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going from type 2 to type 1 i think....questions i cannot answer

gary132

gary132

Member
Messages
9
Type of diabetes
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
Hi All, i have been type 2 for 5 years, 2 years ago i had a flair up january time where my levels went haywire.
after several months of changing my tablets they finally settled it down.
now 2 years on again in january i have gone out of wack again. my levels keep going up as high as 20 after eating.
i have increasing pains that keep coming around my right kidney. after eating lunch time i am getting symptoms like my heart is pounding out of my chest and up my neck....thumping head. when these happen i can see my sugar levels go up to 16 then after around 3 hours dropp back down to 7 where i start to feel better again.
my long term health nurse wants to put me on injections but the doctors at the hospital are twiddling there thumbs over giving the go ahead....my doctor is changing my tablets again in the hope it will correct.....the diabetic nurse seems to think that my levels are too low to cause these pain symptoms and heart that feels like it is working overtime. my doctor thinks the diabetes might be affecting my nervouse system causeing what he calls signal misfires ...i am totally lost at the moment. i know last night i went to bed on a reading of 20.4 and got up with a reading of 17.0 and felt like my heart was in my through ....my HBA1C is 98 it should be 48....and they still seem stunned i am having problems with my readings they claim you dont feel ill with readings from 12 to 20 ....i am looking for helpful info from people who actually suffer the disease and not the doctors... now
thanks Gary.
 
gary132 said:
Hi All, i have been type 2 for 5 years, 2 years ago i had a flair up january time where my levels went haywire.
after several months of changing my tablets they finally settled it down.
now 2 years on again in january i have gone out of wack again. my levels keep going up as high as 20 after eating.
i have increasing pains that keep coming around my right kidney. after eating lunch time i am getting symptoms like my heart is pounding out of my chest and up my neck....thumping head. when these happen i can see my sugar levels go up to 16 then after around 3 hours dropp back down to 7 where i start to feel better again.
my long term health nurse wants to put me on injections but the doctors at the hospital are twiddling there thumbs over giving the go ahead....my doctor is changing my tablets again in the hope it will correct.....the diabetic nurse seems to think that my levels are too low to cause these pain symptoms and heart that feels like it is working overtime. my doctor thinks the diabetes might be affecting my nervouse system causeing what he calls signal misfires ...i am totally lost at the moment. i know last night i went to bed on a reading of 20.4 and got up with a reading of 17.0 and felt like my heart was in my through ....my HBA1C is 98 it should be 48....and they still seem stunned i am having problems with my readings they claim you dont feel ill with readings from 12 to 20 ....i am looking for helpful info from people who actually suffer the disease and not the doctors... now
thanks Gary.
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Hello Gary, welcome to the forum and sorry you've been having so many problems. Obviously I'm not a medic, but it sounds as though the pain symptoms are not as a result of the BG readings, but it's quite possible that the readings are as a result of the pain symptoms, that's only a thought. Have you ever had a c-peptide blood test, that would at least tell you what state your pancreas is in. Is there any possibility of a kidney infection? That can be pretty painful, it was when I had an kidney infection, in fact very painful. You refer to hospital doctors, in the plural, are they endocrinologists? Diabetic specialists? You may think they're twiddling their thumbs but they're really the ones who should know what they're talking about. You refer to a long term health nurse and a diabetic nurse, are they not the same person?
Diet has already been mentioned and if you look through some of the threads you will see that Low carb comes up a lot. It's carbs that make the BG go up, so how about avoiding the obvious pasta/rice/bread/potato, just for a couple of days, see if the levels settle down a bit. You might find that a change in diet longer term is preferable to going onto insulin. In my case I avoided carbs, down from 250 gms to about 80 gms a day, not only did I avoid going onto insulin but I threw Gliclazide and Januvia out the window as well because I don't need them.
All the best
Graham
 
If your blood sugars are out of control and you're not on insulin, you need to be on insulin.

It's binary.

Black and white.

Don't put up with **** from doctors that obviously don't know what they're talking about.

It's your life and your health. Don't act at your own peril.
 
cheers for some advice, currently i am 16.8 stone too, at present in the morning i eat a bowl of porridge 7.30.
10am i have two slices of brown bread with a low fat filling. at 12.30 lunchtime i will have either a pot noodle or a cup o soup usually tomato.
then the problems start, the feeling of a pounding heartbeat comes on with foggy mind unable to concentrate some times feeling very hot shoulders upwards, i check my sugars and they have jumped from 7.8 upto 15.7 ...keep checking my sugars every 15 minutes and as they slowly come down over a 2/3 hour period back to normal-ish level start to feel better and symptoms subside....time i get home at 6.15pm ish i am starting to go low with a reading of 4.8. have to get my evening meal quick to catch it before it goes too low. during the evening the levels of sugar go back up but the symptoms i experiance during the day don't seem as severe in the evening.
i am on 1000 metformin in morning with 120 of glycazide....tea time i am on 1000 metformin with 40 of glycazide. docotr seems to think the pains are being caused by the diabetes damaging nerves which causes wrong signals to be sent out from my nerves when sugar levels are higher than usual. the long term health nurse is just that ...she says she wants me to see the diabetic nurse but the diabetic nurse never seems to be around. ?.
they have prescribed me a new tablet i will know name of it tomorrow when i pick it up.
the long term health nurse has sent a letter to hospital docs to put me on a new drug you inject ( not insulin ) you inject once a day and it only acts if your sugars go up , so no risk of going to low if you inject too much insulin...also it helps with weight, she is trying to avoid putting me on insulin as she says that can increase weight and other problems and is risky reference hypos. my health at the moment is making it difficult to work simply because having these episodes each day after eating lunch i spend several hours trying to get over them sat at my desk with my head in my hands. even the boss's are telling me i need to get sorted out. i am trying . 9 weeks i have been back and forth to the doctors now. all they have done so far is tell me to change tablet dosages and go back in two weeks and let them know how i am doing.
 
also i just found this which could explain what my doctor was saying ...

Diabetic neuropathies are a family of nerve disorders caused by diabetes. People with diabetes can, over time, develop nerve damage throughout the body. Some people with nerve damage have no symptoms. Others may have symptoms such as pain, tingling, or numbness—loss of feeling—in the hands, arms, feet, and legs. Nerve problems can occur in every organ system, including the digestive tract, heart, and sex organs.

About 60 to 70 percent of people with diabetes have some form of neuropathy. People with diabetes can develop nerve problems at any time, but risk rises with age and longer duration of diabetes. The highest rates of neuropathy are among people who have had diabetes for at least 25 years. Diabetic neuropathies also appear to be more common in people who have problems controlling their blood glucose, also called blood sugar, as well as those with high levels of blood fat and blood pressure and those who are overweight.
 
Hi @gary132 ,
The first thing Gary is the food your eating is the opposite to what everyone or most are eating on here. just too many carbohydrates.

The porriage will be very high especially if made with milk, the cup-o-soup is also high I think about 100 carbs per sachet. People on here some are only eating 50 carbs a day. The brown bread will not be helping either. Lots on here cannot tolerate more than 1 slice and that maybe something like Hovis see sensations 13 carbs per slice or Bergen Soya & Linseed brown bread.

We all test on here but eat to the meter. That's test just before eating, then 1hr after and then 2hrs after that, if your figures have moved more than 2 mmol/L from the first to the last test then something has to be removed from what you ate or the portion size reduced.

Most follow a Low Carbohydrate High fat Diet, have a look at this link, http://www.xperthealth.org.uk/shop/details/p/handbook-lowcarb-highfat-lifestyle the book is worth getting it simply tells you how to control your diabetes through your diet and remain healthy it's the exact opposite to what the NHS says but it works.

Hope this helps

Neil
 
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thank you i can see where i am going wrong and it does seem to be a sheer lack of knowledge on my part...maybe i should have reached out when i 1st got diagnosed, but at the time i did not know where to look for the help i need...if it is my diet then i am amazed i have got this far without being worse sooner
 
@gary132 , the NHS tell us all to carry on and have 30% carbs in what they call an eat well plate, I was diagnosed pre and was on a very good normal diet lot of fish but was having potatoes & rice loved curries, When I was diagnosed as pre I reduced the spuds and rice a little added fruit, dates of all things very sugary, and in 9 months I was classed as diabetic although borderline. Since going on the LCHF diet I have come down in 3 months from a HbA1c of 46 to 41 still diabetic but out of the range.

I have some neuropathy of the feet even though I was mild diabetic. That has now improved considerably as all my arms and legs used to tingle.

If it is diet it is not too late to make a big difference there are lots on here that have your sort of figures but manage to reduce then. The neuropathy can reduce considerably once you have the sugars under control.

Hang in there, have a look around the forum and ask as many questions as you can, but get that book it explains things very simply and really helps you understand what you need to do.

Neil
 
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@gary132 , you started on a different thread did you get the long list from Daisy1 that we give to all new members? She posted on your original thread.

Sorry I had got your tag wrong Gary, corrected now.
Neil
PS Notice you also mentioned Low fat Filling those usually contain sugars, it's not easy to get your head around this but you cut the carbs and eat the fat and you will also probably lose weight as we have all done. on this diet.
 
The risk associated with weight gain from insulin is far outweighed by the risks of not taking it and constantly running high blood sugars. Seriously. If your doctor is using that as an excuse not to put you on insulin, report him to the medical board and find another doctor.

I'm reading my posts back and realise I'm sounding like a **** but ultimately I'm trying to save you very serious complications of medical misjudgement.
 
Hi @BigRedSwitch , I agree he may need insulin, but we really don't no, we are not medically trained. Many on here have successfully reduced their bg's through the LCHF diet and from the figures he has given here, not that high compared to many on here when they start.

There is a member at the moment started at nearly 28 a few weeks ago and they are now down fairly quickly between 8 & 13 the last time I looked, just with a change in the diet.

If the diet does make a difference and he can control his sugars that way, then it will be better than Insulin.

So I think he should try changing his diet soon cutting the carbs and see while he is waiting to see what difference it makes to his BG's.

Neil
 
Hi,
There are several reason why people have diabetes, some is lack of the pancreas producing insulin, you can also have it over producing, fatty liver. The destruction of islet cells through steroids or Pancreitas.

There is also the increase of type 2 through obesity, and those having having surgery like the gastric band who have diabetes don't have diabetes within weeks of having the operation.

Have you heard of the work done by Professor Taylor where for type2's there is what is called the Newcastle Diet 800 calories a day for 8 weeks where people with type 2 have reversed or their diabetes has gone into complete remission, we have several members on this site that have undertook the diet and it has worked for them. They eat what they want.

As Gary has not been diagnosed as type1 yet and therefore diet maybe the best for him but it will be his decision and his medical team and what he is diagnosed as.
Neil
 
Yes, I'm very aware of all of those things. You forgot to mention gestational diabetes that can result in a condition which manifests as type 2, but then progresses to type 1, as has happened with my sister in law.

Type 2 diabetes is a lot more complex when it comes to causes. There's no disputing that. But don't get diagnosis and treatment of a situation mixed up. Due to the complexity of type 2 (of which the main cause is generally insulin resistance), the drugs prescribed (metformin and previously sebutramine), are merely 'managing' the body's standard metabolism to work within its apparent limitations.

Unless I've completely misread this thread, the OP was ok with his control, but now it's not working. Therefore he needs to go onto insulin therapy in my opinion.

Oh, and just while we're at at - the extremely low carbohydrate diet for 8 weeks? Well, it may work for some people, but the slowing of the metabolism due to the starving state, and subsequent rebound is likely to bring back the type 2 sooner rather than later.

I agree that you should run a low carb diet, but given the information I've read here, diet isn't the answer.

And don't always believe what you hear from medical professionals - they're not infallible.

Edited by Moderator to include "in my opinion". CC
 
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The new castle Diet has not worked for all but about 80%, but it has worked for many of the obese following their surgery, we have a guy on this forum that has done the NC diet is still overweight but it worked for him and has so far not returned.

You may well be right reading the thread Gary may well have gone past the point of no return regards full control with diet for a type2, but I am sticking with my view not influenced by the medical field but influence by what I have seen on here and how people have reacted to diet and that one of the government dietitians has now actually started saying that eating fat is not bad after all and that diabetics certainly type2s should low carb. Which is a massive change of attitude.

Any I'm off to bed now, thanks for the chat, a very Goodnight

Neil
 
gary132 said:
thank you i can see where i am going wrong and it does seem to be a sheer lack of knowledge on my part...maybe i should have reached out when i 1st got diagnosed, but at the time i did not know where to look for the help i need...if it is my diet then i am amazed i have got this far without being worse sooner
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Don't beat yourself up, it was 16 years before I realised that lowering my carb intake was better than the increasing amount of medication. What really annoyed me was that lowering carbs also lessened those awful side effects that metformin has (I've heard it called Metfartin, an understatement in my opinion), wish I'd known that in the beginning when I was being told to eat more bread and potato. It's horses for courses at the end of the day, I used to take gliclazide and it makes the pancreas create more insulin and is very efficient at doing that and I was taking 240 mg a day. Taking insulin would not have been the end of the world for me, but seeing what poor control my father and a cousin have while taking insulin, I'm happy that the route I have taken is working so very well.
I'm sorry to hear that your bosses are giving you grief, that's one thing you don't need. They must be pretty stupid because they are obviously not aware of their duties in the case of an employee with diabetes. Nobody wants a confrontation or having to lay the law down, but they do need some pointers as to what their responsibilities are. That's a different issue and one that I hope doesn't require aggravation for you.
I see that your breakfast and mid morning snack are carbs, how about trying things that have no carbs, a good reason to eat egg and bacon and see what the effect is. Maybe try it at home if you get a day off and have some glucose ready, taking 120 mg Gliclazide and no carbs will almost definitely lead to a hypo, I managed to do that when I started low carb and it's why Gliclazide was the first drug I dumped.
 
Gary,

I'm with BigRed for what it's worth. I'm a late-diagnosed LADA, Dx T2 then T 1. I take insulin now (no problem, easy, great).

One thing is crystal clear, and one thing is shouting at me (and BigRed):

1) you have to eat to your meter. Test, test, test, and your best diet will emerge. It will in fact be low-carb, but no one needs to tell you that.

2) With numbers like that, you have no time to lose. Insulin will get your numbers down fast, and thats what you need in my opinion.. You might well be able to dump it once you've got real eating habits, but other drugs aren't fast enough. If it was me I wouldn't wait even a day. You have everything to lose, and everything to gain.

Be good to yourself?



Edited to add "in my opinion". as we are not trained to provide the answer for the OP. CC
 
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reading everything as i said i have had it all under control until january ....things that are concerning me now are like for example. last night i woke with a night sweat ( AGAIN ) and this morning i was woken by sharp pin like stabbing pains in the toe next to my little toe on my right foot. this has not gone away yet and i can feel it when walking. my main concern is that i am possibly getting nerve damage for the stomach. i feel the doctors holding off is going to cause more problems. the doctor has reffered me to doctors at the local hospital. and i have to wait now for them to post me an appointment which could be weeks away yet. in the mean time i fear my diabetes may harm me more. today i start a new pill which i pick up lunchtime. i am now monitering my levels all day every few hours. i got up this morning with a reading of 8.7 which is good but feel lousy....this may just be because they have been so high i am feeling rough when they normal.
 
LucySW said:
Gary,

I'm with BigRed for what it's worth. I'm a late-diagnosed LADA, Dx T2 then T 1. I take insulin now (no problem, easy, great).

One thing is crystal clear, and one thing is shouting at me (and BigRed):

1) you have to eat to your meter. Test, test, test, and your best diet will emerge. It will in fact be low-carb, but no one needs to tell you that.

2) With numbers like that, you have no time to lose. Insulin will get your numbers down fast, and thats what you need in my opinion.. You might well be able to dump it once you've got real eating habits, but other drugs aren't fast enough. If it was me I wouldn't wait even a day. You have everything to lose, and everything to gain.

Be good to yourself?
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1) Absolutely, no question.
2) I've always found that trying to tell any fully qualified medic their job is never going to get you very far. Demanding a certain treatment is stupid, demanding to know what the hell is going on is a different matter all together.

We all have very personal experiences and I think it's dangerous to suggest that anybody is exactly the same, that really is for the medical profession to decide. I've got plenty to moan about certain medics in my life, but I still think they know best, usually.
 
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