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ELIMINATOR

Eliminator

Well-Known Member
Messages
103
Location
Merseyside UK
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People who talk ***** and tell lies.
Hi to everyone,

I first joined this site around june 2008 since then have lost my details so have rejoined with a different name.

My story is this...

I was diagnosed with type2 in May 2008, a week later I tested my 13yr old son with my meter and he was off the scale at 38. something then we spend 2 days and nights in hospital with him. Neither of us ever suffered with any symptoms of diabetes, not had it ever been in the family.

I was told by my GP to go and see the practise nurse who happens to be the diabetes nurse at our practise, she also happens to be the heart nurse too.
Anyway, she said " you have type 2 diabetes so stops eathing sugery things and go on diet control for 3 months then come back" that was it. I did'nt know what diet control was so stopped sugar in drinks and changed to sweener and started eathing salad every day. ( I thought that was the healthy **** she wanted )

I joined this forum and was told all sorts of healthy things to eat ( I didn't like any of them ), I started to lose weight from 17.5 stone, I started loseing half a stone per WEEK. I was very worried about this and phoned my nurse, she told me over the phone to start taking metformin and left me a script at reception, I wend and collected it and got the tablets, After talking to a few people and reading the label on the tabs, I got the impression that metformin help you lose weight, so phoned the Docs again. I was told to just take them. So I did, then after a few weeks I was told to up them to 3 tabs a day then 4 a day. My bloods were still in the teen's and 20's, So I phoned to make a second appointment to see the nurse. She then phoned me back and said I don't need an appointment and should try taking Gliclizide as it works in a different way and should help get my bloods down. So I went and collected the script and started taking one of them per day for a couple of weeks, but my bloods were still very high, the only way I could get them down to a normal level was to starve thoughout the day and by teatime I would be normal. so I would eat then and maybe something before bed if I was hungry.
Another couple of weeks went by and I was at the doctors again and that is when I discovered I was supposed to still be taking the metformin & Gliclizide, but I wasnt told that in the begining and had stopped the metformin.

So for the next couple of months I stayed on 4 metformin and 1 gliclizide a day and had learned about what foods I could eat and things I should avoid, I decided to stop doing bloods all the time and ignore it for a while, do in my brain they would be at a normal level.

While all this is going on, we had to learn all about type 1 diabetes for my son, we were having 2 or 3 meeting a week, and learning loads of stuff and were getting confused with it all.

Then just before Christmas, we were at the monthly meeting for my son and the dietition specialist for childrens diabetes was giving a talk about type 1 kids and what they could have over Christmas. She said they should be treated as normal kids and if family normaly buy them selection boxes then they still shoud, and they were ok for them to eat provided they checked the bloods more often and used insulin if needed, also if they were allowed a small amount of alcohol as a treat with Christmas dinner, then that was fine to as Alcohol is not a fast acting sugar drink and will actualy help lower the blood count. Well my ears pricked up at this news and 30 mins later was in Asda buying myself 3 cases of lager ( as I had not drunk in years ) So over the Christmas and new year I would have a couple of cans per night and a bit of Chocolate ( as ya do ).

The other thing was just before Christmas I forgot to order my monthly script for medication, so phoned and got the script just before they closed for the holidays, but they forgot to put the gliclizide on the script, so I had to do without.

January and I thought I better start getting this sorted as I have never had my bloods in control since the day I was diagnosed. I phone the nurse and said I had just did my bloods and was 29.9
I did not have gliclizide over the holidays as it was not on my script, I was feeling very hot and I was worried, she told me it was all my fault for not telling them they forgot to perscribe it and I said they were shut by the time I had realised. She then said that I was the one with the disease and I should have sorted it out sooner. she did not say if there was anything I could do about the 29.9 she also said it was not worth me going to my appointment the following week as she did not have any hba1c results back, I told here that was due to the fact I had not been to get any blood taken over Christmas, she said that I should have and said she would see me in another 3 months.
It was only after I had put the phone down I realised that she had not given me the paperwork needed to get a blood test done anyway.

So 3 weeks ago, my son had his check up at the childrens hospital were they can do his hba1c in the machines they have in the clininc and you get the results in 5 mins. Me being a cheeky sod and after spotting they had 2 machines, asked if they could possibly do my hba1c, so they did. it came back at +14 She told me that is as high as the machine could go and my hba1c is very high, and printed out the result for me.

I phoned and managed to get a cancelation with my own nurse and I went and showed here my hba1c result and asked again could I have a test for type 1 as I am convinced I am the same as my son. But she again said no there is no such test. ( now when my son was first diagnosed he had bloods sent somewere on the south coast that proved he was type 1)
My nurse just told me to increase the gliclizide to 2 per day for 2 weeks and if no improvement take 3 per day.

I also asked if I could up the metformin and was told that 4 tabs per day is the max dose anyone is allowed, (but my sister in law and my mate both take 6 per day)

So I am now on 4 metformin = 2000mg & 3 Gliclazide = 90mg per day oh and another thing for cholesterol.

My normal random BM's are about the mid teens before meals, so still too high.

I had lost a lot of weight and stopped at 14 stone for a few months, but last night found I had lost another stone in the last couple of weeks, I was also T-cutting my car all monday afternoon then lost all power to my arm and the rest of my body, I had to sit down on the driveway for a couple of mins, then thought maybe this is my first ever "low" so went indoors and did a BM, it was 6.3 that was my lowest reading EVER.

My upper leg muscles have been hurting for the last 2 days and I am now getting up in the morning and it takes me 30 mins to wake up, I used to be up and ready to go in under 10mins.

So I still do not know were I stand with this diabetes type 2 or type 1 ?
I have lost a total of 4 stone now since may 2008 my energy and physical strengh have gone from very strong to less than half the strengh I used to have and burn out in half the time.
I have closed down my own business and moved into a council house.

The only thing I am actualy happy about in all of this is from the day I was diagnosed up until 3 weeks ago, I was convinced that I was only gona live around 12 months or have fingers or toes drop off. but I told my doctor about this worry 3 weeks ago, and he told me that even if that was going to happen it would be 15 to 20 years off, as nothing happens in 12 months.

Oh well I have lost the plot and drifted off the subject quite a lot now and my fingers hurt.

So does this sound like your story or would you say I was type 1 or type 2 ?

I would like to hear what anyone who has been through the same has to say.

thanks
Mark
 
Well, sounds like both you and your son have had a rough few months to get through.
You are right, there is a test that can help determine if you are Type 1 or Type 2. It is called a c-peptide test.They can also do a GAD test. Your DN sounds pretty useless to me, so I would ask for a referral to a diabetes specialist. You might have to fight to see one. I did but like you, I just wanted to know one way or the other and felt a real need to see a specialist. For me, it proved worthwhile. It turned out I was Type 1 (LADA), not Type 2, as diagnosed some years earlier.
I can't say you are definitely Type 1 or Type 2 but I totally understand you wanting to know, so if you have to become a pain in asking, asking, asking at your surgery, then do so.
Whoever told you drinking ANY sort of alchohol is okay is also wrong. Red wine, in moderation is okay, as far as I understand it but things like lager I think are high sugar.(I'm not a drinker myself but I'm sure others on here can verify that one.)
I feel the advice you have been given is pretty lousy really and I can imagine it's a double nightmare trying to cope with your son having diabetes too.
Please, please, pester for that referral. The sooner, the better.
All the best, chocoholic.
 
Thanks for the reply, I did ask my Doctor for a referral and was told no, I can't be reffered until we have tried all the tablet options first, I also asked could I see a different diabetes nurse and was told no as she was the only one that the surgery has.
I then asked them to explain to me this...

HBA1C if you have it every 3 months as thats how long your cells take to replenish, and you were going for a blood test on a monday morning, but at the weekend you stuffed ya face with chocolate, surely all your cells will have been poluted with the chocolate and show has a high hba1c ?

His answer was " I'm don't know how it works, but it does"
I asked the nurse the same question a few days later and she explained it a little better but not fully.

I know how it works and how they get there readings, but for the Doctor in charge of Diabetes in my own surgery not to know is pretty **** if you ask me.
 
Hi Mark and welcome back.

Eliminator said:
Anyway, she said " you have type 2 diabetes so stops eathing sugery things and go on diet control for 3 months then come back" that was it. I did'nt know what diet control was so stopped sugar in drinks and changed to sweener and started eathing salad every day. ( I thought that was the healthy **** she wanted )
Well, that's the standard advice - about as much use to a diabetic as a chocolate teapot.

Another couple of weeks went by and I was at the doctors again and that is when I discovered I was supposed to still be taking the metformin & Gliclizide, but I wasnt told that in the begining and had stopped the metformin.
The gliclazide would have a bigger impact on your BS than metformin. Gliclazide forces the pancreas to produce more insulin, whereas metformin reduces insulin resistance so helps the insulin to work more effectively.

Alcohol is not a fast acting sugar drink and will actualy help lower the blood count. Well my ears pricked up at this news and 30 mins later was in Asda buying myself 3 cases of lager ( as I had not drunk in years ) So over the Christmas and new year I would have a couple of cans per night and a bit of Chocolate ( as ya do ).
Not a good move unfortunately. Wine and spirits can reduce blood sugar, but beer and lager is very high in sugar. Pilsner lager is ok because all the sugar is fermented out, but that also makes it quite a bit stronger!

I phone the nurse and said I had just did my bloods and was 29.9. I did not have gliclizide over the holidays as it was not on my script, I was feeling very hot and I was worried, she told me it was all my fault for not telling them they forgot to perscribe it and I said they were shut by the time I had realised. She then said that I was the one with the disease and I should have sorted it out sooner.
Well, that's pretty typical - you do something wrong and its your fault, but when they do something wrong - it's still your fault. That's the NHS - the No-win Health Service.

Me being a cheeky sod and after spotting they had 2 machines, asked if they could possibly do my hba1c, so they did. it came back at +14 She told me that is as high as the machine could go and my hba1c is very high, and printed out the result for me.
That certainly is extremely high, more than double the safe limit.

I also asked if I could up the metformin and was told that 4 tabs per day is the max dose anyone is allowed, (but my sister in law and my mate both take 6 per day). So I am now on 4 metformin = 2000mg & 3 Gliclazide = 90mg per day oh and another thing for cholesterol.
The max dose for metformin is 3000mg, but doctors generally don't like to prescribe more than 2500mg.

I had lost a lot of weight and stopped at 14 stone for a few months, but last night found I had lost another stone in the last couple of weeks, I was also T-cutting my car all monday afternoon then lost all power to my arm and the rest of my body, I had to sit down on the driveway for a couple of mins, then thought maybe this is my first ever "low" so went indoors and did a BM, it was 6.3 that was my lowest reading EVER.
The weight loss is concerning, especially as you are on a very high dose of gliclazide, which is notorious for encouraging weight gain! What you seem to have experienced is and artificial hypo, which can happen where there has been a sudden drop in BS. Your BS was nowhere near true hypo level, but the symptoms feel the same.

My upper leg muscles have been hurting for the last 2 days and I am now getting up in the morning and it takes me 30 mins to wake up, I used to be up and ready to go in under 10mins.
This cholesterol med - wouldn't be simvastatin by any chance? Muscle pains, sometimes leading to complete muscle seizure, are a very common side effect of statin meds. The tiredness is more likely to be due to your high BS levels.

So I still do not know were I stand with this diabetes type 2 or type 1 ?
I have lost a total of 4 stone now since may 2008 my energy and physical strengh have gone from very strong to less than half the strengh I used to have and burn out in half the time.
Your weight loss, and the fact that even a very high dose of gliclazide is not helping, and even a starvation diet not bringing your BS down significantly, would all indicate that type 1 is a possibility. You need to get referred to a consultant diabetologist or endocrinologist. You have to ask your GP to arrange this, and he is not allowed to refuse your request. You cannot dictate exactly who you want to see and nor can he insist that you can see only the person he chooses, but you have the right to see a doctor competent to deal with your case. Clearly your own surgery are not competent, as they seem to be going out of their way to prove to you.
 
Hi Dennis,

Alcohol is not a fast acting sugar drink and will actualy help lower the blood count. Well my ears pricked up at this news and 30 mins later was in Asda buying myself 3 cases of lager ( as I had not drunk in years ) So over the Christmas and new year I would have a couple of cans per night and a bit of Chocolate ( as ya do ).

Not a good move unfortunately. Wine and spirits can reduce blood sugar, but beer and lager is very high in sugar. Pilsner lager is ok because all the sugar is fermented out, but that also makes it quite a bit stronger!

I think she meant larger contains sugar but the way it's made makes it slow releasing.

My upper leg muscles have been hurting for the last 2 days and I am now getting up in the morning and it takes me 30 mins to wake up, I used to be up and ready to go in under 10mins.

This cholesterol med - wouldn't be simvastatin by any chance? Muscle pains, sometimes leading to complete muscle seizure, are a very common side effect of statin meds. The tiredness is more likely to be due to your high BS levels.

They have given my LIPITOR (Atorvastatin)

I think if I was on 3000mg of metformin and 120mg of Gliclazide, that might just do the trick. that is what I am going to ask for in a couple of weeks, as my bloods are down from what they were a month ago, and I have had some high sugary foods in the last few weeks too. So a bit more effort from me and more meds might just work.
But on the other hand, I sometimes think that if I was on injections of insulin, it would be easier on my son if we were the same and I could also eat more of the things I want too and just novarapid if I overdid it. The downside of that is I would loose my HGV Licence and have more chance of going low.

I wish I knew more about diabetes, if I understood the basics of the way it worked, then surely there is an obvoius cure that has been overlooked for years that I could work out.

I am not the sort of person that thinks if 1000's of doctors round the world can't find it then neither can I, I am the sort of person that says they are looking at it the wrong way and I look the other way to find the result.

I know that last comment may sound stupid to some people reading and to others it may sound like I think I am some sort of bigheadded genius, but I am not. I am just a deep thinker and do find more solutions to problems than most people.

I have worked out 2 theories in the past one for cancer and one for heart attack and both of them turned out true. I just wish I had more experiance with diabetes.

Mark
 
Definitely want to wish you good luck with this, mate. Sounds like you've had a rough ride...
 
It might read bad, but I am sure there are people much worse then me and my son.

My son's hba1c last month was 13 so his is also high, but we have increased his novamix30 moring and night and his has come down a lot.

Mine will come down next time, I am sure of it, if not then I get the insulin. (or so I am led to belive)

The thing I want to know is, which is worse of the two evils...

1. Eating fatty foods with low carbs = getting heart related problems, but keeping bloods on target

or

2. Eating sugery foods = high BM's and god knows what

So, no other answers please which is the worst for you if (YOU HAD TO CHOOSE)


The reason I am asking out of cusiosity is if I wanted to gain weight to increase my physical strengh back to what it was, what option do you go for ?
 
I'd think 2 was worse. But then again I'd rather die of a heart attack than go blind or lose my feet.

But couldn't you avoid sugar and carbs and fat? eat chicken and fish and rabbit and venison or something. those are low fat meat I think (I'm vegitarian so I don't really remember). and vegtables. though not root vegtables.
 
Hi HLW, thanks for that but I don't eat fish and not many veg and most of the ones I do are root. lol

I think I have found something to eat and eat and eat that will fill me up and make me gain weight and stay sugar free at the same time...

































.. I just can't find a supermarket that will sell me an Elephant. :oops:
 
Do you eat meat though? You could make lean meat the main part of your diet I assume. Though be careful if it's just rabbit, you get deficent in the nutrients you need from fat. Don't know if you get the same problems with other lean meats.
 
Why not? You can even grow them yourself, they are cheap. And grow quick. Venison's nice too, or so I am told by people who eat meat. My aunt lives near a deer park you see. Knew someone who ran one over, and had a chest freezer, and knew how to butcher things. Not sure that was strictly legal though, I think you can only eat deer you find dead, not ones you run over yourself.

Chicken is low fat too I think? don't know about turkey? Anyway they are boring, if I could eat meat (I can't stand all the stringy and chewy and lumpy bits, they make me feel sick) I'd eat more fun and interesting things.
 
Hi, I just don't like the taste of cooked veg, although I must admit I have been trying different ones and have now started eating small amounts of cooked sprouts and colieflower. can't do cabbage or brocholi though.
And not many deer in the Liverpool area i'm afraid. So I will stick to the pork, chick and beef type meets.

I find it very difficult with foods as I do not like salt, vinegar, herbs, spices or sauces of any kind.
I will only eat plain foods and also eat them in order, like beans first then, sausage then bacon then egg. This means I would never have a combination of any two or more items on my fork at the same time.
It's just he way I have always eaten.
 
I have similar problems with foods, I'm really picky about texture of foods, it's why I can't eat meat. I don't like to mix them either. It can be a symptom of OCD, but you can also get it with dyspraxia (oversenstivity to touch, taste or smell can be a symptom of this) (and dyslexia too?) and autistic spectrum disorders.

It doesn't matter anyway, once you are no longer a child people don't tell you what to do, you can eat how you like!

Have you tried roasting veg? I prefer that to cooking it in eg a mircowave, I like it better when it's crispy. cabbage and broccoli are nasty whatever you do to them.
 
Hi Viv & HLW,

No it's not an eating disorder, I can eat anything I like in any way. I just prefer to taste foods for what they are and enjoy seperate flavours.

I have just come back from my mates and I have a veg curry, that was rare for me but I do try new foods, I still am not a great lover of veg and I do eat some.
 
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