Disgusting

wiflib said:

Have you both kept it off?

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Well I kept it off till being put on steroids long term for my Mg ending up at 18 and a half stone, he put some back on over the years since then but seeing he was 28 stone to start with it's not surprising, funnily enough we are both T2 now .

I am now ten stone in remission, and since I convinced him that low carb was the way to go he has started losing weight again.

For quite some time he tried the Rosemary Conley low fat diet which did not do him much good to be honest did not lose much weight and still ended up on insulin.

My 4 meals per day are Lean Cuisine SIZE but made at home.

Kristin251 said:

My 4 meals per day are Lean Cuisine SIZE but made at home.

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Slightly off-topic, but in my local drugstore here in America (CVS chain) I recently noticed one aisle that was sign-posted as "Diabetes Supplies." I wandered down that aisle from one end to the other and could not see anything that seemed pertinent. I was expecting over-the-counter meds, or BG meters, or something.

Then I noticed that about one third of the shelving was devoted to what we call here "candy." Basically, myriad chocolate bars or granola bars of one kind or another, all labeled "low sugar" in one way or another.

I am so glad to know that I can eat unlimited quantities of candy, as long as it is purchased from the "Diabetes Supplies" aisle.

Grateful said:

Slightly off-topic, but in my local drugstore here in America (CVS chain) I recently noticed one aisle that was sign-posted as "Diabetes Supplies." I wandered down that aisle from one end to the other and could not see anything that seemed pertinent. I was expecting over-the-counter-meds, or BG meters, or something.

Then I noticed that about one third of the shelving was devoted to what we call here "candy." Basically, myriad chocolate bars or granola bars of one kind or another, all labeled "low sugar" in one way or another.

I am so glad to know that I can eat unlimited quantities of candy, as long as they are purchased from the "Diabetes Supplies" aisle.

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Here in the UK the one thing that Diabetes.Org.UK and the NHS have got right (IMHO) is to advise people to stay well away from anything that is labelled as diabetes specific. In fact I had thought it had all been banned.

This industry would go bust if their products belped people to be healthy but I think that it is the lack of good nutritional science that allows them to promote processed food devoid of fibre and high in sugar or inflamatory ouls, as healthy. May the backlash continue!

bulkbiker said:

Here in the UK the one thing that Diabetes.Org.UK and the NHS have got right (IMHO) is to advise people to stay well away from anything that is labelled as diabetes specific. In fact I had thought it had all been banned.

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Sounds very sensible. In a way it's a pity though. If there were a proper scientific consensus based on confirmed alimentary science (and enforced by sensible regulation), it would help people a lot if they could know that certain relatively "processed" foods (such as those non-grain breads at Tesco?) were safe for T2 diabetics.

I am thinking about those (most of us) who, at diagnosis, ask that basic question: "What am I going to eat now?"

Obviously, in the opinion of many of us, that answer comes through self-education and doing a lot of home preparation from fresh ingredients. But it would be nice if at least some pre-prepared diabetes-friendly stuff were sensibly produced, accurately labeled and easily available in the supermarket or drugstore!

I am so naïve, huh?

Grateful said:

I am so naïve, huh?

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Not really naive but.... what would you say was "diabetes friendly"
For me following a ketogenic way of eating I'd go for no carb.
For someone following a severe calorie restriction it would have to be zero calories or close to.
For someone else it could be moderate to low carb..
Therein lies the problem.

bulkbiker said:

Not really naive but.... what would you say was "diabetes friendly"
For me following a ketogenic way of eating I'd go for no carb.
For someone following a severe calorie restriction it would have to be zero calories or close to.
For someone else it could be moderate to low carb..
Therein lies the problem.

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Yes I thought of that. But I am also thinking about the legions of clueless out there. Nearly all of us fit that category, at diagnosis-time -- I did! Having to do it all on you own is (at least initially) a huge challenge for many.

Even an officially "approved" low-carb processed food would probably be out-of-bounds for your keto lifestyle (and mine too, mostly). But still much better than nothing, for many people, methinks.

It is a complex illness and hard to envisage a "one size fits all" solution. Having said that, for those whose T2 can be treated with diet as the first line of defense, there does seem to be a fairly clear rudimentary "path" that many could try, as a first approximation.

A set of really simple rules: Avoid These Foods. Eat Only A Small Quantity of These Others. Take More Exercise. It could include: If You Don't Have Enough Time To Cook At Home, consider buying stuff from the Diabetic aisle in the supermarket. I think this could fit on a double-sided A4 sheet.

My vague impression is that this must have been roughly what diabetes care was like in the early 20th century just before the introduction of insulin therapy. Those "diabetic cookbooks" were full of "forbidden foods" and "permitted foods." Sometimes I think many of us would benefit from such an approach today.

My thoughts are based in part on seeing the experiments done by many newbies, and veterans, on this forum. Is this food OK? That food? It is a general no-no, or does it vary between people? (And, "should I self-test," but that's for another thread.) Great stuff, but it is equally important to "just get on with it" and "keep it up, over time."

Grateful said:

Slightly off-topic, but in my local drugstore here in America (CVS chain) I recently noticed one aisle that was sign-posted as "Diabetes Supplies." I wandered down that aisle from one end to the other and could not see anything that seemed pertinent. I was expecting over-the-counter meds, or BG meters, or something.

Then I noticed that about one third of the shelving was devoted to what we call here "candy." Basically, myriad chocolate bars or granola bars of one kind or another, all labeled "low sugar" in one way or another.

I am so glad to know that I can eat unlimited quantities of candy, as long as it is purchased from the "Diabetes Supplies" aisle.

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I’m in the US. CVS galore.

My dad is type two and eats all sugar free things. Like hard candy. Tons of sugar alcohols and he wonders why his stomach hurts. And let’s nit forget about the I CANT BELIEVE ITS NOT BUTTER. YUK.

I’ve explained until I’m blue in the face. Now I just drop it.

Kristin251 said:

I’m in the US. CVS galore.

My dad is type two and eats all sugar free things. Like hard candy. Tons of sugar alcohols and he wonders why his stomach hurts. And let’s nit forget about the I CANT BELIEVE ITS NOT BUTTER. YUK.

I’ve explained until I’m blue in the face. Now I just drop it.

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Let's imagine for a moment that the "Diabetes Supplies" were actually based on proper science (yes, I know, "dream on"). Don't you think that this would help people such as your dad, who are looking for food with a "safe" label?

I think, in the abstract, the labels are a good idea. Without the labels, I would have no idea what I am buying, in the supermarket or elsewhere, particularly with processed foods that I do sometimes buy (frozen meatballs and celeriac spaghetti, with jars of supermarket sauce, is great for a quick meal). Unfortunately, if the labels are **** or downright untruthful (those "Diabetes Supplies" at CVS) most people are going to be conned.

Grateful said:

Let's imagine for a moment that the "Diabetes Supplies" were actually based on proper science (yes, I know, "dream on"). Don't you think that this would help people such as your dad, who are looking for food with a "safe" label?

I think, in the abstract, the labels are a good idea. Without the labels, I would have no idea what I am buying, in the supermarket or elsewhere, particularly with processed foods that I do sometimes buy (frozen meatballs and celeriac spaghetti, with jars of supermarket sauce, is great for a quick meal). Unfortunately, if the labels are **** or downright untruthful (those "Diabetes Supplies" at CVS) most people are going to be conned.

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Absolutely!! It’s like eating at restaurant. No idea what’s in things. I recently found out a restaurant we frequent puts gluten in their guacamole! Are you kidding?
My dad also east’s, bread, rolls, ice cream, chips lol. He’s 86 and type 2 and very sick. I’m not going to push diet anymore. He likes his food more than his health as loads of people do. Shame isn’t it?

Kristin251 said:

He’s 86 and type 2 and very sick. I’m not going to push diet anymore. He likes his food more than his health as loads of people do. Shame isn’t it?

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One of the equations in the standard treatment of diabetes is, how long is the person expected to live? If the answer is, perhaps, not extremely long then I think the standard medical advice that the T2 treatment should be milder than it would be for a young, healthy person makes sense. For that matter, if I got very sick in my 80s or 90s I am not sure I would place any priority on managing BG. But that's just me!

I have a number of elderly relatives who are quite ill and it is always emotionally difficult for me if/when they don't follow medical advice, but they have reached extreme old age and a daredevil attitude seems to come with the territory in some cases. We all make our own decisions.

I never buy foods that are labeled diabetic or diabetic friendly because they never are..

I still marvel at the 'wonder' called slimfast.
I hope their formulae have changed since the 90's. I looked on the back of the thing and the first ingredient was sugar.

When you factor in the sugar, sweeteners, seed oils, stabilisers, emulsifiers, preservatives etc etc etc you come to realise that the stuff that I call 'Orange food in orange boxes' is so far removed from a real food diet as to be unrecognisable. Give me a diet filled with stuff that doesn't require a degree in chemical engineering to decipher any day.

Check out That Sugar Film on Anazon Prime. Very entertaining documentary in which the star takes in the equivalent of 40 tsp sugar (the Aussie average) a day in the form of processed food ( no sweets or fizzy drinks) and gains lots of weight plus a fatty liver. A shocker!