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nannoo_bird

nannoo_bird

Well-Known Member
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215
Me again, sorry. I have so many questions at the moment. I am really excited by the LCHF diet, and have been reading so much about it. My concern, though, is that it would seem that you need to reduce your drugs pretty quickly if you do this diet properly. So - how do you know how much to reduce? I am on Lyxumia, Levemir, Metformin, Amlopidine, Propranalol, Olmesartan, and Rosuvstatin (yes, I rattle). There is no point in asking my doctor or diabetic nurse, as they want to control my blood glucose with drugs, whereas I want to deal with my insulin resistance and all the associated problems, and ideally get my diabetes in remission.
 
I have moved your post to our LCHF area. Hopefully some of our knowledgable members there will be along soon with some advice for you.

Take care

Doug
 
I have no knowledge of pharmacy, but wondered why you think you need to reduce your medication quickly when on LCHF? I've never seen that recommended anywhere, although I understand many people are able to reduce their diabetic pills such as metformin and statins such as simvastatin as a result of the low carb diet.
 
ExD said:
I have no knowledge of pharmacy, but wondered why you think you need to reduce your medication quickly when on LCHF? I've never seen that recommended anywhere, although I understand many people are able to reduce their diabetic pills such as metformin and statins such as simvastatin as a result of the low carb diet.
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Because having read a lot of messages from diabetics who have embarked on this diet, many say they have been able to come off their mediation within weeks. Therefore I am assuming this means starting to reduce the drugs fairly soon after starting the diet.
 
A lot will depend on the medications you are on and the rate of change in your metabolic readings. Everyone is different.

Take care

Doug
 
Osidge said:
A lot will depend on the medications you are on and the rate of change in your metabolic readings. Everyone is different.

Take care

Doug
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Doug, I listed all the medications I am on in my post. And it is the fact that we ARE all different that I am asking how do I know when to reduce them.
 
Sorry I missed the list. The only way you can know how your drugs need to change is by blood tests or adverse effects of medication. Nobody can give you a timetable.

Take care

Doug
 
@nannoo_bird, you have to appreciate that non of us are experts or medically qualified to give advice on medication and the adjustment of, it would be in your best interests to discuss this with your Dr if you feel you need to reduce your meds or stop any of them.
 
You will need to get your GP or DSN involved in any decisions regarding medications. I've stopped some of mine, reduced others, changed to different types etc as I've lost weight and got my BG under control. Blood tests and blood pressure monitoring have been vital for me.
 
Alzebra said:
You will need to get your GP or DSN involved in any decisions regarding medications. I've stopped some of mine, reduced others, changed to different types etc as I've lost weight and got my BG under control. Blood tests and blood pressure monitoring have been vital for me.
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My docs are hopeless when it comes to this, and I can only see my diabetic nurse every two months. Difficult.
 
Hi @nannoo_bird you need to test frequently in order to see how you react and whatever you do, don't go cold turkey low carb, take it in steps. Metformin shouldn't be a problem though.

Can you test BG at home?

I think it's a disgrace that your Dr and nurse leave you without help in this case. It's your body and your diabetes but it's their job to help you.
 
nannoo_bird said:
Me again, sorry. I have so many questions at the moment. I am really excited by the LCHF diet, and have been reading so much about it. My concern, though, is that it would seem that you need to reduce your drugs pretty quickly if you do this diet properly. So - how do you know how much to reduce? I am on Lyxumia, Levemir, Metformin, Amlopidine, Propranalol, Olmesartan, and Rosuvstatin (yes, I rattle). There is no point in asking my doctor or diabetic nurse, as they want to control my blood glucose with drugs, whereas I want to deal with my insulin resistance and all the associated problems, and ideally get my diabetes in remission.
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I have no experience of any pharmaceutical regime, so anything I say must be taken as my thought process and not instructions!

The most important thing for you to be doing is testing, testing, testing to see where your bloods are and that will probably inform you of what may need to happen.

In other words, if your numbers get too low, then something needs to be adjusted. Which medication is not for me to say, but that really is when you need the support of your medical team.

Perhaps as you reach lower numbers (I'm assuming they are currently running a bit rich?), you need to call your Doc or nurse and ask a question something like, "My numbers seem to be running at x, y or z, I'd like to trim my medication back to ensure I'm not having hypos. How should I go about that?"

That could seem like a reasonable question. If they tell you to eat more, then you will have to have that further discussion, potentially, about your modified diet.

I really do think you need support, bearing in mind insulin is in the mix.
 
I can only talk about what I did with my medication . Like you feel, I don't think my doctors are interested of change of lowering medication...quite opposite. When I started LCHF diet...after first few weeks my blood sugar levels started change drastically. But there was not point FOR ME to contact nurse, I would not be able to see them that quick anyway and I needed to adjust there and then....not eat more and wait to see them.
I was already started to get close to hypo range, and regularly so...as I'm on insulin..that seemed like first point of call to adjust. I was testing my blood sugars many times during day so I knew what was happening to me. My hypos were happening mainly during night time or early morning....so that told me that long acting insulin was the one that I needed less, or I would split the doze so not so much was circulating during night and had little extra in the morning. Taking few units less every other day until the numbers started to level up and no hypos occurred anymore....sometimes I would miss my short acting one if my blood sugars were already lower end of normal and I was eating very little carbs anyway...there was no point to take insulin on top of that.
Tablets however is different story... I'm often trialing how things affect my body...AGAIN....lot of blood testing and writing things down so I can see any changes on paper.
I've been in hospital course for insulin users...so I was 'trained' to adjust my insulin intake for what I've eaten/for my needs...so I felt comfortable tackling this myself without need of nurses assistance. I'm going to see nurse couple weeks time and she will quite likely question everything and anything I've decided for my own benefit:rolleyes:
When I change anything with my medication....I always find out what the medication is for and its purposed effect. After my insulin levels dropped into normal levels with either no insulin injection or very small correction dozes...I dropped my 'gliptins'...I didn't need to depress my appetite, I didn't have cravings in first place, my blood sugars were normal...so I stopped taking them to see what would change...=nothing:rolleyes:
So that's my story....BUT I don't even know what half of your medicines are for and they are supposed to do....so I cannot comment what you could/should do.
All I can say...educate yourself about every medicine you take...carry on with your new found diet...make appointment to see your D.nurse and have all your blood sugar readings as proof what changes you've achieved with you and question her. Ask...all the 'what if' questions...if you attention is to able to take less medication,make that very clear, you will need show that you can do it and you have need for it...and then you insist some advise which way to go about it.
I'm 'bad' patient...I have habit of taking myself off from meds and tell doctor later on when I see him..but I always show proof for it....blood pressure meds, I measured and had tests results written down from quite long period...and doctor agreed there was no need.
Statins....well.....I'm yet to see doctor who is not trying to 'sell' them, but I had such a bad side effects from them in past so now I'm just refusing from them point blank..
Metformin...that I will keep, as it does have purpose for other things than just diabetes control and I think I need them for time being.
Insulin...I'm still taking it...but only as and when there is need...dozes are small and occasional
My body..my decisions...but I also have to put hard work for it to keep things under control, as long they are, no doctor/nurse have point to argue with it.
I keep food diary..I record all my changes and effects to them afterward...write down everything I eat, my test results, weight, blood pressure, suggestions for myself what to do and what not to do, how I feel, 'time of month, 'loo visits'....anything and everything that is relevant. I can then adjust what needs to be done or I soon see what I should not have done...and it is good proof for doctor/nurse that I'm taking things seriously.
Though last time I saw doctor and showed my diary he asked "don't you have record book to write just numbers?"...'yes I do, but they are just numbers and there is no room to explain why the numbers ended up to be so..' So he shut up :rolleyes:
Now I'm that little bit wiser....I have print out of 'numbers' with graphs..it should make it all much easier for them to see ;)
 
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Totto said:
Hi @nannoo_bird you need to test frequently in order to see how you react and whatever you do, don't go cold turkey low carb, take it in steps. Metformin shouldn't be a problem though.

Can you test BG at home?

I think it's a disgrace that your Dr and nurse leave you without help in this case. It's your body and your diabetes but it's their job to help you.
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Yes, it is a disgrace, but I live in the sticks, so have no choice. I do test my BG at home, but the cholesterol and any other blood tests will have to be done at the surgery on my insistence.
 
Thank you so much for taking the time to write such an interesting reply. I really admire your ability to do as you do. My life seems to be so hectic and chaotic that I can't see myself being so organised. I have to travel a long way and see a doctor privately to get any proper information. I also have Hashimoto's (hypothyroid) but my doctors won't treat it until my BGs are regular, meantime I am suffering all sorts of symptoms including a terrible memory, which means I forget to take my drugs sometimes. My GP isn't interested and we are given 7 minutes per appointment, and you can only discuss one issue.
 
nannoo_bird said:
My docs are hopeless when it comes to this, and I can only see my diabetic nurse every two months. Difficult.
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Yes, it is difficult, but without blood tests you won't know what's needed. As I lost weight my medications actually pushed my blood pressure UP rather than down and I ended up being rushed to hospital by ambulance for a suspected stroke - I needed ECGs, MRI and lots of changes to my meds - all of which can't be done without a doctor on board. I struggle to get appointments with my GP surgery but I've spoken to the practice manager several times and now see the same GP every time who understands what's gone on recently. Good luck!
 
Alzebra said:
Yes, it is difficult, but without blood tests you won't know what's needed. As I lost weight my medications actually pushed my blood pressure UP rather than down and I ended up being rushed to hospital by ambulance for a suspected stroke - I needed ECGs, MRI and lots of changes to my meds - all of which can't be done without a doctor on board. I struggle to get appointments with my GP surgery but I've spoken to the practice manager several times and now see the same GP every time who understands what's gone on recently. Good luck!
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Sadly, I think it sometimes takes a crisis like yours to get decent treatment. Hope you are fine now.
 
nannoo_bird said:
Thank you so much for taking the time to write such an interesting reply. I really admire your ability to do as you do. My life seems to be so hectic and chaotic that I can't see myself being so organised. I have to travel a long way and see a doctor privately to get any proper information. I also have Hashimoto's (hypothyroid) but my doctors won't treat it until my BGs are regular, meantime I am suffering all sorts of symptoms including a terrible memory, which means I forget to take my drugs sometimes. My GP isn't interested and we are given 7 minutes per appointment, and you can only discuss one issue.
Click to expand...
Oh believe me, I'm not organized myself, even it might sound like it. I have everything written down in a small pieces of paper...papers and pens all over the place...:rolleyes: Come end of the evening and I then collect the info from those papers into diary. I used to have trouble of remembering to take my meds too...no matter how hard I tried..had all sorts of systems, alarms etc...but none did work. Then I took myself off from statins because other problems...and 'funny' thing is, my memory has come back...or should I say I've got my brain function, such as it is. I didn't even realize I had lived in kind of 'brain fog', though I did noticed that I had memory issues... I'm convinced it was all down to statins :mad:
I can understand your problem with having to make long way to see doctor AND with GP's short appointment times...like 7 minutes would be enough to get anything sorted (it is just about enough time to write prescription):rolleyes:. My GP will not even deal with my diabetes issues, his opinion is that it is so specialized field that he rather sends me away to see specialist in hospital.
Sounds to me like you don't have much options than learn and look after yourself.
I am bit surprised about not getting treatment for thyroid issues and having to wait for blood glucose levels to regulate. How in earth that can happen if they don't give you appropriate help for it.
I'm glad you are having a go with LCHF...as and when your blood sugars are starting to come down and you feel like you don't know what to do....give a 'shout', ask us again and maybe we can think of something together. I hope do know that we are not allowed or able to give straightforward medical advise...we are not qualified for it (+ forum rules). But certainly a we can have a chat and maybe it will give you some kind of help or reassurance of what you may do to help yourself.
Have you got any routine appointments booked up in near future?
 
Finsky said:
Oh believe me, I'm not organized myself, even it might sound like it. I have everything written down in a small pieces of paper...papers and pens all over the place...:rolleyes: Come end of the evening and I then collect the info from those papers into diary. I used to have trouble of remembering to take my meds too...no matter how hard I tried..had all sorts of systems, alarms etc...but none did work. Then I took myself off from statins because other problems...and 'funny' thing is, my memory has come back...or should I say I've got my brain function, such as it is. I didn't even realize I had lived in kind of 'brain fog', though I did noticed that I had memory issues... I'm convinced it was all down to statins :mad:
I can understand your problem with having to make long way to see doctor AND with GP's short appointment times...like 7 minutes would be enough to get anything sorted (it is just about enough time to write prescription):rolleyes:. My GP will not even deal with my diabetes issues, his opinion is that it is so specialized field that he rather sends me away to see specialist in hospital.
Sounds to me like you don't have much options than learn and look after yourself.
I am bit surprised about not getting treatment for thyroid issues and having to wait for blood glucose levels to regulate. How in earth that can happen if they don't give you appropriate help for it.
I'm glad you are having a go with LCHF...as and when your blood sugars are starting to come down and you feel like you don't know what to do....give a 'shout', ask us again and maybe we can think of something together. I hope do know that we are not allowed or able to give straightforward medical advise...we are not qualified for it (+ forum rules). But certainly a we can have a chat and maybe it will give you some kind of help or reassurance of what you may do to help yourself.
Have you got any routine appointments booked up in near future?
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Finsky, thank you, what a lovely response. I am really touched. I have to make an appointment with the private doctor on Monday, and make a list of all the things I need to talk to her about - as it is private, I get a whole hour!!! Then we will see after that. I will let you all know how things go. SO good to have this forum, sometimes I feel so alone with this disease. Have a lovely weekend.
 
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