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Lchf But Not Keto .... Possible?

ResistingResistanceUK

Well-Known Member
Messages
50
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
Hi everyone, I’ve been reading about LCHF and I’m wondering if it’s possible to do this without Ketosis? Only because I don’t think I’d be able to stick to 1 or 0g of carbs - that seems extreme to me.

Does anyone know if it’s possible to have a more balanced approach to the low carbs side of things?
 
What I follow is what works s for me. I eat to my meter. I do use keto recipes, I find that a lot of recipes described as low carb are too high for me.
 
xfieldok said:
What I follow is what works s for me. I eat to my meter. I do use keto recipes, I find that a lot of recipes described as low carb are too high for me.
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Yes I guess that’s an important point. I’m yet to experiment with that! I want to do that as soon as I get one. Thank you for replying!
 
The term ketogenic is often misused to mean low carb. To get to a state of ketosis seems to require a diet of less than 20g of carbs a day. Many of us do not go that low, do not go into ketosis but still have had great success with controlling BG and losing weight. Low carb is considered to be less than 100g a day although you may well need to reduce that to get the BG control you need.
 
Download the mySugr app. Record your numbers and food including portion size. It really will help you get to grips with things.
 

Yes that’s what I was hoping! Thank you!
 
I started low carbing as soon as I was diagnosed in May ‘17. I did start on Metformin at the same time but as that only has a minimal effect I believe the main part of my success is due to my diet. I started on 100g carbs per day then reduced to 50 - 70g at six weeks when my blood sugars plateaued. I have since New Year naturally lowered further and rarely exceed 50g per day now.
 
I can mirror @Rachox - I was diagnosed in March and immediately started low-carbing, aiming at under 100g a day but I quickly saw that aim drop to 50g and I rarely need to work to keep under that now. I find that many days my carbs are under 20g just through routine and not planning now. I've not bothered getting into ketosis or having that as an aim and I reversed my A1c from 60 to 41 in 5 months.
 
Ketosis is the process of using fats rather than glucose for energy, and it is something most people do for a certain amount of time each day - it doesn't require that you eat minute amounts of carbs for it to happen, but the term is often used as a shorthand description of a low carb diet which has few enough carbs to ensure the process begins fairly promptly.
If your aim is to reduce your blood glucose to normal numbers, then for most type twos all you need to do is get a meter and reduce your intake of carbs to the amount which causes an increase of two whole numbers or less before and after eating. That seems to be the point at which things begin to turn around - the idea of having to eat zero carbs is not something most people would advise - and for most people it is entirely unnecessary.
My personal level of carbs to restore normal BG was 50 gm per day.
I avoid densely carb foods and stick to things 10 percent carb or less and as I can't cope with as many gm of carbs in the morning, I eat perhaps 10 gm early in the day and the rest later. I only need to eat twice a day.
 

I'm interested in what you have been reading because you certainly aren't describing low carb when you talk about 0-1g of carbs per day that is virtually impossible for anyone simply because quite a lot of even animal foods have some carbs.. cream for example.
As it says above Low carb is usually defined as fewer than 130g per day. To "guarantee" ketosis you want to aim for fewer than 20g per day. If you have weight to lose then I would personally recommend aiming for ketosis sooner rather than later and I did the opposite of everyone above and cut carbs to an absolute minimum to start with. I got over the addiction withdrawal fairly quickly by doing that and intended to add carbs in at a later date but never did. If you are an "all or nothing" person then I reckon that's the best way to go. If you are more a little by little sort then slowly cutting carbs may be more suitable but the effects will be slower to manifest themselves.
 
I believe I cycle in and out of mild ketosis off and on during the day, for example, I usually stop eating by mid afternoon and unless I've gone crazy with carbs, if I measure ketones before bed they will range anywhere from 0.4 to 1.6. I'm usually on at least 50g of carb a day, sometimes up to 70g. I think all sorts of things play into whether you're in ketosis or not. It's not like an on/off switch. It's not something you need to necessarily think about or monitor. It's a perfectly normal human state, especially at times when you're not eating.
 
Interesting! I guess as a person, I am risk averse so anything that sounds extreme tends to scare me a bit. I like balance.

I got that figure from a Facebook group about diabetic Keto I joined see attached photo.

Thank you all for sharing your experiences!
 

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There is an awful lot of **** on the internet. Be cautious.

We do what we do what we do for the sake of our health.

Edited by moderator for language.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
That I would imagine is from a US site .. they nutritional labels are per "portion" which can be any size so may be valid for there. For UK info I try to only have things that are 5g or carbs per 100g (with a few exceptions like Oppo ice cream and dark chocolate).. others here look for fewer than 10g per 100g and manage perfectly well.
 
In addition to the nutritional information, you should always check ingredients. At Easter I bought a guinea fowl with a mushroom stuffing. 1.4 carbs. Wow! A good 2 slices for me!

I had a massive spike. Fished the packet out of the bin. The first ingredient after the meat was glucose syrup. Lesson learned.
 
ResistingResistanceUK said:
Interesting! I guess as a person, I am risk averse so anything that sounds extreme tends to scare me a bit. I like balance.
Click to expand...

I get an immediate reaction when I see the word "balance" when it comes to referring to ways of eating. Because part of what I now see as extraordinary absolutely not-science and evidence-based dietary advice from my own coming of age in the 70s, and, well - in an extreme - now - is the very carb-rich food pyramid, which was and is referred to as 'a balanced diet'. Argh!

I find myself discussing this, often, after I have been talking about lower-carbing as a first response to blood glucose issues and hypertension, when out there in the world. It takes a lot to convince many people that the conventional food pyramid was a big non-fat lie that probably got them into the health trouble they are in now. Especially when medical professionals are still teaching the soundness of a 'balanced diet' according to grain-rich carbs as the base of every so-called healthy diet. And that is without the current misinformation about eating meat!

Because of this I hugely mistrust the word 'balanced' when it comes to anything dietary!

But, back to the real point of this discussion - interesting to go LCHF and mistrust the perfectly normal physical response of going in and out of ketosis. It is how we as a species survived and survive any period of not eating, or low-carb eating. Without it we would not exist. And it is what many insulin resistant type twos have gotten on the wrong side of (ie not going into ketosis or a fat burning state enough for good health, with constantly too high firstly insulin, then blood glucose, in the body).

Going into ketosis is not extreme, or unbalanced, but a perfectly normal human physical response where food, or no food, is concerned.
 
I absolutely agree. Recommended reading Dr Michael Mosley's 8 week sugar diet and Dr Jason Fung The Diabetes Code.
 
I agree with @Indy51 and @AloeSvea - I go in and out of ketosis all the time, eating (generally) less than 50g carbs a day. I ate 20-25g a day for a short period to ensure I got into ketosis quckly, but I believe that anyone on a low carb diet, who loses weight, has plenty of energy, isn't hungry or craving carbs all the time, has a nice clear head and can get and keep their glucose levels down and stable, has probably been producing ketones and is keto/fat adapted whether they know it or not. It's (as others have already told you) a completely normal state, and is how your body should and will behave unless you regularly feed it on large amounts of high carb foods. And for me ketosis is a means to an end - not an end in itself as some "ketone chasers" on the web seem to believe. So just use a meter to monitor your glucose levels, and use those results to determine how many or few carbs you need to eat to produce the results you/re aiming for and ignore all the nonsence about needing to eat an impossibly low amount of carbs.
 
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