PCOS and insulin resistance

[Brunneria]

Hi and welcome @lacerta

Well done on the 5kg loss! That is a great achievement.

I am afraid that measuring insulin resistance isn't something that is tested. It is possible to use an insulin clamp test and see how much insulin is being produced, but that doesn't measure the insulin resistance. Plus, I don't think the insulin clamp test is available in the UK.

I guesstimate my level of insulin resistance, after years of this, and years of self testing my blood glucose using a blood glucose meter. But it is VERY rough and ready and I am not sure that any scientist would accept my methods! lol.

There are a number of things that lower insulin resistance (for most of us). These include exercise, low carbing, fasting. And if your insulin resistance is caused by drugs, then stopping taking the drugs, of course. But don't do that without medical advice. Eating Ketogenically can sometimes raise IR a little.

I have noticed that for my body, if I exercise enough or fast, then my baseline blood glucose readings tend to drop, often in proportion to the amount of fasting, and the amount of exercise. So I take this to mean that my IR has dropped too. Then, when my body recovers from the exercise or I start eating again, my baseline bg rises back to its usual levels. While maintaining a low carb diet.

You may be wondering what I mean by 'baseline blood glucose readings'? They are the lowest reading my blood glucose falls to in a day, not counting morning readings that are affected by Dawn Phenomenon. My lowest daily readings are usually around late afternoon, before my LC evening meal, because my IR usually drifts downwards during the afternoon.

For example. My baseline bg reading on a sedentary office day would typically be 5.6mmol/l before dinner. But on a fasting day, when I am able to walk the dogs at lunchtime, my baseline bg reading would typically be as low as 4.5mmol/l.

I interpret this as representing a corresponding drop in IR. But don't quote me! This is me observing MY body and extrapolating. I have never found this discussed in ANY scientific literature.

Hope that helps.

 

[Mimi's]

I'm also newbie suffering from PCOS. It's two month from initial diagnosis, I have managed to put down 5kgs, but it's really difficult. I still have 50 kg to loose. I'm really happy that I have managed to get out of severe sugar cravings with LCHF diet.
How do you know about insuline resistance, how often do you check it?

Hi!
Your Doctor must have given you a date for follow up. Usually after three months of medicines,lifestyle changes etc. You will be asked to test your blood hourly ....first after 12 hour fasting, then after an hour a sugary syrup will be given and after an hour of that...like that your blood will be tested to see how your body is reacting to glucose. If there is excess sugar that means your body is unable to process the glucose for energy. It has become resistant to the insulin which helps push glucose in to the cell. That excess sugar then gets stored as fat. All this is strictly monitored by the doc as this is different from blood sugar testing at home. The doc then adjusts the medicines or asks you to modify diet etc. Do talk to your doc to get further clarifications.

 

[lacerta]

Hi!
Your Doctor must have given you a date for follow up. Usually after three months of medicines,lifestyle changes etc. You will be asked to test your blood hourly ....first after 12 hour fasting, then after an hour a sugary syrup will be given and after an hour of that...like that your blood will be tested to see how your body is reacting to glucose. If there is excess sugar that means your body is unable to process the glucose for energy. It has become resistant to the insulin which helps push glucose in to the cell. That excess sugar then gets stored as fat. All this is strictly monitored by the doc as this is different from blood sugar testing at home. The doc then adjusts the medicines or asks you to modify diet etc. Do talk to your doc to get further clarifications.

I have follow up 6 month after initial diagnosis. At the beggining I was tested for fasting glucose, fasting insulin, HbA1 and will have those retested. No glucose tolerance test however. I'm not UK, I'm from Europe.

 

[ickihun]

I'm finding reducing my protein intake on relaxed lchf I'm losing weight very slowly, no matter how much insulin i take. I love fish/seafood and most meats more than veg but I've managed to push the veggies in. But under duress.
Its a fine line between losing and gaining for me.
I'm easily distracted which this week has been a huge distraction.... but that's life.
In the past any distraction was enough of an excuse but not now. I struggle some days but nothing can distract me from taking measures to lose weight in a safe way for me. I'm on a mission, again.

I just wanted to refresh this post too.
I've gone back on metformin, now long term, and I'm losing weight again. Even on insulin injections.
I solely believe metformin is my saviour in insulin resistance.
I feel I need to help others tolerate it as its too good a drug to disregard duevto being a tablet.
If it was reclassified to a supplement would more be willing to take it?
I think the nut allergy treatment would suit metformin side affect sufferers?

 

[RobS1]

Hi all,

Just signed up to engage with PCOS people to seek support in helping my wife, & I, learn how to control/regulate diet and weight loss to enable us to progress with fertility treatment.

My wife was diagnosed with PCOS many years ago whilst in her teens. We have been to several consultations in relation to PCOS, weight loss (dietitian), and fertility over the years but never really had any detailed support and information about the condition and the effect it has on weight gain and infertility amongst other psychological issues. I'm now pushing 40 and the desire to have children of our own is really strong, yet this barrier of multiple issue's is preventing that from happening.

What I am hoping to gain from this (my wife does not know that I am doing this!) is an understanding into the nutritional side of aiding the weight loss for my wife to help her get to the next BMI stage where the medical system will support her further with fertility treatment. In a recent phone call with a fertility nurse a spanner was thrown in the works in relation to carbs and I think what I picked up from the information is that the sugar content (of natural ingredients) of the carbohydrates is the factor we need to consider e.g. sugar content in dry pasta is lower than that of rice but has a similar carbohydrate level per gram, therefore the carb percentage per gram is not necessarily the problem. Does that make sense to anyone or has anyone been told the same?

I am also hoping to find and structure a diet/meal plan if anyone has any suggestions on that please. My wife does not like cooking in the slightest so I do all the cooking but prefer to cook with raw ingredients over processed foods (labelled healthy or not). I usually go to BBC good food for recipe's etc as you can search for idea's with key words but when searching PCOS there is some generalised information item that mentions PCOS but is mainly about cravings during pregnancy - bit of a kick to the face! I've tried looking for PCOS diet plans etc with general web searches but as ever, everything is locked behind a subscription service or expensive one-off fee which I resent paying for as there are no guarantees.

Any help anyone can offer is greatly appreciated and thank you in advance!

Rob

 

[bulkbiker]

Hi all,

Just signed up to engage with PCOS people to seek support in helping my wife, & I, learn how to control/regulate diet and weight loss to enable us to progress with fertility treatment.

My wife was diagnosed with PCOS many years ago whilst in her teens. We have been to several consultations in relation to PCOS, weight loss (dietitian), and fertility over the years but never really had any detailed support and information about the condition and the effect it has on weight gain and infertility amongst other psychological issues. I'm now pushing 40 and the desire to have children of our own is really strong, yet this barrier of multiple issue's is preventing that from happening.

What I am hoping to gain from this (my wife does not know that I am doing this!) is an understanding into the nutritional side of aiding the weight loss for my wife to help her get to the next BMI stage where the medical system will support her further with fertility treatment. In a recent phone call with a fertility nurse a spanner was thrown in the works in relation to carbs and I think what I picked up from the information is that the sugar content (of natural ingredients) of the carbohydrates is the factor we need to consider e.g. sugar content in dry pasta is lower than that of rice but has a similar carbohydrate level per gram, therefore the carb percentage per gram is not necessarily the problem. Does that make sense to anyone or has anyone been told the same?

I am also hoping to find and structure a diet/meal plan if anyone has any suggestions on that please. My wife does not like cooking in the slightest so I do all the cooking but prefer to cook with raw ingredients over processed foods (labelled healthy or not). I usually go to BBC good food for recipe's etc as you can search for idea's with key words but when searching PCOS there is some generalised information item that mentions PCOS but is mainly about cravings during pregnancy - bit of a kick to the face! I've tried looking for PCOS diet plans etc with general web searches but as ever, everything is locked behind a subscription service or expensive one-off fee which I resent paying for as there are no guarantees.

Any help anyone can offer is greatly appreciated and thank you in advance!

Rob

Hi Rob
You have added to a fairly old thread but you and your wife might find this interesting

Dr Jason Fung has written quite a lot about PCOS so a quick google of his name and PCOS will bring yup some useful info.

 

[Brunneria]

My reading on pcos (I have it) has led to a few very simple understandings:

PCOS symptoms often reduce with weight loss.
Weight loss can (usually) be aided by a low carb/keto way of eating, which helps with both weight loss and insulin resistance.
It is significantly more challenging for pcosers to lose weight than for most people, so don’t expect the ‘miraculous’ results that other people (often male) get from low carbing.
Pcosers often benefit from a low carb higher protein diet.

I suggest that you do a good bit of googling on ‘keto’ and ‘pcos’.
You may also find the www.dietdoctor.com website useful for both recipes, menus and information.

Good luck.

 

[AloeSvea]

Hi @RobS1. Old timer PCOSer here, well, 3 decades worth. Type 2 at peri-menopause - that kind of thing.

I am sorry you and your wife have been going through infertility issues to do with this - that's no fun indeed.

I, personally, would see the dietary 'thing' as being about lowering the carbs - whatever low/er carb way of eating you and your wife want to do is your business and to do with your tastes/culture/food philosophy etc. And yes - upping the protein is a good way to do it for sure. It's harder to do it with vegetable protein, but plenty of PCOS and type 2 vegetarians and vegans and so on who do well that way.

As well as LCHFand Keto Ways Of Eating (WOEs), Paleo is a great introduction to going (back) to meat, fish and seafood, and using healthy animal fats and fruit oils (like avocado, olive, and coconut) if you need or want another way? The recipe books and online websites are quite wonderful I think. Many Paleo recipe book writers have a great health focus, and many of those are women (I am thinking of Diane Sanfilipo and Sarah Ballantyne) which is helpful when you have an ovary disease.

And a newish WOE I have taken to recommending to folks who get a bit intimidated by upping their healthy fats is called the P:E diet, or the 'Protein versus Energy diet'. In that one you basically dial up and down your protein by how active or inactive you are - so the carbs and fat are lowest when you are most inactive, and the protein highest, and so on. I find it quite a neat way to look at your meals providing you with energy, and is really simple - the latter bit being why I am recommending it to folks in my life who want to change their WOE, and usually with a weight loss focus. And going for periods of time not eating at all fits in with all these WOEs (called intermittent fasting) if you want to throw that in as well.

I would spend a day or a weekend going online with your wife looking at recipes for different (low-moderate carbing) WOEs, ordering books from the library - that kind of thing - and thinking about how you two want to go ahead with this, regarding meal plans and so on. See it as a food-adventure! I think it's great that you are providing your services as the family cook. As she doesn't like to cook (I don't either) - she will be very happy with that great gift you are offering I expect!