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<blockquote data-quote="Sean_Raymond" data-source="post: 2354392" data-attributes="member: 403497"><p>I will reply and trust you can link what I am discussing to your reply. </p><p></p><p>Consuming equal or less calories whilst being active is a pretty solid approach to maintaining/losing weight. I’ve had very good success with people doing this (with or without diabetes). Consuming equal or more energy than your metabolic needs but lowering a particular hormone isn't something I've seen (I have tried it personally and with others).</p><p> </p><p>A calories is a calorie concept changes after consuming food. Different foods have different thermagenic effects and it is easier to extract energy from some foods than others. Different foods have different effects on satiety and motivation to eat more. Calories in and out is not perfect and is only part of the reason a person may gain unhealthy weight but it is still at its heart the most plausible for me in many cases.</p><p></p><p>I do not find the idea that insulin resistance is the cause of weight gain - I'm more convinced at this point that it is more likely a consequence of it. I will change my mind if better research comes out showing otherwise. Yes, a role of Insulin is to signal to the body to stop fat breakdown and promote fat storage but it is a signal which the cell is not obliged to follow - insulin is important in energy metabolism but it is just one of the players involved in the burning or storing of energy. </p><p></p><p>Metabolic pathways for fat, carbohydrate and protein are different. I was not referring to the specific digestion or metabolism of them per se (chemical exchanges) but the way fat and carbohydrates are thought to compete for fuel selection. The Randall cycle proposes a theory that describes the flux between fatty acids and glucose for oxidation during fed/fasted states. It isn’t standard to teach it (or at least I wasn’t taught it).</p><p></p><p>I think the cycle can be used to put forward an argument that eating fat and carbs together will impair efficient metabolism of a substrate which may have implications for metabolic health but not that it is a reason for why people get fat (fat gets oxidised glucose energy gets stored). It does support the idea that eating fat separate to carbs would mean either one will be more efficiently metabolised. It does link onto the idea that dietary fat acutely impairs glucose metabolism. Fat and sugar together tend to be highly palatable too.</p><p></p><p>A big part of a nutritionists and dietitians role is to help people eat healthy and or to achieve a healthy/healthier weight so I am sorry if they were not much help, But I am sure they were interesting discussions. I am more than happy to discuss things with yourself if I feel able to.</p><p></p><p>Sweet/fatty foods are indeed particularly attractive but I do not see honey/sweet fruits as particularly problematic. Tribes such as the Hazda eat diets of largely unrefined carbohydrate for periods of the year including berries/honey. Overconsumption of such foods is another matter.</p><p></p><p>Hormones are certainly a part of energy homeostasis and fat storage. Some people may be more predisposed to store fat. Similarly some people are more likely to store fat around the viscera but not subcutaneously so they become metabolically unhealthy but do not display any overweight phenotypes.</p><p></p><p>Macronutrients may be an issue with how they are packaged i.e carbs consumed in the form of sugar laden fizzy drinks that by pass appetite controls which the body does not compensate for. </p><p></p><p>Unfortunately some people view people who are overweight/obese unfairly, assuming they become that way because they are lazy/ willingly overeat - a sterotype of being greedy. I was not suggesting or calling anyone greedy - you may have misunderstood me here. I was making the point that this isn’t the case. That biology and the food environment is against them. </p><p></p><p>Regarding genetic shifts, I was making the point within the context of a change in food availability and types of food available and the ease with which these foods are available was a reason behind the obesity epidemic not some physiological change in the general population. I wasn’t suggesting you implied there was any genetic change.</p><p>I agree. </p><p></p><p>We are hardwired to seek out high calorie foods which is why eating them can be so rewarding (dopamine release etc).</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Sean_Raymond, post: 2354392, member: 403497"] I will reply and trust you can link what I am discussing to your reply. Consuming equal or less calories whilst being active is a pretty solid approach to maintaining/losing weight. I’ve had very good success with people doing this (with or without diabetes). Consuming equal or more energy than your metabolic needs but lowering a particular hormone isn't something I've seen (I have tried it personally and with others). A calories is a calorie concept changes after consuming food. Different foods have different thermagenic effects and it is easier to extract energy from some foods than others. Different foods have different effects on satiety and motivation to eat more. Calories in and out is not perfect and is only part of the reason a person may gain unhealthy weight but it is still at its heart the most plausible for me in many cases. I do not find the idea that insulin resistance is the cause of weight gain - I'm more convinced at this point that it is more likely a consequence of it. I will change my mind if better research comes out showing otherwise. Yes, a role of Insulin is to signal to the body to stop fat breakdown and promote fat storage but it is a signal which the cell is not obliged to follow - insulin is important in energy metabolism but it is just one of the players involved in the burning or storing of energy. Metabolic pathways for fat, carbohydrate and protein are different. I was not referring to the specific digestion or metabolism of them per se (chemical exchanges) but the way fat and carbohydrates are thought to compete for fuel selection. The Randall cycle proposes a theory that describes the flux between fatty acids and glucose for oxidation during fed/fasted states. It isn’t standard to teach it (or at least I wasn’t taught it). I think the cycle can be used to put forward an argument that eating fat and carbs together will impair efficient metabolism of a substrate which may have implications for metabolic health but not that it is a reason for why people get fat (fat gets oxidised glucose energy gets stored). It does support the idea that eating fat separate to carbs would mean either one will be more efficiently metabolised. It does link onto the idea that dietary fat acutely impairs glucose metabolism. Fat and sugar together tend to be highly palatable too. A big part of a nutritionists and dietitians role is to help people eat healthy and or to achieve a healthy/healthier weight so I am sorry if they were not much help, But I am sure they were interesting discussions. I am more than happy to discuss things with yourself if I feel able to. Sweet/fatty foods are indeed particularly attractive but I do not see honey/sweet fruits as particularly problematic. Tribes such as the Hazda eat diets of largely unrefined carbohydrate for periods of the year including berries/honey. Overconsumption of such foods is another matter. Hormones are certainly a part of energy homeostasis and fat storage. Some people may be more predisposed to store fat. Similarly some people are more likely to store fat around the viscera but not subcutaneously so they become metabolically unhealthy but do not display any overweight phenotypes. Macronutrients may be an issue with how they are packaged i.e carbs consumed in the form of sugar laden fizzy drinks that by pass appetite controls which the body does not compensate for. Unfortunately some people view people who are overweight/obese unfairly, assuming they become that way because they are lazy/ willingly overeat - a sterotype of being greedy. I was not suggesting or calling anyone greedy - you may have misunderstood me here. I was making the point that this isn’t the case. That biology and the food environment is against them. Regarding genetic shifts, I was making the point within the context of a change in food availability and types of food available and the ease with which these foods are available was a reason behind the obesity epidemic not some physiological change in the general population. I wasn’t suggesting you implied there was any genetic change. I agree. We are hardwired to seek out high calorie foods which is why eating them can be so rewarding (dopamine release etc). [/QUOTE]
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