Can't get below 8.3 mmol on waking pre-breakfast - HELP Do I need Medication?

[beatdise]

Hi Guys Type 2 I think. Still a newby and getting a bit worried now. Ok its only 5 days since diagnosis but I have been doing my stuff, changed diet and more exercise but cant get the numbers down. Doc has suggested diet and exercise but I am worried about damage in the meantime without medication. All my readings are given below since I bought my accuchek meter last week;

hbac1 12.0 and two weeks later 12.3
first meter test;
24/10 10.22 15.6mmol i hour after brekkie XXX
24/10 15.58 10.7 mmol 2 hours after lunch
24/10 18.15 10.4 mmol before dinner
25/10 08.37 8.3 mmol before brekkie
25/10 11.19 11.9 mmol 3 hours after breakfast XXX
25/10 15.55 8.4 mmol no lunch
25/10 21.01 17.00 mmol 2 hours after dinner XXX
26/10 00.23 13.9 mmol before sleep XXX
26/10 07.37 8.5 mmol before brekkie
26/10 09.04 11.2 mmol 1 hour after breakfast XXX
26/10 10.04 7.4 mmol 2 hours after breakfast and 37 minute walk **
26/10 12.51 7.2 mmol before lunch
26/10 17.02 12.2 mmol 2 hours after lunch
26/10 18.22 10.8 mmol 3 hours after lunch
26/10 10.4 mmol no dinner before sleep
27/10 7.25 before breakfast 8.3 mmol
27/10 9.28 6.9 mmol 1 hour after breakfast and 40 minute walk **
27/10 10.52 10.7 mmol 2 hours after breakfast reading
27/10 13.01 7.3 mmol before lunch
27/10 14.25 10.6 mmol 1 hour 24 minutes after lunch

So clearly not great and haven't worked up a pattern for testing yet. Have been changing diet reducing brown breads, flat breads. I must need medication what do you think. No sugar No cakes, no biscuits, no potatoes.

 

[Bluetit1802]

I can't comment on whether you need medication or not, but those after meal numbers might indicate something wrong with your diet.

Do you keep a food diary? Initially this is very important so you can look back and see which meals are causing the problems and adjust them as needed.
.
For example. What did you have for lunch on Sunday 26th? You started at 7.2 then had a massive spike of 5mmol'ls at 2 hours and it was still high at 3 hours. This has to be down to what you ate. An ideal rise is under 2mmol/l. What exactly did you have to eat and drink (including portion size)?

 

[Ruth B]

I will second what Bluetit has said, you need to look at what you are eating to give those types of spikes.

I would suggest as well as recording the BS levels you record what you eat for each meal as well (and any snacks you might have in between) either on a piece of paper of on a computer, which ever you are happier with.

You should be looking for a rise of no more that 2-2.5 mmol 2 hours after eating, but you also might want to test at 1 hour and 3 hours after eating sometimes to check when you have your maximum spike. Once you know that something doesn't give too high a spike then you can relax on testing that food a bit, just do it occasionally to make sure that your portion size isn't creeping up.

There is plenty of advise and suggestions for meals on the forum, have a look around and take inspiration from them.

 

[Brunneria]

I'm thirding the suggestions about posting your food choices, portion sizes, etc.
You may be surprised at the hidden carbs.
(Don't worry, we are all veterans at the Hidden Carb Hunt - because we've made all the mistakes already!)

But there's one thing I do want to reassure you on - this is a long game.
I know you want your blood glucose to go down as soon as possible.
And you are probably still in shock, and very worried that your BG levels are too high.
I completely understand.

But you've only had your BG meter a few days, and it is already telling you very useful things:

• Your morning readings are already dropping
• The exercise seems to help A LOT
• Your overall levels dropped across the three days.

All of those are really positive!

One of the most useful things that a member here (@AndBreathe ) sometimes says, is that we should only change 1 thing at a time. How else can we know which of the things we are trying, is working?

So, now you know that exercise helps you, I should keep it up. Fairly constantly (but we live in the real world, so life may intrude occasionally!)

And now you've settled that, and are reaping the benefits, I should have a look at the food suggestions mentioned by @Bluetit1802 and @Ruth B

You can always go back and tweak the exercise later, when you've made some quick wins with the food.

 

[beatdise]

Thanks guys VERY MUCH Bluetit1802, Bruneria and Ruth B I must admit I do want my levels to fall quickly. I know exactly where the big spikes were but its the jumps to 10's I've not worked out yet. Anyway meeting my diabetic Nurse tomorrow to actually discuss my blood results and agree a programme of action. Sorry for late reply had a posh dinner at BT Tower revolving restuarant food was remarkably light and avoided bread rolls and pototos, salmon was great.. One and half hour later I'm at 10.2. I can live with that for now

 

[AndBreathe]

Thanks guys VERY MUCH Bluetit1802, Bruneria and Ruth B I must admit I do want my levels to fall quickly. I know exactly where the big spikes were but its the jumps to 10's I've not worked out yet. Anyway meeting my diabetic Nurse tomorrow to actually discuss my blood results and agree a programme of action. Sorry for late reply had a posh dinner at BT Tower revolving restuarant food was remarkably light and avoided bread rolls and pototos, salmon was great.. One and half hour later I'm at 10.2. I can live with that for now

Beatdise - I don't really have anything to add to what has already been said, except to urge you to be patient. It's better that you take conscious action and understand it, than adopt a scatter-gun approach and not understand why things are or aren't improving. Whilst most of us find reducing carbohydrate is key to our control, I think most will agree that not all carbohydrate is equal. So, understanding what happens with a range of your routinely eaten foods will be key.

Once the shock subsides, I'm sure with your proactive approach you'll get the hang of things.

 

[Omnipod]

Maybe you should have a discussion with your DR and start using a basal rate (background) Insulin.
Something like Tressiba which is peakless and lasts 24 hours.

 

[AndBreathe]

Maybe you should have a discussion with your DR and start using a basal rate (background) Insulin.
Something like Tressiba which is peakless and lasts 24 hours.

Isn't that a bit extreme for someone less than 7 days into a T2 diagnosis? Many of us have found we can make a step change in our blood scores by taking our diet in hand and perhaps even moving around a bit more.

In my experience, and it mirrors that of many other T2s, the fasting score is the last to come into line, because of the body's desire to keep itself in it's historic comfort zone, which includes higher blood scores. It usually does moderate, but it also usually takes longer than just a few days.

 

[Ruth B]

Beware of your nurse telling you not to test and to eat carbs with each meal, this seems to be the standard advise and doesn't work for most of us.

 

[beatdise]

Thanks for your suggestions and words of wisdom. This morning YiPEE 6.9. Although after my walk went uo to 8.00 but encouraging direction of travel. I REALLY want get there without med if i can. Symptoms are just stingy eyes when blood sugar spikes. Got a tingling in my left leg but thats been there for last 6 years seems worse when bs is up. Still play 5 a side footy once a week. No loo problem at all. BIG thanks AGAIN. Morning walk is helping definitely.

 

[spendercat]

It usually takes 3/6 months to really get the BS levels down into the normal range, with careful carb control. At first your liver cant quite believe how kind you are being to it and just keeps pumping the glucose out. Then it gets the idea.
Some people just cant control their diet strictly enough, and need help, usually a slow release metformin to begin with. No shame there, the way we eat is very much part of who we are and how we live, eating habits can be phenomenally hard to change.
Yet I have high 5.8 hBaic on diet alone, and my mild retinopathy has reversed, and I started out with worse numbers than you. So it can be done. Go for it, and if the doctor wants to put you straight onto metformin ask him to give you three months on diet alone.

 

[beatdise]

It usually takes 3/6 months to really get the BS levels down into the normal range, with careful carb control. At first your liver cant quite believe how kind you are being to it and just keeps pumping the glucose out. Then it gets the idea.
Some people just cant control their diet strictly enough, and need help, usually a slow release metformin to begin with. No shame there, the way we eat is very much part of who we are and how we live, eating habits can be phenomenally hard to change.
Yet I have high 5.8 hBaic on diet alone, and my mild retinopathy has reversed, and I started out with worse numbers than you. So it can be done. Go for it, and if the doctor wants to put you straight onto metformin ask him to give you three months on diet alone.

Thanks Spendercat. Of course you are absolutely right the system is clearly still on autopilot. My numbers for the last two days have been better and my DN who I met Tuesday put me on Metformin 500mg 1 per day. I have done a thread today of my first 7 days and my numbers are down today to as low as 6.2 after breakfast and 6.4 two hours after lunch. Daily walking and a radical change to my diet have already had a dramatic impact. I am now CONFIDENT that I can gain control. I'm ok about the changes to my diet, because already I am feeling fresher and more energised most of the time, although I do have the odd low. The sweetness of feeling great outweighs the sweetness of my love for fizzy drinks, chips, biscuits. roast potatoes and I am losing weight and feeling comfortable in my clothes like I did in my 20's when I was the Cntre of the Universe!! Thanks again!