dsn appt - cgm readings... more confused now than prior

grantg

Well-Known Member
Messages
222
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
needles, bloods sampling, infact most medical stuff which usually result in panic/anxienty attacks,hyperventalating etc :< also dislike medevil torturists aka dentists :O
Just been told I've apparently have very good bg control, in fact too tight? never would i thought a diabetic specialist complain about that. Nor would I of thought that a diabetic specialist nurse would complain about estimated hb1ac 42mmol/mol (84 of 90 days data). I'm apparently in some sort of honeymoon phase according to them.

Last appt was told between 4 and 10 is good, the lower the better. Goto sleep around 5-6mmols if flat graph should be fine, that was in response to if my BG was under 5 i tended to grab a biscuit or something and was told shouldn't worry. Suddently 4 weeks on, the SAME DSN thinks thats too risky for hypo eh? now given target 7-10 before bed and 4-7 daytime hours is that normal? I asked if i should just eat a sandwhich or small bowl cereal or something before bed to be given reponse, you shouldn't chase your insulin with food, how else supposed to goto bed higher?

The flat graph inbetween food/exercise was after changing toujeo dose down several weeks ago. I really dont understand the logic if flat graphs are good then why would they want me to reduce the long acting even further?

Maths its just as well i'm ok :) was a nice and easy 1:10 ratio now been asked to try 1:12 ratio but not to round up or down. I've asked for half dose pen to be able to do that better was given what i perceive as a negative response just eat a little more or less to get the 'correct ratio'. I was rounding up or down for the 1:10 ratio.

I'm not keen on changing the long acting dose at all to me a flat graph (+/- 0.2) makes much more sense than what i presume would be a slow rise from not enough basal.

I do agree with insulin ratio changed but the max carbs i have for breakfast is 41 if hungry most of the time its 26g carbs + whatever is in the the milk with my hazlenut latte.

With the 1:12 ratio 26/12 = 2.16 units not supposed to round up/down ? ok so need make it to 36g for 3 units (or remove 2g of carbs from the 2 wheatabix how much of a wheatabix biscuit to remove urgh).

They are apparently sending me some new 'sick day rules' via email alongside some "exercise guidelines" for what to do with fast acting insulin, i was informed before if swimming an 'hour or so so after food' reduce novarapid by 1-2 units if it was a planned swim, now told if planned reduce somewhere between 25-50% apparently i'll work out the right amount. The nurse then proceeded to talk about proespect changing to insulin pump after another 3 months after some 'education course' that they are going to sign me up on to make it easier? I was if unplanned just eating some fast acting carbs which seemed to work well what is wrong with continuing to do just that I have no idea. 25-50% less fast acting insulin considering luch between 26 and 40max would be very difficult to acheive without a pen which can do half unit measurements.

CGM readings have been recently a couple of MMOL's out vs finger pricks (taking 10 minute lag into consideration). Why would a DSN write off possible compression lows and suddenly panic control is too tight based on CGM readings that appear to be consistantly reading 20%+ lower than the fingerprick results?

Not happy with todays appointment I was always taught if something isn't broken don't fix it!
 

searley

Well-Known Member
Retired Moderator
Messages
2,239
Type of diabetes
Type 1
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Pump
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Diabetes, not having Jaffa Cake
With type1 and LADA yes a honeymoon period will make things easier as there is more leeway in both directions with the insulin dose, once your own production totally ceases it does become more difficult if you are LADA (older age T1) ie not mid teens or younger then the body can produce insulin much longer going into several years

As for low hba1c I have had the GP text me after a test which was 46 and say I was flying close to the sun.. if you have a low hba1c then there is a good chance of hypos
 

carolm

Active Member
Messages
29
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Just been told I've apparently have very good bg control, in fact too tight? never would i thought a diabetic specialist complain about that. Nor would I of thought that a diabetic specialist nurse would complain about estimated hb1ac 42mmol/mol (84 of 90 days data). I'm apparently in some sort of honeymoon phase according to them.

Last appt was told between 4 and 10 is good, the lower the better. Goto sleep around 5-6mmols if flat graph should be fine, that was in response to if my BG was under 5 i tended to grab a biscuit or something and was told shouldn't worry. Suddently 4 weeks on, the SAME DSN thinks thats too risky for hypo eh? now given target 7-10 before bed and 4-7 daytime hours is that normal? I asked if i should just eat a sandwhich or small bowl cereal or something before bed to be given reponse, you shouldn't chase your insulin with food, how else supposed to goto bed higher?

The flat graph inbetween food/exercise was after changing toujeo dose down several weeks ago. I really dont understand the logic if flat graphs are good then why would they want me to reduce the long acting even further?

Maths its just as well i'm ok :) was a nice and easy 1:10 ratio now been asked to try 1:12 ratio but not to round up or down. I've asked for half dose pen to be able to do that better was given what i perceive as a negative response just eat a little more or less to get the 'correct ratio'. I was rounding up or down for the 1:10 ratio.

I'm not keen on changing the long acting dose at all to me a flat graph (+/- 0.2) makes much more sense than what i presume would be a slow rise from not enough basal.

I do agree with insulin ratio changed but the max carbs i have for breakfast is 41 if hungry most of the time its 26g carbs + whatever is in the the milk with my hazlenut latte.

With the 1:12 ratio 26/12 = 2.16 units not supposed to round up/down ? ok so need make it to 36g for 3 units (or remove 2g of carbs from the 2 wheatabix how much of a wheatabix biscuit to remove urgh).

They are apparently sending me some new 'sick day rules' via email alongside some "exercise guidelines" for what to do with fast acting insulin, i was informed before if swimming an 'hour or so so after food' reduce novarapid by 1-2 units if it was a planned swim, now told if planned reduce somewhere between 25-50% apparently i'll work out the right amount. The nurse then proceeded to talk about proespect changing to insulin pump after another 3 months after some 'education course' that they are going to sign me up on to make it easier? I was if unplanned just eating some fast acting carbs which seemed to work well what is wrong with continuing to do just that I have no idea. 25-50% less fast acting insulin considering luch between 26 and 40max would be very difficult to acheive without a pen which can do half unit measurements.

CGM readings have been recently a couple of MMOL's out vs finger pricks (taking 10 minute lag into consideration). Why would a DSN write off possible compression lows and suddenly panic control is too tight based on CGM readings that appear to be consistantly reading 20%+ lower than the fingerprick results?

Not happy with todays appointment I was always taught if something isn't broken don't fix it!
What is too tight?, you are keeping a good check on your readings being careful and sensible and you know your own body, not the nurse. I've felt hypoish below 5, weak, faint, grab biscuit, So I prefer 6ish. I have to move about a lot when I get up and I think i use my glucose from supper quickly. Good luck Carol
 
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WhippetyGirl

Member
Messages
22
Type of diabetes
Type 1
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Insulin
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Ipswich Town Football Club (also in my 'likes' - its a love/hate relationship), having diabetes, gastroparesis and bipolar, intolerance, the Daily Mail, social media (another love/hate thing), bigotry and hatred
All of these guidelines are straight from the DAFNE carb counting course ...
 
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grantg

Well-Known Member
Messages
222
Type of diabetes
Type 1
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Insulin
Dislikes
needles, bloods sampling, infact most medical stuff which usually result in panic/anxienty attacks,hyperventalating etc :< also dislike medevil torturists aka dentists :O
What is too tight?, you are keeping a good check on your readings being careful and sensible and you know your own body, not the nurse. I've felt hypoish below 5, weak, faint, grab biscuit, So I prefer 6ish. I have to move about a lot when I get up and I think i use my glucose from supper quickly. Good luck Carol

too tight was the phrase that the DSN used not entirely sure what they ment.

TIR: 96% Very High: 1% Low 3-3.8 3%

Glucose Stats: 5.5 mmol/L (Goal: ≤8.6 mmol/L)
Glucose Mangement Indicator Approx a1c level 5.7% (Goal: ≤7.0%) 39 mmol/mol (Goal: ≤53 mmol/mol)

Low Glucose Events 4 Duration 146 Mins every single time tested via fingerprick 4.2 was the minimal where cgm stated < 3.2. On average 20+% lower cgm than finger prick. another example 6.1 finger prick vs 3.2 cgm.

I've attached a couple of graphs.
 

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grantg

Well-Known Member
Messages
222
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
needles, bloods sampling, infact most medical stuff which usually result in panic/anxienty attacks,hyperventalating etc :< also dislike medevil torturists aka dentists :O

grantg

Well-Known Member
Messages
222
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
needles, bloods sampling, infact most medical stuff which usually result in panic/anxienty attacks,hyperventalating etc :< also dislike medevil torturists aka dentists :O
With type1 and LADA yes a honeymoon period will make things easier as there is more leeway in both directions with the insulin dose, once your own production totally ceases it does become more difficult if you are LADA (older age T1) ie not mid teens or younger then the body can produce insulin much longer going into several years

As for low hba1c I have had the GP text me after a test which was 46 and say I was flying close to the sun.. if you have a low hba1c then there is a good chance of hypos
almost 50 now so ye lada possibly... i'm still not sure if type1/type2 lol hospital notes state likely T1 a few days later notes said "potentially type2 due to metabolism continuing treating as type1", discharge notes said Type1, mydiabetesmyway states type1. Dr's surgery say they don't know but definately insulin dependant so would make little differece. There has not been any sucessful C-peptide tests: needlephobia getting in way and when it didn't Lipid's didn't allow some blood results. tri something or other 162 :O Consultant may try end of September. They've tried a couple of times to get the lipid profile test to no avail. still annoyed that when i pass out why the heck can't they then take! Have an appt next Thursday at Dr's surgery to attempt as local hospital has refused to try again. I'll require to travel for the c-peptide test and fast beforehand as local hospital is more like a general a&e anything remotely complicated they send people to mainland they don't have their own lab. C-Peptide was explained as a protein that breaks down quickly so that needs do be done at a hospital with own lab.
 

Tony337

Well-Known Member
Messages
877
Type of diabetes
Type 1
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
Not being on holiday....
Hi
I have not seen a DSN or specialist for years as they depress me.
DSN's in particular just adore quoting the rule book at you....well i have my own rule book and its called the 50 years experience book of how my body works........
Oh its a beautiful read full of mistakes and successes but i can't publish it as its only works for me.

My point to the OP is this.....

The NHS are terrified of hypos as they think you are stupid and going to end up with an ambulance and a stay in hospital.
The NHS think you need them to manage your own diabetes......
I'm lucky to have one of the best GP surgery in the country as per the CQC and the best chemist too.

The average BG for a non diabetic is 5.2 therefore i want mine to be 5.2 but i haven't got there yet as my last hba1c was 5.7 but i'm aiming for it.
My CGM and 4mm needles have made this achievable.

I wish you well

Tony
 
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