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Fruit

Jo_the_boat

Jo_the_boat

Well-Known Member
Messages
809
Location
Littleborough, Lancashire
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Jo_the_boat said:
Here's a story from the BBC.
If I was non-diabetic I would be thinking to myself ....... what next? What the hell can I eat??
Well, the article does offer some advice but it would be easy for the 'healthy' to dismiss the whole thing as scaremongering - like eggs or fat previously.
Apple growers won't be happy.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/articles/gFmKkxQlHSXG68dYqc1RR7/can-too-much-fruit-be-bad-for-you
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What a coincidence! I have just watched the programme on iPlayer. The segment on fruit was short but I thought 'Baby Steps'. I have to agree that it will take a great many more lessons on the dangers of a diet high in sugars before the message gets through as if I am honest, I would have ignored the message pre diagnosis.
 
It is hard for most people (assuming not Type2 or pre-diabetic) to eat too much fruit, but very easy to drink far too much if made into juice or a smoothly etc.

I agree 100% with the BBC articles for people who don't have issues controlling BG. Shame it does not say that people with Type2 should avoid most fruit and explain way.
 
Eating too much fruit may have contributed to my T2 (Along with gentics, age, being overweight). I have always eaten fruit, about 5-7 pieces a day if you include berries. I also ate "all my vegatables".

It was abit of a surpise to hear it may have contributed, as common knowledge / NHS guidelines tell you that fruit and veg is a good thing. Almost a blessing that I now have Diabetes as it has caused me to revisit most of my thinking on food. Obvioulsy I would prefer not to have it.
 
ixi1429 said:
Eating too much fruit may have contributed to my T2 (Along with gentics, age, being overweight). I have always eaten fruit, about 5-7 pieces a day if you include berries. I also ate "all my vegatables".

It was abit of a surpise to hear it may have contributed, as common knowledge / NHS guidelines tell you that fruit and veg is a good thing. Almost a blessing that I now have Diabetes as it has caused me to revisit most of my thinking on food. Obvioulsy I would prefer not to have it.
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It is only fairly recently that the connection between fruit intake and T2D insulin resistance has been made, and even then it is not mainstream, but really only associated with the Low Carb movement (Bernstein, Taylor, et al).

The link is not a fully proven 'fact' either, but is a working hypothesis as to what may be causing T2D IR. To my mind it makes sense since the fructose is not metabolised in the same way as normal sugar, but is processed by the liver directly into lipids, not glucose, This is why fruit is generally ignored in the glucose bgl story, and most mainstream thinking is that the body does not use it so it gets excreted, This old way of thinking is being replaced by the fructose to lipid theory to explain the metabolic syndrome, and fatty livers that T2D seem to be prone to. Does not explain why T1D do not seem to suffer metabolic syndrome though.
 
Fruit juice is the primary public health issue, as no one is going to eat 20 apples at one sitting, but drinking the juice from 20 apples is common.
 
ixi1429 said:
Eating too much fruit may have contributed to my T2 (Along with gentics, age, being overweight). I have always eaten fruit, about 5-7 pieces a day if you include berries. I also ate "all my vegatables".

It was abit of a surpise to hear it may have contributed, as common knowledge / NHS guidelines tell you that fruit and veg is a good thing. Almost a blessing that I now have Diabetes as it has caused me to revisit most of my thinking on food. Obvioulsy I would prefer not to have it.
Click to expand...
I used to eat a lot of fruit before diagnosis, gained weight around the middle; and hey presto - screwed.
 
Let's also remember that an apple has fewer carbs than a packet of crisps or a Mars Bar, hence to a large extent with public health it is about "choosing your battles". (But we are not the public, hence I would never advise someone with type2 to eat an apple.)
 
ringi said:
It is hard for most people (assuming not Type2 or pre-diabetic) to eat too much fruit, but very easy to drink far too much if made into juice or a smoothly etc..
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A long time ago, in a UK where medical trials and health and safety was less stringent, the Army did an experiment. They got a volunteer so see if they could live on a diet solely of oranges. I think the volunteer lasted a few days before starting to go orange (or possibly jaundiced), developed acidosis and became rather ill. So I guess the moral of that story is the importance of a balanced diet, and never volunteer..
 
first14808 said:
A long time ago, in a UK where medical trials and health and safety was less stringent, the Army did an experiment. They got a volunteer so see if they could live on a diet solely of oranges. I think the volunteer lasted a few days before starting to go orange (or possibly jaundiced), developed acidosis and became rather ill. So I guess the moral of that story is the importance of a balanced diet, and never volunteer..
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Carrots do the same. Mind you, the tea in the army contained bromide, and that too turned things orange.
 
@first14808

It was Eddie Mcgee - I have his book somewhere when I used to do other stuff.
From memory I think he lasted longer - a week or so.
 
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ringi said:
Let's also remember that an apple has fewer carbs than a packet of crisps or a Mars Bar, hence to a large extent with public health it is about "choosing your battles". (But we are not the public, hence I would never advise someone with type2 to eat an apple.)
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Agree. I'd rather see one or two pieces of fruit in a child's lunch-box than a packet of Monster Munch, a carton of juice and a cereal bar. In my opinion, there are much better 'villains' to go after before we start on fruit. (But of course echoing @ringi's last sentence.)
 
Sue192 said:
Agree. I'd rather see one or two pieces of fruit in a child's lunch-box than a packet of Monster Munch, a carton of juice and a cereal bar. In my opinion, there are much better 'villains' to go after before we start on fruit. (But of course echoing @ringi's last sentence.)
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I think a huge problem has been the change in fruit that has over taken us in the last 50 years without any of us really noticing. I belong to a farm labourer family and used to go and help pick apples, pears etc when I was a child. (loads of health and safety laws broken!). But all the fruit used to be much smaller and nowhere near as sweet. I remember that a cox apple would fit in a childs palm, now a pink lady is HUGE!!! Not to mention the sweetness. A pink lady has little resemblance to old fruit types.

We could eat an apple and not only have physically less to eat, but less sugar as well. And this applies to just about all fruit. Even carrots are sweeter.

We say that fruit is better than chocolate, but I am really beginning to wonder about that!!!!
 
Kentoldlady1 said:
I think a huge problem has been the change in fruit that has over taken us in the last 50 years without any of us really noticing. I belong to a farm labourer family and used to go and help pick apples, pears etc when I was a child. (loads of health and safety laws broken!). But all the fruit used to be much smaller and nowhere near as sweet. I remember that a cox apple would fit in a childs palm, now a pink lady is HUGE!!! Not to mention the sweetness. A pink lady has little resemblance to old fruit types.

We could eat an apple and not only have physically less to eat, but less sugar as well. And this applies to just about all fruit. Even carrots are sweeter.

We say that fruit is better than chocolate, but I am really beginning to wonder about that!!!!
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That's interesting, @Kentoldlady1 - I had a Russet at Christmas (my favourite) and thought it was sweeter than I remembered, but put it down to a changed palate. I came across a list of carbs in fruit and American apples were separate from what they called other apples, and the American ones were higher. I also agree about smaller fruit back then - some apples would now feed three children. I just had a paranoid nightmare moment when I read @Jo_the_boat's comment about apple growers and imagined all the recent hard work of preserving and re-planting traditional orchards and saving old apple species (with all their benefit for bees, insects and wildlife) undone and the trees ripped up for housing due to the BBC's report! I will breathe deeply....!
 
One thing I have noticed is the size of berries, they are huge!! I live in northwestern Ontario Canada and there are plenty of wild blueberries, Saskatoon berries, raspberries and strawberries. The wild berries are 1/6-1/4 the size of the ones in the supermarket and have 10x the flavour.

Now I love berries and cream, but when I have it with the wild variety it is so much better and not anywhere near as sweet. They don’t look as nice as store bought and definitely aren’t as easy to acquire and can at times be dangerous especially if you happen to startle a bear that is foraging but the end result is worth it.
 
Troubled1 said:
One thing I have noticed is the size of berries, they are huge!! I live in northwestern Ontario Canada and there are plenty of wild blueberries, Saskatoon berries, raspberries and strawberries. The wild berries are 1/6-1/4 the size of the ones in the supermarket and have 10x the flavour.

Now I love berries and cream, but when I have it with the wild variety it is so much better and not anywhere near as sweet. They don’t look as nice as store bought and definitely aren’t as easy to acquire and can at times be dangerous especially if you happen to startle a bear that is foraging but the end result is worth it.
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I can`t imagine being in love with ANY food enough to risk disturbing a bear for! Always excepting crisps of course! ;).
 
Robbity said:
Yes I remember from many years back a report about a man overeating carrots and turning orange....
Robbity
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I eat a lot of chicken and it’s not harmed me











Cluck cluck cluck

Seriously though an interesting link by the OP
 
Kentoldlady1 said:
I think a huge problem has been the change in fruit that has over taken us in the last 50 years without any of us really noticing. I belong to a farm labourer family and used to go and help pick apples, pears etc when I was a child. (loads of health and safety laws broken!). But all the fruit used to be much smaller and nowhere near as sweet. I remember that a cox apple would fit in a childs palm, now a pink lady is HUGE!!! Not to mention the sweetness. A pink lady has little resemblance to old fruit types.

We could eat an apple and not only have physically less to eat, but less sugar as well. And this applies to just about all fruit. Even carrots are sweeter.

We say that fruit is better than chocolate, but I am really beginning to wonder about that!!!!
Click to expand...
I agree. And put the blame On Supermarkets they are/were not interested in anything but the bottom line My Father had a business in the Old Convent Garden Market in London and as a child used To Get to Eat Loads of fruit and veg and it was less sweet as you say and e used to supply the Local Butcher with fruit in exchange for meat. (a practice that stated in the war) and a chicken tasted different as an example Then along came supermarkets and you lost your Local Butcher & Fishmonger and corner shops etc and then they Pressurized Farm everything became about Uniformity Size Unblemished Potatoes etc It Was all force the farmer to supply Nice round/oval shaped veg even colour All about Appearance and lowest cost farmers forced to grow sweeter Fruit and produce Tasteless chickens etc (I am probably one of a dying breed who remember what a chicken shoul taste like, Lets hope the organic movement can bring back some of the Old Tasting foods that were healthier.
 
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