results after 6 months

Congratulations, Roy - you must be well pleased with yourself - and rightly so.

I doubt if I could endure a vegan diet, but congrats to you for being so dedicated to your health :clap: :thumbup:

Excellent results Roy, very well done!!

Well done izzi, what are you eating by the way?

Well done, mate.

Your cholesterol figures look fine.
A total/HDL of 2.6 (lower than 3 is great)
A trigs/HDL of 0.8 (lower than 1 is great)

The good news stories keep on rolling in.
And I thought veganism was a disease :lol: (joke everybody)

Geoff

Shu-perb results Roy

Well done

Mary

Very nice results Roy. I haven't been following your diet so you have perhaps discussed this before... If so, I am sorry for asking again. I am approaching my glucose management with a no grain, no sugar, no starch approach which seems to be quite effective at controlling my levels but even with the ability to access the calories of the full range of meats and most all fats, I find it hard sometimes to eat enough in a day to maintain body weight. The ability to loose weight was effortless and amazing but maintenance requires some attention. My question to you is... 1) are you loosing weight or in a weight stable mode and how do you get sufficient calories on a vegan diet without including foods that spike your sugar levels?


Thanks
Kenny :thumbup:

Wow Roy! Thats a HbA1c of 5.1% in old money.

How are you finding the diet? You've been on it for 6 months now, so it sounds like it's easy to sustain. Are you going to stay on it indefinitely?

I recently read a great book about one of the world's greatest endurance runners, Scott Jurek, who is a strict vegan. Even though we are at opposite ends of the meat and grain spectrum, I think that vegans and paeloers have a great deal in common in terms of our focus on good quality whole foods.

Very impressed! Keep it up.

izzzi said:

Hi borofergie

The diet is not that difficult, however reading your threads does make me rethink my total views regarding good fat.
It is unbelievable that this forum is the only guide I have regarding control. The NHS have been so nice to me yet they don't seem to have any idea what's going on with Diabetes.

I was treating this diet as a kind of detox, Oddly enough I am getting used to it.

I will moderate my diet slightly then get next test in 3 months.

Roy.

Click to expand...

Roy ... those figures are absolutely fantabulous!!! Congratulations!!! You must be so chuffed with yourself. Have you only been diagnosed 6 months? I think you're right, the NHS are befuddled about dietary advice for diabetics and judging by my DN's reaction at my first review this week, I think she was actually RELIEVED that I'd gone away and found information and support from the forum because she couldn't hide the big grin on her face. She was very positive about it and about my low carbing too. When I was diagnosed she gave me no verbal dietary advice at all, just gave me a book. I now think her silence could possibly have been a way of saying "I have to give you NHS dietary advice, so here's the book but feel free to look elsewhere'.

If I've read your posts here correctly, you've been living on wholemeal products, veggies, fruit and decaff coffee but no meat, eggs, fish etc? Well that does sound like a crazy diet - but hey! Crazy can and does often work and it obviously has in your case.
I'm all for having a go at whatever works for each individual.

I'm interested in how you've found your energy levels while you've been eating this way? The reason I'm asking is because whenever I've tried to eat a vegetarian but not vegan diet, I just wilt from lack of protein. I really seem to need that animal protein in my diet so I'm in awe of vegans and vegetarians who manage on veggies and carbs and still maintain good energy levels.

From the simple list of foods you gave in one of your posts, the only thing I'd be able to eat on that would be the veggies as everything else makes me spike quite a bit. But I'm really interested to know whether you also spiked at first but found it levelled off as your body got used to the diet because I think diabetes is affected not so much by WHAT we eat, but the COMBINATIONS of what we eat, which is why we all have such varied reactions to certain foods. Whilst I've maintained good control in 3 months on the LCHF I know it's by no means the ONLY way to gain control and nor is it suitable for everyone, it just happened to suit me where BG levels are concerned but I haven't been as successful as some people with the weight loss benefits of LCHF.

The priority for us all at first has to be lowering BS in whatever way we can - anything else is a bonus I think. Well done Roy, I'm chuffed for you. Normal BG level is a brilliant way to end the year isn't it? :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

Great result Roy. Couldn't have a better set of figures.

GraceK said:

If I've read your posts here correctly, you've been living on wholemeal products, veggies, fruit and decaff coffee but no meat, eggs, fish etc? Well that does sound like a crazy diet - but hey! Crazy can and does often work and it obviously has in your case.
I'm all for having a go at whatever works for each individual.

Click to expand...

But there is an underlying principle here. Without even thinking about carbs and fat and protein and calories, if you eat a whole food diet, most of this stuff takes care of itself. I'm fairly sure that the western diet of "processed carbs and fats" is what is underlying the diabetes epidemic. If all of us ate like our great grandparents ate, then many of us would not have diabetes in the first place.

I can understand the no meat / fat / oil thing, but I have to agree with Grace - the decaff coffee thing is the work of a crazy man!

borofergie said:

GraceK said:

If I've read your posts here correctly, you've been living on wholemeal products, veggies, fruit and decaff coffee but no meat, eggs, fish etc? Well that does sound like a crazy diet - but hey! Crazy can and does often work and it obviously has in your case.
I'm all for having a go at whatever works for each individual.

Click to expand...

But there is an underlying principle here. Without even thinking about carbs and fat and protein and calories, if you eat a whole food diet, most of this stuff takes care of itself. I'm fairly sure that the western diet of "processed carbs and fats" is what is underlying the diabetes epidemic. If all of us ate like our great grandparents ate, then many of us would not have diabetes in the first place.

I can understand the no meat / fat / oil thing, but I have to agree with Grace - the decaff coffee thing is the work of a crazy man!

Click to expand...

:shock: I like crazy. I have decaff on my shopping list alongside mega dose Vit D3 pills and it's all YOUR fault boro!!! But the wholemeal carbs will still have to stay off my list for the foreseeable future. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

GraceK said:

From the simple list of foods you gave in one of your posts, the only thing I'd be able to eat on that would be the veggies as everything else makes me spike quite a bit. But I'm really interested to know whether you also spiked at first but found it levelled off as your body got used to the diet because I think diabetes is affected not so much by WHAT we eat, but the COMBINATIONS of what we eat, which is why we all have such varied reactions to certain foods.

Click to expand...

This interests me also, Roy. It would seem that several on here create a diet plan that includes a lot of whole grains and root vegetables that would, with respect to my lower carb, high fat diet, through my numbers into the stratosphere. I wonder, as Grace asked, if when you started, you found that some of the foods you now eat were problematic to begin with and over time they moderated?

With respect to your 'not counting calories' response to me.... I am a little confused. On my diet, I find that I have to consciously will myself to eat or I will continue to loose weight. I therefore have to find calories within what my meter will allow. So, while not meaning to be obtuse.... How do you 'maintain' weight without watching the amount of food that you eat or don't eat in a day?

Thanks
Kenny :thumbup:

borofergie said:

But there is an underlying principle here. Without even thinking about carbs and fat and protein and calories, if you eat a whole food diet, most of this stuff takes care of itself. I'm fairly sure that the western diet of "processed carbs and fats" is what is underlying the diabetes epidemic. If all of us ate like our great grandparents ate, then many of us would not have diabetes in the first place.

Click to expand...

I agree 100% with your premise that the western diet is the causation of not only diabetes by many other immune and endocrine disorders but I am having a hard time understanding how this applies 'after' your functional systems are broken. As I asked Roy.... was his tolerance to things such as grains and fruits, poor to begin with and moderated as he persisted. If this is the case then their is a healing process that will allow, in time, the ability to eat a normal diet. The problem here is that it hints at a 'cure' and worse yet, it implys that the NHS diet is correct???? I certainly have no heartburn with anything that works for individuals but I do try to understand the implications of their decisions.... might set me on a new path but I must get my head around it first.

Kenny

Well done.
You're certainly not the first person I've read about that has done well on a vegan or vegetarian diet.
It's certainly not a crazy diet in anyway. Just hard for people who have been brought up to think of meat as an essential part of the diet. (personally, I would find it hard and almost impossible to do in France unless I only ate at home!)
In India a lot of people eat lacto/vegetarian or vegan diets so naturally any diabetic diet there has to respect that . There's a certainly evidence from there that high fibre, traditional diets work well.


Stephen

Without even thinking about carbs and fat and protein and calories, if you eat a whole food diet, most of this stuff takes care of itself. I'm fairly sure that the western diet of "processed carbs and fats" is what is underlying the diabetes epidemic........

Click to expand...

Agree with the first bit Stephen not so certain about the next sentence. I think it would depend on who your recent ancestors were.( In my family, If they hadn't died in childbirth most of the women died around menopausal age and one GGGGF died in the workhouse 'of exhaustion.' doubt their diet was adequate in any respect)
On the other hand , there was supposed to be a diabetes epidemic in the 18th century, certainly amongst the rich; we don't know about the poor, they didn't have doctors.(Bach and some of the other composers may have had it) Some people even claim Henry VIII D.

phoenix said:

Stephen

Without even thinking about carbs and fat and protein and calories, if you eat a whole food diet, most of this stuff takes care of itself. I'm fairly sure that the western diet of "processed carbs and fats" is what is underlying the diabetes epidemic........

Click to expand...

Agree with the first bit Stephen not so certain about the next sentence. I think it would depend on who your recent ancestors were.( In my family, If they hadn't died in childbirth most of the women died around menopausal age and one GGGGF died in the workhouse 'of exhaustion.' doubt their diet was adequate in any respect)
On the other hand , there was supposed to be a diabetes epidemic in the 18th century, certainly amongst the rich; we don't know about the poor, they didn't have doctors.(Bach and some of the other composers may have had it) Some people even claim Henry VIII D.

Click to expand...

However we must consider the fact that children and teenagers other than those with severe auto immune responses leading to Type 1 diabetes, have never before in history been part of the Type2 landscape.

Kenny

KennyS said:

I agree 100% with your premise that the western diet is the causation of not only diabetes by many other immune and endocrine disorders but I am having a hard time understanding how this applies 'after' your functional systems are broken. As I asked Roy.... was his tolerance to things such as grains and fruits, poor to begin with and moderated as he persisted. If this is the case then their is a healing process that will allow, in time, the ability to eat a normal diet. The problem here is that it hints at a 'cure' and worse yet, it implys that the NHS diet is correct???? I certainly have no heartburn with anything that works for individuals but I do try to understand the implications of their decisions.... might set me on a new path but I must get my head around it first.

Click to expand...

I think that what Roy is eating is about as fat from the NHS diet as what I eat (but in the opposite direction).

I don't know about the exact details of Roy's diet, but I bet his intake of refined carbohydrates is quite low. Although I tend to avoid them, fruits and tubers are much better sources of carbohydrate than flour and sugar. I don't know for sure, but I'd bet that Roy's food intake is a good example of a low-GI diet.

Just because low-carb works, it doesn't mean that it's the only metabolic regime that can be successful. Because he eats hardly any fat, and only small amounts of protein, it's also feasible that his body has adapted to burning carbohydrates more efficiently (in a similar way to a low-carber like me becomes "fat-adapted").

If you think that obesity is a disease of insulin deregulation, then you have to accept that most serious vegetarians are skinny, despite eating high carb diets. I know of several people that have done well on raw vegan diets. For extreme examples have a look at the http://www.30bananasaday.com/ website.