Expalin it to me like I'm a 5 year old.

[Guzzler]

"Reduce. Simply put, too much insulin sloshing about causes harm."
Hi Guzzler,
Thanks for the reply interesting video. there is a similar guy in the UK Dr Michael Mosley promoting exactly the same ideas with one additional aspect Insulins primary job is to supply the muscles with energy from the sugar in the blood.

As I understand it, you body turns every thing it can into sugar (especialy carbs) to use as energy of store as energy for later i.e. Fat. By activating these muscle groups they become more receptiveare more to the affects of insulin, siphoning of more energy even when not in use( because the body understands they will be used) thus putting less emphasis on covering excess sugar/energy into fat to be store for use later.
This in turn reduces the strain on your liver absorbing this energy and turning it into fat, allowing it to break down the bodys own fat supply for the normal day to day energy needs. Thus weight loss.

But I keep hearing that Insulin Resistance mean that the muscles have become resistant, through lack of use, So now that they are activated wouldn't it hold logically that: IF they are no no-longer insulin resistant and therefore increasing insulin production would convert more and more resources to the muscles. More effectively draining the fat from the Liver, as with Ketosis creating an essential artificial fasting state.

Then the only logical assumption as part of a balanced program of controlled carb intake and exercise this increased insulin sensitivity would mean as you said that it would not be sloshing about causing harm but the exact opposite.

SO you can see where I going round on circles on this one to much insulin is bad, so lower insulin but lowered insulin wont feed the muscles and improve the reduction of liver fat.

Or have I just completely got this one wrong??

Not wrong at all. As the need for insulin is lowered (with regard to LCHF and IF) the body, in time, becomes better at utilising it's energy resources and stored energy (as fat). As fatty liver can start to be addressed by the body sometimes within days of starting LCHF and fat around the pancreas is reduced (though this can take much longer) then it follows that stored glycogen in the muscles is used (when regular excercise of one's own preference is taken) with the affect of lowering IR in the muscles.
This sounds good on paper but there are caveats. Some people are more insulin resistant than others (my own personal theory on this is that it may be down to how early one is diagnosed but I have no proof of this).
It may take some people longer to mitigate IR in the liver specifically so that dumps are happening all over the shop etc etc

 

[There is no Spoon]

I'm currently having slightly evil thoughts regarding my GP's receptionist.

Yep to anyone reading this that isn't from the UK you have to make an appointment to be ill in the uk.
Ring Ring.
"Hello Dr Surgery."
"Hi can I make an appointment."
"Well I don't have any appointments till next month. You could try calling again tomorrow before 8:30 I should be able to give you an appointment them."
"how about we say I did and you just give me an appointment now."
"No I cant do that we need to save it for some one who is ill."
"Funny you should mention that, its such a coincidence that your not going to believe this but I'm feeling ill right now as it happens."
"whats wrong with you?"
"I'm sorry are you a trained physician"
"No."
"can I make an appointment to speak to a Doctor then?"
"Well I don't have anything free till next month, perhaps if you call back tomorrow before 8:30"

Sound familiar

 

[There is no Spoon]

Oh, and less of the cat killing patter, or else I'll set one of my humungous Maine Coons on you

Wow! That sound strangely racist.

 

[There is no Spoon]

Yep that's me and the good (I would say great) Dr.
If the follow up test was another HbA1c (the usual diagnostic) then you don't need to fast for it.
You say the results had gone from 8 to 5 but was that a finger prick test or a full blood draw?

Enough blood to satisfy a hungry Vampire.

 

[LooperCat]

I’d just lure all her cats to my house

 

[Honeyend]

I thought this was a pretty good explanation. Ignore they are flogging something.

 

[There is no Spoon]

Hi Guzzler
just wanted to say thanks for taking the time to respond and get back to me on this issue I appreciate it.
It seems like I was headed in the right direction, even a stopped clock tell the right time twice a day.

I have no idea what "HbA1c at dx 98 then 73 then 43 all in the space of four months on LCHF." But it sounds realy encouraging good for you man.

 

[There is no Spoon]

I’d just lure all her cats to my house

Just go to the supermarket and buy food like everyone else you skinflint.

 

[Guzzler]

Hi Guzzler
just wanted to say thanks for taking the time to respond and get back to me on this issue I appreciate it.
It seems like I was headed in the right direction, even a stopped clock tell the right time twice a day.

I have no idea what "HbA1c at dx 98 then 73 then 43 all in the space of four months on LCHF." But it sounds realy encouraging good for you man.

Ahem... I'm a lass! The HbA1c is the test they use to dx (diagnose, diagnosis) Diabetes. My result of 98 is was super high but four months later I had lowered that to 43 which is a fair result, I think. I did it all with the advice and support and knowledge I got here on this site. Oh, and changing my dietary habits may have had a slight impact, too.

 

[librarising]

Any way putting the homicidal impulses to one side for just now

Please reassure me you had no homicidal impulses,or I'm contacting my local constabulary.
It sounds more like you had felicidal impulses, which I can't condone, but if you took only one of the cat's nine lives, that seems less reportable.
Geoff

 

[There is no Spoon]

High insulin levels cause insulin resistance.
Insulin resistance causes high circulating insulin.
Vicious circle.

Low circulating insulin levels are desirable as this will improve insulin resistance, and will aid general health and weightloss. High insulin levels are inflammatory, damage the heart, and carry fat to the fat cells thus increasing weight.

The trick is to eat foods that trigger as little insulin response as possible.
Carbs and most fruit are the worst culprits for triggering high insulin response.

Hi blue, don't know you well enough to call you breast yet.

I posted a response with a little bit more detail some were on here to Guzzler about lowering IR ( see I already learned to use abbreviations) in muscle groups (no not Boys Own).
The abridged version: combined with LCHF/Keto type thingy I am trying to figure out if there is any validity to a low insulin response from food intake combined with reducing the IR in muscles which would force the liver to release/drain fat faster. Which seems to imply that I want to increase the amount of insulin I am producing as long as it its converting energy to be burned by the muscles

If you want to weigh in with an opinion I would be glad to hear it.

 

[gardengnome42]

Hi everyone, new here and I have a quick question that I don't seem to be getting I keep going round and round in circles.

Insulin Resistant so should I be trying to increase or reduce my insulin levels??

I was diagnosed Type 2 about 4 moths ago, and I know its more complex that this but what I heard is "your diabetic so you need to cut you sugar intake down or you will go blind and well cut of your feet"
So I stopped taking sugar and watched everything I ate cutting it down to about 5 grams (that I knew of) or less a day. In that short time I have gone from XXL to a medium. (one top was XXXL but we will blame poor manufacturing for that one).

The little fat diabetic nurse who told me that "yes Diabetic is reversible but thats not a very realistic aspiration" gave me some pamphlets and I'm sure said some other things but by then I had tuned her out. I had this mental picture of her inhaling a cream bun and chugging down a can of coke as she lectured me about weight loss. And her opening comment was still stuck in my craw "Welcome to the diabetics club" said with such cheerful glee that it did cross my mind to follow her home and kill her cat ;-)

Any way putting the homicidal impulses to one side for just now I went on line read what I could but I was a bit slow on the uptake it took till now for it to sink in the role carbs play.
There is just too much information to absorb at the beginning but I have a good understanding of the Liver and Pancreas how my body converts food in to sugar and how that sugar is used as energy or stored as fat. The roles of muscle activation through exercise, intermittent fasting, low carb and/or ketosis diets, stress, and sleep and how they all play a part. But the one thing I keep going round in circles on is:

Insulin Resistant so should I be trying to increase or reduce my insulin levels??

What is it about these smug, fat little nurses who patronisingly tell us that we are too fat that makes us want to kill them? one day somebody will

 

[Bluetit1802]

f you want to weigh in with an opinion I would be glad to hear it.

No opinion worth mentioning. Your theory has gone right over my head. My belief is when we have IR our poor pancreas keeps on producing more and more insulin to do the same job as a smaller amount would if there was no IR. This must put a big strain on the pancreas. Additionally, this high insulin is inflammatory and is thought to be a cause of heart problems in diabetics rather than high glucose, and certainly causes weight gain in most people. This vicious circle can continue for decades before the glucose levels reach the stage of T2 diagnosis, and is why many T2s are overweight when diagnosed.

 

[There is no Spoon]

No opinion worth mentioning. Your theory has gone right over my head. My belief is when we have IR our poor pancreas keeps on producing more and more insulin to do the same job as a smaller amount would if there was no IR. This must put a big strain on the pancreas. Additionally, this high insulin is inflammatory and is thought to be a cause of heart problems in diabetics rather than high glucose, and certainly causes weight gain in most people. This vicious circle can continue for decades before the glucose levels reach the stage of T2 diagnosis, and is why many T2s are overweight when diagnosed.

FIRST we call ourselves T2's groovy! "I'm a Terminator ya'll"

Sorry I didn't explain this idea clearly.
For anyone like me a couch potato, to much time binge watching on Game of Thrones, my body is full of muscle groups that are not doing anything while I'm sitting still.

This lack of activity means that when Insulin try to send energy to my muscles it can't because I am not using them and they call this Insulin Resistance. Thats like saying a light bulb is Electricity Resistant when its a bright sunny day and I haven't turned the light on.
So if I go for a mile walk it burns 100 calories thats nothing. But I have flipped the light switch in my leg muscles which allows Insulin to push energy from my blood sugar to them. Which means my body needs to break down fat cells (to replace the energy/sugar I have just sent to the muscles) for the boring day to day stuff that the body does like pumping blood and breathing.

Remember I have just used up 100 calories which can not be converted into Fat as its gone!
But the real benefit is when I eat next my body will send a little extra to the muscles because the light switch is still turned on, it stays on for the rest of the day. Which again lowers blood sugar and the liver has to break down Fat to run the body.

Think of it like an Ipod you press play when you go for a walk running down the battery so when you get home you plug it into the charger but still leave it on play it still charges up but at the same time its using up electricity (Fat) because its still playing.

I hope I am explaining this idea clearly Blue.
Here where the real benefits KICK IT UP a notch if I go swimming, for a mile it burns 300-500 calories. And I am using 2 muscle groups, arms and legs and lets not for get walking back and forth to the pool an other 200 calories. Walking and Swimming use different leg muscles so now I have turned on 3 light bulbs, which stay on for the whole day.

Think of a Christmas tree and all of the pretty little lights.
(relay wish I had though of this analogy at the beginning it would have saved a lot of typing)

So there you have it Blue thats the idea activate as many muscle groups as possible through exercise, just 10 to 15 minuets every day or second day will produce the same if not better results than going for a 5 mile walk every night.

Ultimately the end result, in as little as 3 short months, with a low carb diet the liver is drained of fat, muscles respond to insulin correctly and T2 is Terminated.

BUT I haven't got a clue I cobbled this idea together from a few different places, it seems to make sense.

 

[Guzzler]

Depends where you get the calories from, they are not all created equal. As for excercise, I cannot do it and yet my bg is at a better level and I am fat adapted so, fingers crossed, I may be a little less insulin resistant. Without an Insulin Assay there's no way of proving this but in the future if I am able to reintroduce a small amount of carbohydrate into my diet and maintain good bg levels this will be a great indicator.

 

[There is no Spoon]

Please reassure me you had no homicidal impulses,or I'm contacting my local constabulary.
It sounds more like you had felicidal impulses, which I can't condone, but if you took only one of the cat's nine lives, that seems less reportable.
Geoff

Snitches get Stitches.

 

[Bluetit1802]

@There is no Spoon You could always try your theory out on yourself. The results would be interesting.

 

[There is no Spoon]

Depends where you get the calories from, they are not all created equal. As for excercise, I cannot do it and yet my bg is at a better level and I am fat adapted so, fingers crossed, I may be a little less insulin resistant. Without an Insulin Assay there's no way of proving this but in the future if I am able to reintroduce a small amount of carbohydrate into my diet and maintain good bg levels this will be a great indicator.

I read this 3 times before I figured out what bg meant. Doh!
Remember I'm new hear, you cant assume I know what your talking about I only just figured out how to use the stalker button.

As for mistaking you for a dude in my defence the lighting in here is very bad.
It was the "Manners maketh man" quote which made me think of you as Colin Firth Mr Darcy, coming out of the lake, not Bridget Jones and that how you shall always be to me.

 

[Guzzler]

I read this 3 times before I figured out what bg meant. Doh!
Remember I'm new hear, you cant assume I know what your talking about I only just figured out how to use the stalker button.

As for mistaking you for a dude in my defence the lighting in here is very bad.
It was the "Manners maketh man" quote which made me think of you as Colin Firth Mr Darcy, coming out of the lake, not Bridget Jones and that how you shall always be to me.

Bridget Jones? I wish!

Sorry about the abbreviations, you may see some members refer to blood glucose as bs or bm but they all mean the same thing. There is a Thread in the Newly Diagnosed section of the forum that has most of the abbs explained.

 

[SueJB]

Hi everyone, new here and I have a quick question that I don't seem to be getting I keep going round and round in circles.

Insulin Resistant so should I be trying to increase or reduce my insulin levels??

I was diagnosed Type 2 about 4 moths ago, and I know its more complex that this but what I heard is "your diabetic so you need to cut you sugar intake down or you will go blind and well cut of your feet"
So I stopped taking sugar and watched everything I ate cutting it down to about 5 grams (that I knew of) or less a day. In that short time I have gone from XXL to a medium. (one top was XXXL but we will blame poor manufacturing for that one).

The little fat diabetic nurse who told me that "yes Diabetic is reversible but thats not a very realistic aspiration" gave me some pamphlets and I'm sure said some other things but by then I had tuned her out. I had this mental picture of her inhaling a cream bun and chugging down a can of coke as she lectured me about weight loss. And her opening comment was still stuck in my craw "Welcome to the diabetics club" said with such cheerful glee that it did cross my mind to follow her home and kill her cat ;-)

Any way putting the homicidal impulses to one side for just now I went on line read what I could but I was a bit slow on the uptake it took till now for it to sink in the role carbs play.
There is just too much information to absorb at the beginning but I have a good understanding of the Liver and Pancreas how my body converts food in to sugar and how that sugar is used as energy or stored as fat. The roles of muscle activation through exercise, intermittent fasting, low carb and/or ketosis diets, stress, and sleep and how they all play a part. But the one thing I keep going round in circles on is:

Insulin Resistant so should I be trying to increase or reduce my insulin levels??

Not all funny just the bit about the nurse. The weight loss is brilliant. Well done and keep at it