LADAs preserving their beta cells

[Ian DP]

Hi Lucy
Good to read your update.
My initial thought is you need to take another unit of insulin at night... If you are in the 7s at night and wake up to upper 5s, then another unit must help.... That's my thinking.
It's kind of strange that you feel Hungary a lot of the time, most, including myself do not get hungry on the LcHf diet. But hopefully bulletproof coffee will help.... Just shows we are all different. Keep up the good work, you are getting there.

 

[LucySW]

Wasn't eating much fat.

 

[LucySW]

The consultant said, In the old days before insulin, the only way diabetics could stay alive was to eat fat and alcohol. Here in DK they used to be prescribed schnapps, and they ate fatty pork skin. I'm feeling these days, same difference for us now -just tank up on fat.

It's a bit revolting.

Have to re-educate myself.

 

[LucySW]

Another new research finding found trawling while I should be starting some work. This study is by a Swiss team. They found that the pancreas can regenerate its beta cells (by alpha-cells converting themselves to beta-cells) even in adults. (Their main finding was that children can do it even better.)

Letter to Nature here , and original reference on Science Daily here.

 

[Spiker]

The consultant said, In the old days before insulin, the only way diabetics could stay alive was to eat fat and alcohol. Here in DK they used to be prescribed schnapps, and they ate fatty pork skin. I'm feeling these days, same difference for us now -just tank up on fat.

It's a bit revolting.

Have to re-educate myself.

We've been conditioned to feel revolted by dietary fat. We've also been conditioned to be revolted by fat people, and to (incorrectly) cross-associate the two. But, go back less than 50 years in our culture and dietary fat was considered highly desirable. Go back 200 years and fatter people were considered more attractive.

Low fat diet, plus carbs = fat person
Fat plus carbs diet = fat person
Low carb diet, plus fat = not-fat person

 

[LucySW]

Low carb diet, plus fat = not-fat person

Yes: that really seems to be true.

On two bulletproof coffees a day now.

 

[Spiker]

Here in DK they used to be prescribed schnapps, and they ate fatty pork skin.

Yum! I may just give up insulin altogether and go on to the old Danish method, it sounds great!

 

[phoenix]

Can't let you get away with that Spiker, do you mean fat like the Kitavans? (other examples can be given!)http://www.staffanlindeberg.com/KitavaPhotos.html
What was the staple food in the UK (and much of Europe) before the mid 20th century (what did all those peasants and working classes revolt over? http://www.ultimatehistoryproject.com/bread.html
(don't bother to read these but if you have time and the interest read this one )
'Diet, Delusion and Diabetes It reminds us that in diabetic diets there has been a cycle of what is in favour; Plus ca change ! It's an interesting article with a brief history of diets and makes what I think are some very pertinent points at the end (and no it doesn't take sides)

 

[Spiker]

Not sure what I'm getting away with there @phoenix?

Yes you can be undernourished on any of those 3 diets. So I should have said "in a surplus economy such as increasingly prevails across the world". ;-)

Thanks for keeping me honest!

 

[paul-1976]

Yum! I may just give up insulin altogether and go on to the old Danish method, it sounds great!

I could go for that too! A hog on the spit roasting away with yummie crackling and plenty of home brewed moonshine! Can think of worse ways of living! LOL
I wonder how 'Big Pharma' would react if we did that!

 

[LucySW]

@Ian DP, @Spiker, @smidge, Got my new HbA1c today. Slightly disappointed: it's 49 / 6.6%. My average BS level is much lower, more like 5.8. So I still have some way to go to be in the 5% club.

Observations:

1) I don't know where those higher numbers are coming from, and a perhaps I should lay my hands on the Libre and find out.


2) I have not managed to get my average BS down to Bernstein levels, 4.6 before and 5.6 after eating. What's more, it's been a struggle to avoid snacking on the Dr B regime ( it's snacking that screws my BS levels: I *have* to recover to pre-prandial levels after meals, or my insulin response the second time is up in the high 7s). Bumping up the fat I eat makes it possible, but I still get hungry.

3) As I haven't met my Dr B targets, I haven't met my goal of fending off pancreas damage either. :-(

4) one or two times last week while travelling I got a mystery 10 when I shouldn't. Of course I don't know what was in the things I ate, and BS went back down to normal afterwards, but it seems to me that I am getting less carb-tolerant than ever. This also is a bit down-making.

:-(

Have to think where to go from here tomorrow.

Lucy

 

[Ian DP]

Hi Lucy
That's disappointing, after working so hard to get your BG levels down.

Do you ever get lows? If you are never go below 5 then I guess you should be upping the insulin.

I do find snacking increases BG levels, I am lucky in that I now never get hungry between meals, I 'bulk' up with protein and fat at breakfast and lunch, and this sees me through the day.... This seems to work for me

Travelling can be difficult, especially when travelling with others. Luckily in the UK there are plenty of pubs, and 99% of pubs will swap chips for salad, making lchf achievable.

 

[smidge]

Hi Lucy!

That's disappointing for you. Trouble is with testing, it misses so much of the BG fluctuation as it's just a point in time. That's why I'm so desperate to get my hands on the Libre!

I think you'll be suffering from one of two things; either you're having higher levels overnight that you don't know about or you're spiking 4 or 5 hours after eating due to the slow release of the protein. Obviously you could try testing at different times to see if you can work it out.

In terms of insulin doses, are you still on only one injection? If so, I'd move to two injections - morning and before bed tends to work well for intermediate insulin - I would be tempted to split but increase the overall dose. Obviously that depends on whether you're experiencing any lows.

If you keep getting post prandial 10s, you might need to start thinking about adding a unit or two of bolus - although I doubt they'd be willing to prescribe that for you yet.

In terms of food, I think you need to find a diet that doesn't leave you hungry otherwise you won't stick to it long term. I'm not usually hungry although I sometimes think I'm hungry when I'm bored - I don't feel hungry if I'm busy.

The thing is, diabetes is a marathon rather than a sprint, so try not to get down about it when your levels are not what you'd hoped. Get your spreadsheet out, look for patterns and work out a plan for some small improvements.

I hope you're feeling more positive about things in the morning.

Smidge

 

[Spiker]

Hey @smidge

Sorry to hear all that mate. With what you are trying to achieve, def get a Libre or other CGM if you can afford it. We can't all be Bernstein - far from it.

For snacking, a big bad issue for me too, can you try having more fat in meals, and preparing fat-based snacks for between meals?

 

[LucySW]

I've ordered a Libre. For a couple of months anyway.

It's funny, my phase 1/bolus-response insulin is dying FAST. But my basal/background insulin seems absolutely fine and dandy. But any mistake eating, and Wham, up go the sugars. Then by four or five hrs, it's down to 5.6 again, which is fine. My body just doesn't want me to eat ...

 

[smidge]

Hi Lucy!

That's the usual pattern of LADA progressing unfortunately. Your intermediate acting insulin will also be masking some of the progression. If you didn't take it for a few days, you'd be surprised at how high your BG would spike.

Smidge

 

[Indy51]

I was listening to an interview with Dr Datis Kharrazian today as part of the autoimmune online summit and he was talking about research he is carrying out with Dr Aristo Vojdani (immunologist). The interview was specifically about autoimmune thyroid conditions, but he mentioned that they have just finished mapping all foods that cause autoimmune responses that attack beta cells and said they should have a specific diet for Type 1's within the next year. One of his comments was that the research proved that many so called 'safe' low GI foods can provoke an autoimmune response. Should be worthwhile reading the research when it's published.

 

[LucySW]

Yes! Please post on it when something comes up?

 

[Indy51]

Yes! Please post on it when something comes up?

Will do Lucy. His website is: http://drknews.com/

 

[smidge]

That is interesting @Indy51. I get a dreadful BG response to anything oat-based - much worse than wheat although wheat is pretty dire too. I wonder if this is connected. As a low-carber, you'd think I'd have realised by now that I should totally eliminate grain, but I still insist on adding small amounts such as the odd ryvita. I know what that 6.2g carb does to my BG but I still somehow think of it as healthy. It'll be interesting to see what the research concludes.

Smidge