Putting your GP on trial

[Janiept]

I recently saw my GP because of severe breathlessness and also oedema. "Oh you are uffering from anxiety, do some breathing exercises". A month later I returned stil fighting for breath and she decided to get chest ray and ECG done at the surgery. When I phoned for results she told me they were fine. Two weeks later I went to A&E in desperation where the care was superb and the tests repeated and I was diagnosed with DVT and Pulmonary Embolism. I had been walking round for months with a condition that is potentially fatal and am very fortunate not to have had a stroke or heart attack.
Have I lost faith in GPs. You bet!

 

[Adele99]

If everyone wants to start paying huge bills for private medical insurance then more people suing GPs and health boards is the way to go particularly for minor misdiagnoses. And complaints about doctors attitudes. It's far too complicated a subject to even contemplate. It would frighten the life out of me being a doctor responsible for people's health and correct diagnosis, particularly if the slightest thing resulted in a lawsuit. Should we also start using vets when they get things wrong in diagnosing our pets?

I've had experience of misdiagnoses and my last spell in hospital a few months ago was like a comedy of errors, however overall I still think the NHS is probably the best value health service in the world. No system is perfect, not in health, in law or in any subject.

 

[FatGenes999]

If everyone wants to start paying huge bills for private medical insurance then more people suing GPs and health boards is the way to go particularly for minor misdiagnoses. And complaints about doctors attitudes. It's far too complicated a subject to even contemplate. It would frighten the life out of me being a doctor responsible for people's health and correct diagnosis, particularly if the slightest thing resulted in a lawsuit. Should we also start using vets when they get things wrong in diagnosing our pets?

I've had experience of misdiagnoses and my last spell in hospital a few months ago was like a comedy of errors, however overall I still think the NHS is probably the best value health service in the world. No system is perfect, not in health, in law or in any subject.

A medical professional's positive and genuinely concerned attitude is often the precursor to healing, and can precipitate such, as far as I'm concerned. Having to demand that they at least show respect, empathy and concern -- even superficially---- is very stressful while one is ill. If medical professionals automatically do this, then the patients do not have to suffer the unnecessary stress of reminding them.

Regarding misdiagnosis, and your reference to your own misdiagnosis, while you were a patient --- I don't find anything amusing about any misdiagnosis on any level, for any reason, for. anyone. If you choose to find your own personal misdiagnosis comical, then so be it; however, I hope that because you take this stand regarding your own health that you don't think it is appropriate to assume that everyone else should have the same reaction.

Also, your light-hearted attitude towards hurting patients through negligence, regardless of circumstances, makes me wonder how seriously you take your own medical professional "First Do No Harm" oath.

 

[gingecoll]

I read this blog post with some trepidation: http://www.diabetes.co.uk/blog/2014/08/should-doctors-face-harsher-sanctions-for-making Was anyone else mistreated by their doctor? I wasn't mistreated to be fair, it's just that I was passed from pillar to post and the healthcare team weren't even sure what was going on!!!

Several months before diagnosis I kept going to my doctor with blurred vision. He said it was a sight problem, I questioned why my vision when I got up in the morning was perfect, but he insisted I see an optician. My eye test came back as perfect 20/20 vision. I could even read the smallest print visible to the human eye! I went back to the doctor and he put it down to stress.
Next came the overwhelming tiredness, still he said stress.
A few months later I started losing weight and getting worried, I think your depressed he said, we often start imagining problems when depressed.
It wasn't until I went back 4 weeks later, 20kg lighter, peeing for England and constantly drinking water that I insisted a blood test and I wasn't leaving without one! He said he'd do it and I'd get the results in a few days. Not good enough , I'm an old man trapped in a young man's body, I need it quicker. He sent me down to the hospital with the blood test bag, they took the blood and I went home.
That evening a doctor's car and an ambulance pulled up outside my house, ooh somebody isn't well I said to my missus. Then they came down my path, asked my name and if I'd had a blood test to which I said yes. We need to get you to hospital immediately, you have blood sugar levels at 43, you have diabetes James, your blood indicates ketoic acidosis too which is a medical emergency he said.
The next morning in hospital the consultant said another 48 hrs and I don't think you'd be sat here, you were lucky!

 

[Adele99]

A medical professional's positive and genuinely concerned attitude is often the precursor to healing, and can precipitate such, as far as I'm concerned. Having to demand that they at least show respect, empathy and concern -- even superficially---- is very stressful while one is ill. If medical professionals automatically do this, then the patients do not have to suffer the unnecessary stress of reminding them.

Regarding misdiagnosis, and your reference to your own misdiagnosis, while you were a patient --- I don't find anything amusing about any misdiagnosis on any level, for any reason, for. anyone. If you choose to find your own personal misdiagnosis comical, then so be it; however, I hope that because you take this stand regarding your own health that you don't think it is appropriate to assume that everyone else should have the same reaction.

Also, your light-hearted attitude towards hurting patients through negligence, regardless of circumstances, makes me wonder how seriously you take your own medical professional "First Do No Harm" oath.

Suggest you calm your jets, take a deep breath and read the post again. I said minor misdiagnosis, and don't forget many conditions present with the same symptoms, so a GP can think it might be one thing, and suggest this, which is then ruled out by tests, or the patient may return with more pronounced or specific symptoms or just give info not previously mentioned , at which point the GP may diagnose correctly or move to next level of tests.So misdiagnoses are a part of life but you seem to think they should be unheard of. Medical science has a lot to learn , the human body is an truly amazing and complicated thing which will take hundreds of years yet to fully understand.

GS also have to put up with patients coming and asking for advice which their patients still blatantly ignore, then return with same unresolved problem . They also have to deal with patients with serious attitude problems on a daily basis, . Doctors are only human and can have 'off' days or become disinterested sometimes with patients.

As for my light hearted attitude ,to wards hurting other patients can only assume you've got carried away with yourself or are hallucinating, as nowhere did I state this. Certainly I did comment my last stay in hospital was like a comedy of errors, but I didn't explain why , you've chosen to imagine it could have related to something serious. .Time to lighten up, and develop a sense of reality. As I said I feel for overall value the NHS offers the best service in the world.

 

[CollieBoy]

To a certain respect , it comes down to respect for your patient and the little germ of humility necessary to being trustworthy, that you can say to yourself (and the patient!) "I've looked at your case again, and a better course of action would be ..."
If a HCP said that to me, I would probably think no less (and probably a lot more!) of him than if he merely "fudged things"

 

[Jaylee]

To a certain respect , it comes down to respect for your patient and the little germ of humility necessary to being trustworthy, that you can say to yourself (and the patient!) "I've looked at your case again, and a better course of action would be ..."
If a HCP said that to me, I would probably think no less (and probably a lot more!) of him than if he merely "fudged things"

A few years ago i was waiting to see my GP.. In fact i was due up next.
In the waiting room this rough looking guy came in with his mate, took a seat & within 2 minutes of sitting down, stood back up after a loud outburst, then started kicking off!!
This guy continued to throw this "tantrum" to the point it was upsetting other waiting patients. some of which elderly.
Reception must have been appalled by this behaviour too. The door opened & my GP stepped in to calm the fellow down.
After a beef discussion with this belligerent man, my GP looked round at me as if to say "sorry mate". Then they disappeared out the back.
When i was finally called in my Doc looked riled & a little flustered. "How are you ?" i asked. He replied with a look as if to say i could have done without that!
Don't worry said i,.. got a nice easy one for you..! which at least cracked a smile...

Doctors are human at the end of the day.. You never know what's happening "back stage"..
If a misdiagnosis had occurred as a result of that particular visit? I would have been more inclined to blame the actions of the cue jumping "junkie"...

 

[FatGenes999]

Suggest you calm your jets, take a deep breath and read the post again. I said minor misdiagnosis, and don't forget many conditions present with the same symptoms, so a GP can think it might be one thing, and suggest this, which is then ruled out by tests, or the patient may return with more pronounced or specific symptoms or just give info not previously mentioned , at which point the GP may diagnose correctly or move to next level of tests.So misdiagnoses are a part of life but you seem to think they should be unheard of. Medical science has a lot to learn , the human body is an truly amazing and complicated thing which will take hundreds of years yet to fully understand.

GS also have to put up with patients coming and asking for advice which their patients still blatantly ignore, then return with same unresolved problem . They also have to deal with patients with serious attitude problems on a daily basis, . Doctors are only human and can have 'off' days or become disinterested sometimes with patients.

As for my light hearted attitude ,to wards hurting other patients can only assume you've got carried away with yourself or are hallucinating, as nowhere did I state this. Certainly I did comment my last stay in hospital was like a comedy of errors, but I didn't explain why , you've chosen to imagine it could have related to something serious. .Time to lighten up, and develop a sense of reality. As I said I feel for overall value the NHS offers the best service in the world.

Thanks for sharing your opinions with me.

To return to the main topic, this thread wouldn't have materialized had there not been wide-spread experience with patient displeasure of the medical profession. It is a topic on this forum (a lot, in fact) because it is a subject that touches all of our lives, 24/7.

Patient displeasure of the medical profession is an issue, for many, many reasons, and it has been for a very long time, and globally. My forthright complaints are representative of the rule, not the exception. Furthermore, I often see more "explanations" for why the medical profession doesn't live up to it's self-created importance than I see sincere attempts to teach patients to be totally responsible for their own health.

I look forward to the day when people take self-care seriously so that medical professionals will be necessary only in emergency situations and for monitoring basic functions. I try very hard to take care of my health and I try to encourage others to do the same, both on-line and in real life. When I was a new member on here I had said that I observed far too much dependency on the medical profession. It's as though people think that they are not responsible for their own health.

The more that people do the work, the research, the proper actions to take care of their health the less the medical profession will be depended upon. This is especially true with diabetes, as many of us have learned. That is as it should be because we are all ultimately responsible for our own health.
The medical profession has done a very good job of promoting self-aggrandizing hype to make non-professionals think that we should be dependent on them for anything and everything concerning our health.The truth is we should be, and more importantly, could be , dependent on the medical profession for less than 1/3 of the treatments than what we are now, if it is appropriate to use a quantitative measuring stick.

 

[phoenix]

Mistakes happen and need to be investigated but people also need to be able to learn from them. That's hard to do if a system of blame leads people to hide rather than report errors.
When errors have occurred then obviously steps need to be taken (review of procedures, training, counselling and indeed warnings if procedures have been known but not followed.)
Obviously if errors are caused by drink, drugs or even worse the 'mistake' was through fraudulent of malevolent intent then the individual needs to be dealt with (and of course there are frequent hearings of such cases by the GMC and other professional bodies)

If you are a doctor and there is a culture of blame then surely the immediate response to a mistake will be to be defensive. It is likely to lead to cover-ups and to a lack of openness and honesty and even downright deception.
Who wins in a blame culture ? Not future patients ,the chance to learn from mistakes will have been missed. Not the person who may have been hurt by the error as it becomes harder to find they truth and they may have to go through a long period of claim and counterclaim, causing more stress.. In cases that go to court then everyone loses, time and money has to be diverted to long and costly adversarial battles in court (in the article linked below it says that litigation costs in the UK are estimated to comprise 50-66% of settlements.


As to compensation, no fault compensation systems exist in several countries and have done for many years. New Zealand (since 1972), Sweden (1975), Finland (1987 Norway (1988), Denmark (1992) and France (1994). I got the figures from this brief article arguing for a no fault system in Australia.
https://www.mja.com.au/journal/2012/197/5/no-fault-compensation-system-medical-injury-long-overdue


I also think some doctors ought to be held responsible for fraud but that is a different matter entirely.

.edited for clarity (cut repeated phrase)

 

[Scardoc]

Thanks for sharing your opinions with me.

To return to the main topic, this thread wouldn't have materialized had there not been wide-spread experience with patient displeasure of the medical profession. It is a topic on this forum (a lot, in fact) because it is a subject that touches all of our lives, 24/7.

Patient displeasure of the medical profession is an issue, for many, many reasons, and it has been for a very long time, and globally. My forthright complaints are representative of the rule, not the exception. Furthermore, I often see more "explanations" for why the medical profession doesn't live up to it's self-created importance than I see sincere attempts to teach patients to be totally responsible for their own health.

I look forward to the day when people take self-care seriously so that medical professionals will be necessary only in emergency situations and for monitoring basic functions. I try very hard to take care of my health and I try to encourage others to do the same, both on-line and in real life. When I was a new member on here I had said that I observed far too much dependency on the medical profession. It's as though people think that they are not responsible for their own health.

The more that people do the work, the research, the proper actions to take care of their health the less the medical profession will be depended upon. This is especially true with diabetes, as many of us have learned. That is as it should be because we are all ultimately responsible for our own health.
The medical profession has done a very good job of promoting self-aggrandizing hype to make non-professionals think that we should be dependent on them for anything and everything concerning our health.The truth is we should be, and more importantly, could be , dependent on the medical profession for less than 1/3 of the treatments than what we are now, if it is appropriate to use a quantitative measuring stick.

But what percentage of people are unhappy? The last stat I saw was for hospitalised diabetics and 86% were happy with their treatment.

I am 100% willing and committed to treating my diabetes as I can manage it with the help and support of my GP and diabetes care team. Was I too dependent on my GP for the diagnosis? Hell no, I didn't even know what diabetes was when I was diagnosed. Are people too dependent on other public services? The police? Fire brigade? Of course not, that's why these services exist. "If everyone" did this and that then the World would be a wonderful place.