For breakfast beforehand I ate 2 scrambled eggs, 2 rashers of bacon some mushrooms and a cup of tea with a splash of milk. Virtually no carbs in other words. I used 2 units of Humalog. My blood sugar was 4.2 when I left the house and 3.8 when I returned at lunchtime.
Medics often refer to the Krebs cycle which describes how foods are converted to energy in the body at a cellular level. Hans Krebs had assumed, as many people still do, that carbs are the main source of fuel for muscular energy. What he subsequently realised was that fat and protein also supply cellular energy and there was no reason to prefer carbs. I'm with him on that one.
Ally said:But generally for athletes this is what is used!
Ian's calc from Ally's figs - For a 12 st 76 Kg person
3-5 hours exercise / week - 4-5g CHO/kg 340 g carb per day
1-2 hours /day - 5-7 g/kg 450 g carb per day
mod to heavy 7-12 g /kg 760 g carb per day
IanD said:ally5555 said:Ian - that is for athletes - I said that because this topic asked the question - it wasnt really about diabetics.
How many athletes do only 3-5 hours exercise per week :?: That is the amount (at least 1/2 hour per day) we are advised as a minimum to keep active & help our BS control. But not if we need your recommended daily 340 g carb to sustain 3-5 hours exercise.
Ally said:actually Ian you are right - dont know any but it is only a guide that is quoted by many.
Thank you for that admission, Ally. Presumably "somebody" said it & thereafter "everybody" quotes it, & the more often it is quoted the more it is believed. Like the NHS/DUK diabetes diet based on starchy carbs, which you also reject.
I became crippled with neuropathy on 340 g carb daily for 5 hours exercise per week. I can achieve 5 hours per week very comfortably on about 100 g carb daily, with about 20 g extra on days when I do 3 hours exercise.
most of the athletes I work with come into the middle group but I do have some who are training for up to 8 hours a day - mix of strength and aerobic.Maybe, BUT
What is your advice based on your experience with diabetics? - you can use me as a typical patient.
Should I treble my carb intake? (Don't be afraid to say "Yes" if that is you honest professional opinion - I won't sue you for dangerous advice.)
If a 76 Kg 70 year old diabetic came to you seeking advice to stay active, would you quote those a/m recommendations? Or would you stay with what you suggested before of about 30 g carb per hour during exercise?
That would mean on the days I play 2-3 hours tennis, I should eat around 260 g carb. (Your basic 200 g recommendation + 60 g, though we could reasonably assume that your basic 200 g allows for normal activity including exercise & therefore may not need supplementing.)
However I am very fit on half that.
ally5555 said:Ian - the initial part of this thread was about athletes - and they are different to us mortals - they cannot compete without carbs. Cyclists who are competing in the Tour need refuelling during the race and they tend to use CHO drinks and gels and anything they can fit on their person!
Please now keep the discussion to diabetics keeping fit. That will be generally useful to us.
Now as far as diabetics who are just like me, exercise to keep fit it just takes some extra planning and testing. I dont tend to use those tables but look at the exercies and work around it. There is alot of trial and error around it Ian - it really is not a very exact science!
Ian - those figures are intended for athletes who train alot - many are doing 4-8 hours a day. I have worked with many who do that and just getting enough food in is really hard - they are constantly eating.
I have calculated & shown that those tables are not relevant to athletes who train a lot.
3-5 hours a week or 1-2 hours a day :!: That is just keeping fit, NOT training.
What we need to do here is not confuse the issue about athletes!
Do you endorse that table :?: I THINK IT IS DANGEROUS RUBBISH & WILL CAUSE TROUBLE FOR DIABETICS WHO FOLLOW IT.
It would be helpful to offer proper advice for the diabetic who wants to keep fit & active - like me. And who developed neuropathy using the carbs recommended for 3-5 hours per week.
Good hearted debate tho !
It would be helpful to offer proper advice for the diabetic who wants to keep fit & active - like me. And who developed neuropathy using the carbs recommended for 3-5 hours per week.
the initial part of this thread was about athletes - and they are different to us mortals - they cannot compete without carbs
chrisbel said:Hi everyone, I was the one who originally posted this thread, wow, seems to have really ran away and got heated in some places :shock:
Funny thing, no one actually answered my question at the time and now I have done the pre-grading there is more advice and contra-advice than you could shake a stick at and I am still none the wiser :?
I managed to fail my pre-grading but I'm pretty sure that it had nothing to do with carbs or lack of themand I did feel fine at the time
chrisbel said:Sort of answered my own question really, stayed with the low carbs and had a breakfast of sausage egg and bacon, took some brazil, pecan and almonds and drank plenty of water.
Did the pre-grading at 2 and came out hot, tired and very sweaty but with no ill affects my readings after 2hrs were 5.7
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