LCHF and depression

[Rosbif]

Hi all,

In the very likely scenario of a diagnosis of type 2 diabetes (I have my blood test results and need to get an appointment with the doc to discuss them) I've been eating LCHF for the past couple of weeks. Within the same period I've also started feeling very depressed and weepy which is a shame as otherwise I feel OK, apart from a bit tired. Has anyone else experienced the same thing?
Thinking about it, I'm probably eating too much protein and so maybe need to up the fat. Either that or I need to up the carbs a little bit?

I've ordered a glucose meter which should arrive next week, so can't test anything for the moment.

For info, there are other potential causes: insomnia (but that predates the LCHF), new blood pressure drug (enalapril-HCTZ - started at the same time as the LCHF), the mini Pill (started 6 weeks ago).

It'd be great to hear your experiences in relation to the diet, I know you can't really say anything regarding the medication I'm on.

Have a great weekend!

 

[urbanracer]

Oh I dunno, I think there are things we can say about your medication........................

 

[Rosbif]

Oh I dunno, I think there are things we can say about your medication........................


View attachment 17936

I wasn't sure whether it was allowed to comment on medication but it's fine by me I'm hoping that it is the Pill and not the diet.

 

[urbanracer]

I think as long as medication advice is not too specific or detailed it's OK.

Some people get something called carb flu, but the body usually adjusts to lower carbs after 1 or 2 weeks, so how long have you been feeling depressed ?

 

[Rosbif]

I think as long as medication advice is not too specific or detailed it's OK.

Some people get something called carb flu, but the body usually adjusts to lower carbs after 1 or 2 weeks, so how long have you been feeling depressed ?

For roughly the same period, 1 - 2 weeks

 

[Finsky]

We all react differently to different things...but, looking at your list of possibilities...mini pill (with combination of insomnia) would be quite likely to affect my moods. Over the years, one particular 'pill' turned me weeping-raging-lunatic and the effect from previous 'pill' happened quite quickly too and after dropping that medication off..the change back into 'normal' was quick too.
If anything...diet changes usually have positive effect to moods..saying that, try to convince that to those who are on receiving end when hungry diabetic is feeling bit .....
Do you suffer with any other symptoms that was listed on urbanracer's post? There is that many 'pill' options for hormones, that is worth of trialing something else.

 

[BooJewels]

mini pill (with combination of insomnia) would be quite likely to affect my moods.

Me too. I've never been able to take anything affecting hormones - they turn my either suicidal or homicidal. Even on a very low dose and after a very short time. So your other meds would seem more likely culprits to me than a change in foods. Read the patient information leaflets included with the items you've been prescribed - I bet you'll find some clues there.

As @urbanracer said, I had carb flu for a few days when I first dropped a lot more carbs (I personally can't maintain a diet that low, I simply don't feel well on it and I'd already been moderate carbing for over 20 years) - but that was physical rather than emotional - just like flu - lethargic, tired, achey, woolly-brained etc. Then I woke up one morning feeling better - probably at about day 12-ish.

Thinking about it, I'm probably eating too much protein and so maybe need to up the fat. Either that or I need to up the carbs a little bit?

I think of protein as slow release carbs - it turns to glucose eventually albeit at a lower, slower rate. I probably eat too much protein myself, but upping the fat is necessary to balance the energy lost from carbs. You'll be hungry and lacking in energy without the right balance.

Have you tried putting your numbers into this calculator - it will tell you what balance of carb/protein/fat you need to either maintain weight, lose it etc. You also need to find your personal carb threshold - one that you feel well on and can maintain long-term. I personally can't go as hardcore as many here do, but I've already been doing it for over 20 years and know I have to work with a level I can stick at.

http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/DietMakeupCalc.php

 

[Hedonista]

Could the prospect of a diagnosis of diabetes be affecting you? I was really upset and scared when all this started for me.

 

[Brunneria]

If your new diet has caused a significant drop in blood glucose, that can make you feel 'weird'. It is because our bodies adjust to whatever blood glucose we are used to - and that becomes 'normal' - but it doesn't mean it is good for us!

When our bg steps down a chunk, it can take a while to adjust to the new, better 'normal'.
My experience was that I felt wobbly and somehow 'unsafe' and vulnerable for a bit. But after the adjustment period was over, I felt great. Better.

Also worth bearing in mind that however gentle the diagnosis, and however much we may be expecting it, being diagnosed with what is, essentially, a life changing condition is going to hit hard. There are weeks, probably months of adjustment ahead, and we all feel differently, on different days. It is only months later that you will turn round and say 'ah! I was down, back then, wasn't I?' or 'All that anger was probably just adjusting to the diagnosis...'

Well worth having a google for 'The five stages of grief' - because you will probably go through all of them over the next few months.

At the moment, on the forum, there is a huge focus on weight loss leading to possible reversal, and a sense that this is something that can be beaten into submission. I get that. And I applaud it. But if we just focus on getting rid of it, we are glossing over a few things, such as that this diagnosis itself is a BIG THING. An emotional watergate. It highlights all the things we did to lead up to the diagnosis, and is a shocking reminder of our own mortality. It is also a kick up the backside to make some huge changes and get our lives, exercise and diet in order. None of those are easy, and they all take some major emotional adjustment.

I wouldn't blame the change in eating habits for your low mood. I would just carry on, allow yourself to feel the way you feel, do the best you can (mood, food, rest, hobbies, work) at any given moment, and be gentle with yourself.

Then, in a few days, weeks, or months, you will look back and say 'huh. I feel like I have come out the other side of it.'

 

[Rosbif]

We all react differently to different things...but, looking at your list of possibilities...mini pill (with combination of insomnia) would be quite likely to affect my moods. Over the years, one particular 'pill' turned me weeping-raging-lunatic and the effect from previous 'pill' happened quite quickly too and after dropping that medication off..the change back into 'normal' was quick too.
If anything...diet changes usually have positive effect to moods..saying that, try to convince that to those who are on receiving end when hungry diabetic is feeling bit .....
Do you suffer with any other symptoms that was listed on urbanracer's post? There is that many 'pill' options for hormones, that is worth of trialing something else.

I suffer from one of the other symptoms on the list + one which isn't on the list. I think I'll stop taking it as of this evening and see if my mood improves. I did take a combined pill for a year twenty years ago which coincided with a massive period of depression. I never made the link at the time.

 

[Rosbif]

Me too. I've never been able to take anything affecting hormones - they turn my either suicidal or homicidal. Even on a very low dose and after a very short time. So your other meds would seem more likely culprits to me than a change in foods. Read the patient information leaflets included with the items you've been prescribed - I bet you'll find some clues there.

As @urbanracer said, I had carb flu for a few days when I first dropped a lot more carbs (I personally can't maintain a diet that low, I simply don't feel well on it and I'd already been moderate carbing for over 20 years) - but that was physical rather than emotional - just like flu - lethargic, tired, achey, woolly-brained etc. Then I woke up one morning feeling better - probably at about day 12-ish.


I think of protein as slow release carbs - it turns to glucose eventually albeit at a lower, slower rate. I probably eat too much protein myself, but upping the fat is necessary to balance the energy lost from carbs. You'll be hungry and lacking in energy without the right balance.

Have you tried putting your numbers into this calculator - it will tell you what balance of carb/protein/fat you need to either maintain weight, lose it etc. You also need to find your personal carb threshold - one that you feel well on and can maintain long-term. I personally can't go as hardcore as many here do, but I've already been doing it for over 20 years and know I have to work with a level I can stick at.

http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/DietMakeupCalc.php

I think I'm like you with hormones. I'll stop taking it and find another solution. Life's too short and there's enough going wrong with me as it is!

Thanks for the link and I'll try upping my fats.

 

[Rosbif]

Could the prospect of a diagnosis of diabetes be affecting you? I was really upset and scared when all this started for me.

Yes it is a little bit.
Since last November I've been back and forth to the doctor's for various small issues and was just getting over the latest one when I got the blood test results that I'll think will get me diagnosed (no doubt following a second test). This will no doubt trigger another series of consultations (eyes, more blood tests, etc) and I've really had enough of doctors, ungrateful as that may sound.
I also don't have my driver's licence yet and I've since learned that in France you have to declare certain illnesses when you take the practical test following which you'll have to attend a medical visit and be deemed "apt" to drive. You then get a temporary licence for a period of up to 5 years and then it's another medical visit, ad nauseum. There are plenty of people on the road who are clearly unfit to drive but they are allowed to carry on...
I'm either feeling quite optimistic that a major lifestyle kick up the ass can only be a good thing (I try to think of the weight I'll lose, the improvement in my wellbeing, appearance, etc) or I feel afraid for example I'll lie in bed at night and almost be able to feel the poisonous blood pumping through my veins.

 

[Prem51]

@Rosbif, I wouldn't think it would be LCHF that is affecting you too. Have you experienced depression before? It would effect your eating and sleep a lot. I have had seven episodes of serious depression over the last 30 years. The last one probably contributed to my diabetes as I was comfort eating, self-medicating with beer, and lacking any motivation to go out or exercise.

Going on the LCHF approach to eating has helped me to come out of the depression I think. Though I might have been due to come out of it anyway, or it might be due to the anti-depressants. But the LCHF has contributed in that I feel better about myself after losing 35lbs, feeling fitter and more energetic, getting out more to exercise - and I can now see my cheekbones again!

 

[catherinecherub]

A diagnosis of diabetes is a shock @Rosbif and can be likened to a grieving process, a normal reaction to an abnormal situation. You usually go through the 5 stages of grief as with any long term condition because you are grieving for the life you had before. (Denial, anger, bargaining, depression, acceptance).
People will not see any difference in your appearance so they will have a job to understand. If diabetes meant wearing a plaster caste somewhere on your body then it would be a visible condition.

 

[Rosbif]

If your new diet has caused a significant drop in blood glucose, that can make you feel 'weird'. It is because our bodies adjust to whatever blood glucose we are used to - and that becomes 'normal' - but it doesn't mean it is good for us!

When our bg steps down a chunk, it can take a while to adjust to the new, better 'normal'.
My experience was that I felt wobbly and somehow 'unsafe' and vulnerable for a bit. But after the adjustment period was over, I felt great. Better.

Also worth bearing in mind that however gentle the diagnosis, and however much we may be expecting it, being diagnosed with what is, essentially, a life changing condition is going to hit hard. There are weeks, probably months of adjustment ahead, and we all feel differently, on different days. It is only months later that you will turn round and say 'ah! I was down, back then, wasn't I?' or 'All that anger was probably just adjusting to the diagnosis...'

Well worth having a google for 'The five stages of grief' - because you will probably go through all of them over the next few months.

At the moment, on the forum, there is a huge focus on weight loss leading to possible reversal, and a sense that this is something that can be beaten into submission. I get that. And I applaud it. But if we just focus on getting rid of it, we are glossing over a few things, such as that this diagnosis itself is a BIG THING. An emotional watergate. It highlights all the things we did to lead up to the diagnosis, and is a shocking reminder of our own mortality. It is also a kick up the backside to make some huge changes and get our lives, exercise and diet in order. None of those are easy, and they all take some major emotional adjustment.

I wouldn't blame the change in eating habits for your low mood. I would just carry on, allow yourself to feel the way you feel, do the best you can (mood, food, rest, hobbies, work) at any given moment, and be gentle with yourself.

Then, in a few days, weeks, or months, you will look back and say 'huh. I feel like I have come out the other side of it.'

It's weird, I do feel that I'm running on "cleaner" fuel, feel a bit "lighter", etc but there is also some tiredness. I suppose some tweaks are in order, especially once the meter arrives.

Yes, the actual confirmation in the form of a diagnosis, when it comes, is going to hit hard. I will feel ashamed and not want to tell anyone (my husband obviously knows). I'm also relatively young (37) and feel like the interesting and fun part of my life is already over. I know that's wrong but I can feel a door closing.

This forum is a lifesaver and the success stories give me a lot of hope. I always have a tab open and come back from time to time to read a bit here and a bit there ;-)

Stress is another problem - I'm a real stresshead and I know stress can raise BG levels. So I'm going to have to learn to mellow out, too!

 

[Rosbif]

@Rosbif, I wouldn't think it would be LCHF that is affecting you too. Have you experienced depression before? It would effect your eating and sleep a lot. I have had seven episodes of serious depression over the last 30 years. The last one probably contributed to my diabetes as I was comfort eating, self-medicating with beer, and lacking any motivation to go out or exercise.

Going on the LCHF approach to eating has helped me to come out of the depression I think. Though I might have been due to come out of it anyway, or it might be due to the anti-depressants. But the LCHF has contributed in that I feel better about myself after losing 35lbs, feeling fitter and more energetic, getting out more to exercise - and I can now see my cheekbones again!

Hi, yes, I've had depression before, starting from when I was a teenager. I've taken anti-depressants, even saw a psychiatrist once. I've done a lot of comfort eating during periods of depression, or stress. That's in addition to just being greedy...

Congrats on the weight loss!

 

[Rosbif]

A diagnosis of diabetes is a shock @Rosbif and can be likened to a grieving process, a normal reaction to an abnormal situation. You usually go through the 5 stages of grief as with any long term condition because you are grieving for the life you had before. (Denial, anger, bargaining, depression, acceptance).
People will not see any difference in your appearance so they will have a job to understand. If diabetes meant wearing a plaster caste somewhere on your body then it would be a visible condition.

I can see what you mean already. Husband is laid up right now with a knee injury - his leg is all bandaged up. While I'm running around doing this that and the other looking healthy enough on the outside but wondering what's going on inside.

 

[ExD]

If you're sensitive to hormones, the pill will most certainly have contributed to the depression. I had to find an alternative because it affected me that way too. But do also watch your weight as well - whether it was comfort eating from feeling 'down' or just the physiological effects of the pill I don't know - but I gained a stone and a half without looking even though I was on LCFH and my other half was losing weight steadily on the same food (and a lot more of it).

 

[Prem51]

Hi @ExD and welcome to the forum!

 

[Robbity]

I can see what you mean already. Husband is laid up right now with a knee injury - his leg is all bandaged up. While I'm running around doing this that and the other looking healthy enough on the outside but wondering what's going on inside.

That can be a problem with diabetes - it can be an invisible condition. You've got a lot on your mind both with your husband's injury and your own diagnosis so it's not surprising that you're feeling depressed. It definitely takes time to come to terms with it but remember - in spite of all the ignorant blame we may get, it's not our fault that we get diabetes. If we weren't predisposed to get it - we wouldn't have.

Robbity