetics face is that the insulin produced doesn't regulate it effectively and it is usually too high.

"Where the hell has that come from?", referring to high BG levels, is a very common question for type 2s. Your liver giving you extra glucose is like the cat bringing in a dead rat because it is trying to be nice to you.
 
Hi - I read this post and thread wih interest. Being fairly recently described as Type 2 and also suffering from a number of other 'issues' such as High BP, overweight - the usual cocktail - I also suffer from a need to know more about everything that affects me!

I am trying to manage my type 2 without any meds! - Just diet.

Not being averse to needles and also having a reasonable supply of testing strips I set about finding out just exactly what I thought was happening. With many results as per the questions and answers above..............

OK - Low carb diet - I use a website called myfitnesspal to record my daily food intake - it has a comprehensive foods database and even allows you to scan in product barcodes for anything missing - it allows me to keep track for weight loss purposes - but also to tie in my carb intake and BG readings. Conclusion - less than 50g of carbs in a day gives me good readings following day!

Ideally very low carb meal for evening (before 8pm) keeps me around low 5s in the morning - if I dont eat in the evening then liver dump gets me to around 7's.

Exercise - if I have BG reading of less than 5.2 and then exercise I can expect my liver to kick in and add stuff - after exercise (jogging for 30 minutes say) then I will have BG around 7 or 8 unless I take some carbs first - I use low carb protein shakes.

Bread - if I go near bread my BG goes up and stays up. Same with just about any wheat product!

(Vodka and Diet Coke keeps everything nice and low by the way).

Drugs - I discovered that the 'water tablets' I was prescribed for high BP predispose towards diabetes and gout! - again it appears to be a convenient and cheap prescription with 'known' side effects - just that they werent well described to me!

Its certainly a journey of discovery and whilst accepting I am Type 2 - I dont plan on letting it rest there.

My goal is to lose 50lbs weight this year with diet and exercise and see how that affects everything!! ( I weig 250 just now at 6ft tall)

Cioa for now - Robin
 
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