Help with Eating to my Meter.

[Morpheus5575]

Hi Guys
I was diagnosed with prediabetes last year,my A1C was 48.

I went on a diet and lost a total of 4st (56lbs)which brought me within acceptable parameters for BMI. My A1C had dropped back to 35, Cholestrol and Triglyceride levels all dropped accordingly.

My second AIC which took in the Christmas period (and all the bad stuff) increased to 41 with everything else ok.

I will have the results of my most recent A1C next week and i am worried about it already.

I am trying to get used to checking my bloods before and after meals and i have created a few high readings. I am confused though, should i be eating and testing individual foods to be sure i am getting accurate results on things like various breads,porridge,strawberries&cream etc etc??

This evening for instance i had for my evening meal:
2 fried eggs
3 small pork sausages
1/4 tin heinz baked beans with no added sugar
1 Gallaghers Low Sugar bap 39g Carbs
i followed this meal with 1x30g slice of Gallagher's Hi Fibre Protein bread @7.4g Carbs and a few thin slices of cheddar cheese.
To finish off i had 100g strawberries with whipped cream.

But i got the shock of my life when my BG went from 5.6 Pre-prandial to 14.6 post prandial.

I normally eat twice a day,mid morning and late evening 7-8ish. I am maintaining my weight loss easily but feel i should be eating more protein.

What caused that big spike? would it be the bap alone? which was high at 39g carbs. because the slice only has 7.4g carbs (maybe less because each slice has 3g Fibre) and i think all of the other stuff didn't have much carbs going on.

I am confused and worried but i felt i had to know what would happen. I am also really confused about trying out different foods, because in a meal like the one here, there is a lot going on.

I would appreciate some guidance and advice if possible.

 

[Indy51]

Even after weight loss, years of low A1c, intermittent fasting, etc., I know through testing that I can't exceed 30g of carbohydrate in one meal without going over my aim of staying under 7.8 at all times.

This video explains "eating to your meter" and establishing your personal carbohydrate tolerance:

This article is also helpful:

http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/14045524.php

 

[There is no Spoon]

1/4 tin heinz baked beans with no added sugar
1 Gallaghers Low Sugar bap 39g Carbs

Just a quick observation no added sugar does not mean no sugar.

Just checked about 20g carbs & 4g sugar in there "no added sugar" beans. So we call that 20g of sugar because your body turns carbs into sugar. Low sugar bread is still sugar.

So anyway bread + 1/4 tin beans = more sugar than you think.
I would skip the beans and the bread, next time and check your bg reading to see if that helps.

 

[Morpheus5575]

Thank you guys for the quick replies, i appreciate your help. I will be back on here tomorrow with a couple more questions. Thank you.

 

[Indy51]

Also, tagging @daisy1 for more detailed information for newcomers.

 

[daisy1]

@Morpheus5575

Hello Morpheus5575 and welcome to the Forum Here is the Basic Information we give to new members and I hope you will find it useful. Ask as many questions as you like and someone will be able to help.


BASIC INFORMATION FOR NEW MEMBERS

Diabetes is the general term to describe people who have blood that is sweeter than normal. A number of different types of diabetes exist.

A diagnosis of diabetes tends to be a big shock for most of us. It’s far from the end of the world though and on this forum you'll find well over 235,000 people who are demonstrating this.

On the forum we have found that with the number of new people being diagnosed with diabetes each day, sometimes the NHS is not being able to give all the advice it would perhaps like to deliver - particularly with regards to people with type 2 diabetes.

The role of carbohydrate

Carbohydrates are a factor in diabetes because they ultimately break down into sugar (glucose) within our blood. We then need enough insulin to either convert the blood sugar into energy for our body, or to store the blood sugar as body fat.

If the amount of carbohydrate we take in is more than our body’s own (or injected) insulin can cope with, then our blood sugar will rise.

The bad news

Research indicates that raised blood sugar levels over a period of years can lead to organ damage, commonly referred to as diabetic complications.

The good news

People on the forum here have shown that there is plenty of opportunity to keep blood sugar levels from going too high. It’s a daily task but it’s within our reach and it’s well worth the effort.

Controlling your carbs

The info below is primarily aimed at people with type 2 diabetes, however, it may also be of benefit for other types of diabetes as well.

There are two approaches to controlling your carbs:

• Reduce your carbohydrate intake
• Choose ‘better’ carbohydrates

Reduce your carbohydrates

A large number of people on this forum have chosen to reduce the amount of carbohydrates they eat as they have found this to be an effective way of improving (lowering) their blood sugar levels.

The carbohydrates which tend to have the most pronounced effect on blood sugar levels tend to be starchy carbohydrates such as rice, pasta, bread, potatoes and similar root vegetables, flour based products (pastry, cakes, biscuits, battered food etc) and certain fruits.

Choosing better carbohydrates

The low glycaemic index diet is often favoured by healthcare professionals but some people with diabetes find that low GI does not help their blood sugar enough and may wish to cut out these foods altogether.

Read more on carbohydrates and diabetes.

Over 145,000 people have taken part in the Low Carb Program - a 10 week structured education course that is helping people lose weight and reduce medication dependency by explaining the science behind carbs, insulin and GI.

Eating what works for you

Different people respond differently to different types of food. What works for one person may not work so well for another. The best way to see which foods are working for you is to test your blood sugar with a glucose meter.

To be able to see what effect a particular type of food or meal has on your blood sugar is to do a test before the meal and then test after the meal. A test 2 hours after the meal gives a good idea of how your body has reacted to the meal.

The blood sugar ranges recommended by NICE are as follows:

Blood glucose ranges for type 2 diabetes

• Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 8.5 mmol/l

Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (adults)

• Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 9 mmol/l

Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (children)

• Before meals: 4 to 8 mmol/l
• 2 hours after meals: under 10 mmol/l

However, those that are able to, may wish to keep blood sugar levels below the NICE after meal targets.

Access to blood glucose test strips

The NICE guidelines suggest that people newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes should be offered:

• structured education to every person and/or their carer at and around the time of diagnosis, with annual reinforcement and review
• self-monitoring of plasma glucose to a person newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes only as an integral part of his or her self-management education

Therefore both structured education and self-monitoring of blood glucose should be offered to people with type 2 diabetes. Read more on getting access to blood glucose testing supplies.

You may also be interested to read questions to ask at a diabetic clinic.

Note: This post has been edited from Sue/Ken's post to include up to date information.
Take part in Diabetes.co.uk digital education programs and improve your understanding. Most of these are free.

• Low Carb Program - it's made front-page news of the New Scientist and The Times. Developed with 20,000 people with type 2 diabetes; 96% of people who take part recommend it... find out why
  
  
• Hypo Program - improve your understanding of hypos. There's a version for people with diabetes, parents/guardians of children with type 1, children with type 1 diabetes, teachers and HCPs.
  

 

[Morpheus5575]

Just a quick observation no added sugar does not mean no sugar.

Just checked about 20g carbs & 4g sugar in there "no added sugar" beans. So we call that 20g of sugar because your body turns carbs into sugar. Low sugar bread is still sugar.

So anyway bread + 1/4 tin beans = more sugar than you think.
I would skip the beans and the bread, next time and check your bg reading to see if that helps.

So,would the bread and 1/4 tin beans in that particular meal cause the spike i experienced? five hours after the meal my BG was 8.6 still not back down.
Would i need to check the bread on its own to see what it does?

 

[Indy51]

So,would the bread and 1/4 tin beans in that particular meal cause the spike i experienced? five hours after the meal my BG was 8.6 still not back down.
Would i need to check the bread on its own to see what it does?

I find the total carbs in the meal is what matters - doesn't seem to matter much what the carbs are.

 

[Bluetit1802]

This evening for instance i had for my evening meal:
2 fried eggs
3 small pork sausages
1/4 tin heinz baked beans with no added sugar
1 Gallaghers Low Sugar bap 39g Carbs
i followed this meal with 1x30g slice of Gallagher's Hi Fibre Protein bread @7.4g Carbs and a few thin slices of cheddar cheese.
To finish off i had 100g strawberries with whipped cream.

It sounds to me as though you are looking at sugar content and not carb content. Sugar is a carb in itself, and all carbs wherever they are will turn to sugar once eaten. So it is carbs that matter. Clearly there were too many carbs in that meal for your body to cope with.

If the pork sausages were ordinary ones (as opposed to 97% meat ones) there will have been a lot of carbs in them because they fill them up with cereals. All supermarkets sell high meat content ones.

The no added sugar beans are no better than the normal ones. Both are very carb heavy. You will see this if you check the label on the tin.

The bap at 39g carbs is a poor choice. It has more carbs than many of us eat in a whole day.

The strawberries and cream will also have had carbs in.

 

[Runica]

I find sometimes that legumes (peas, beans, lentils, etc) can cause a reduced spike, but raise the blood sugar for longer. Half a slice of bread = big rise at one hour, big drop to pre-meal reading at two hours. Spoon of kidney and pinto beans in a veg chilli = slight rise at one hour, slowly creeping higher at two hours, then topping out at three hours.

Not all calories are created the same, and not all carbs, either.

 

[There is no Spoon]

I find the total carbs in the meal is what matters - doesn't seem to matter much what the carbs are.

Hi @Morpheus5575
As Indy says it's the total carb count of your meal that you want to consider. Even the sausages have carbs.

I know this is not about me but for the same meal I would have had just the sausages and egg. Skipped every thing else and usually add some tomato and mushrooms.

 

[bulkbiker]

So,would the bread and 1/4 tin beans in that particular meal cause the spike i experienced? five hours after the meal my BG was 8.6 still not back down.
Would i need to check the bread on its own to see what it does?

I would say there's no need to check the bread .. it will cause a spike in 99% of people... bread in almost any shape or form is best avoided as I'm afraid were most of the other parts of your meal.

 

[Oldvatr]

I had problems with supermarket sausages, especially the budget low cost ones. I have now found some sausages from Aldi that do not cause any spike in me, Some Asda ones earlier this year pushed me up by at least 7 mmol/l above my premeal reading, and it was confirmed by a retest on another meter,

One point is that a spike lasting 5 hours or so is probably due to protein and fat rather than just carbs, A high fat content can slow digestion, and protein has a habit of also being converted to glucose like carbs, but at a slower rate. However this second process (see gluconeognesis) generally only occurs when the blood sugar is already low since it is an automatic survival mechanism our body has to preserve glucose supply to the brain (which has priority)

The other thing to bear in mind is that as your blood sugars drop and there is a delay in the next meal then again the body can step in and boost the blood glucose levels from stores in the body (Liver Dump). Again it usually needs low bgl to allow this to happen, and is something that Newbies to LC or VLC diets experience as the diet progresses, and before the diet has depleted the liver stores through weight loss.

 

[Dexie1]

Have you read The Blood Sugar Diet by Michael Mosley. Most highly recommend it.

 

[Morpheus5575]

It sounds to me as though you are looking at sugar content and not carb content. Sugar is a carb in itself, and all carbs wherever they are will turn to sugar once eaten. So it is carbs that matter. Clearly there were too many carbs in that meal for your body to cope with.

If the pork sausages were ordinary ones (as opposed to 97% meat ones) there will have been a lot of carbs in them because they fill them up with cereals. All supermarkets sell high meat content ones.

The no added sugar beans are no better than the normal ones. Both are very carb heavy. You will see this if you check the label on the tin.

The bap at 39g carbs is a poor choice. It has more carbs than many of us eat in a whole day.

The strawberries and cream will also have had carbs in.

It sounds to me as though you are looking at sugar content and not carb content. Sugar is a carb in itself, and all carbs wherever they are will turn to sugar once eaten. So it is carbs that matter. Clearly there were too many carbs in that meal for your body to cope with.

If the pork sausages were ordinary ones (as opposed to 97% meat ones) there will have been a lot of carbs in them because they fill them up with cereals. All supermarkets sell high meat content ones.

The no added sugar beans are no better than the normal ones. Both are very carb heavy. You will see this if you check the label on the tin.

The bap at 39g carbs is a poor choice. It has more carbs than many of us eat in a whole day.

The strawberries and cream will also have had carbs in.

Hi Bluetit thank you for your input. Btw i rarely eat sausages at all because some of them are so calorific. These particular ones are 70% Pork. 2 sausages contain 1.8g carbs of which sugars .5g so i felt safe enough trying them. I am not fixated on sugar content at

It sounds to me as though you are looking at sugar content and not carb content. Sugar is a carb in itself, and all carbs wherever they are will turn to sugar once eaten. So it is carbs that matter. Clearly there were too many carbs in that meal for your body to cope with.

If the pork sausages were ordinary ones (as opposed to 97% meat ones) there will have been a lot of carbs in them because they fill them up with cereals. All supermarkets sell high meat content ones.

The no added sugar beans are no better than the normal ones. Both are very carb heavy. You will see this if you check the label on the tin.

The bap at 39g carbs is a poor choice. It has more carbs than many of us eat in a whole day.

The strawberries and cream will also have had carbs in.

Hi Bluetit thank you for your input, Btw i rarely eat sausages i am trying to expriment to find the good and bad. I never look at sugar content only carbs, and apart from the Bap @39g Carbs this was a low carb meal. The sausages have 1.8g carbs per pair! the slice of protein bread has 7.4g carbs. I believe the 100g strawberries have about 10g. I threw in the beans just less than 1/4 tin (9.8g per 1/4) to see what would happen. So i am confused. Btw the beans have the 'no added sugar' in their title as does the bap which i put in my post for clarity. I am just starting on the journey of eating and testing and trying to find stuff that is absolutely a no-no etc. I guess i am looking for a bread that i can eat occasionally too.

 

[Morpheus5575]

Have you read The Blood Sugar Diet by Michael Mosley. Most highly recommend it.

Hi Dexie yes i have it and the recipe book that comes with it. I lost four stone on his 800 cal diet. I read the blood sugar diet when i was told my BG had spiked to 48 for the first time. It was all new to me then and i am just finding my feet. I will start to read it again very soon.

 

[Morpheus5575]

I had problems with supermarket sausages, especially the budget low cost ones. I have now found some sausages from Aldi that do not cause any spike in me, Some Asda ones earlier this year pushed me up by at least 7 mmol/l above my premeal reading, and it was confirmed by a retest on another meter,

One point is that a spike lasting 5 hours or so is probably due to protein and fat rather than just carbs, A high fat content can slow digestion, and protein has a habit of also being converted to glucose like carbs, but at a slower rate. However this second process (see gluconeognesis) generally only occurs when the blood sugar is already low since it is an automatic survival mechanism our body has to preserve glucose supply to the brain (which has priority)

The other thing to bear in mind is that as your blood sugars drop and there is a delay in the next meal then again the body can step in and boost the blood glucose levels from stores in the body (Liver Dump). Again it usually needs low bgl to allow this to happen, and is something that Newbies to LC or VLC diets experience as the diet progresses, and before the diet has depleted the liver stores through weight loss.

Hi Oldvatr thank you for your help. Gotta say gluconeognesis is one complicated state of affairs. Since i began testing my blood with the meter i have never been lower than 4.9 and i am mostlly in the 5's. In the meal in question there was fat in the sausages and the cream, plus the oil in frying. would that be so high? I am a bit confused too about the strawberries and cream, loads of people on here seem to swear by it as fat being good and strawberrys in smallish portions low carb. Btw what is the name of the sausages you buy nowadays in Aldi?

 

[Morpheus5575]

I really appreciate everyone taking the time to post their advice and recommendations. Thank you.

 

[Oldvatr]

Hi Dexie yes i have it and the recipe book that comes with it. I lost four stone on his 800 cal diet. I read the blood sugar diet when i was told my BG had spiked to 48 for the first time. It was all new to me then and i am just finding my feet. I will start to read it again very soon.

May I suggest the book Blood Sugar 101 by Jenny Ruhl, which is the one that started me on my path to recovery. It was my intro into LC diet theory.

 

[Oldvatr]

Hi Bluetit thank you for your input. Btw i rarely eat sausages at all because some of them are so calorific. These particular ones are 70% Pork. 2 sausages contain 1.8g carbs of which sugars .5g so i felt safe enough trying them. I am not fixated on sugar content at

Hi Bluetit thank you for your input, Btw i rarely eat sausages i am trying to expriment to find the good and bad. I never look at sugar content only carbs, and apart from the Bap @39g Carbs this was a low carb meal. The sausages have 1.8g carbs per pair! the slice of protein bread has 7.4g carbs. I believe the 100g strawberries have about 10g. I threw in the beans just less than 1/4 tin (9.8g per 1/4) to see what would happen. So i am confused. Btw the beans have the 'no added sugar' in their title as does the bap which i put in my post for clarity. I am just starting on the journey of eating and testing and trying to find stuff that is absolutely a no-no etc. I guess i am looking for a bread that i can eat occasionally too.

That one bap represents what some here would use as their daily red line max limit, so for them it would be too high. But technically the term Low Carb applies to a level less than 100g/day
https://www.dietdoctor.com/how-low-carb-is-low-carb

I would say that the meal you described was low carb but not keto. That said there may be other factors going on to give high bgl readings.
When something is declared as no added sugar, the manufacturers are allowed to discount any sugars or sugar alcohols that are not sucrose, e.g. the following do not get declared - fructose, dextrose, maltose, high fructose corn syrup, malto dextrin, malitol, sorbitol, and others. Sometimes these are E number references so hidden.
Now one thing that the bgl meter makers found when they tried to get ISO certification and EU CE marking was that the testing showed that many were susceprible to malitol in the blood, and this gave erroneous readings. It is sensor technology dependant so some meters they were able to 'harden' against corrupton, but some could not. So if your meter is ISO qualified or CE marked then it is probably ok.

Another thing that affects meters is the blood Hematocrit value. This is the ratio of red blood against white blood, and again the strip literature should tell you what range the level needs to be for accurate readings. The hematocrit changes daily, so there is always some fluctuations, but illness or stress or infection can skew it out.

One question: what is your timing for the post prandial reading? Some do a test at 1 hr after, some use 90 minutes, and I use both 2hr and 4 hr for mine since this tells me basically what the carbs effect is, and then what the protein/ fat delay effect is. It also tells me roughly how quicky I am recovering from a bad meal.